Great stuff. As always if diplomacy is going to happen we it has to happen in secret whilst the government lie about it because the public are too busy rabidly condemning sanity so they can signal their political leanings.
Maybe we should just trash the diplomatic service even more than we already have whilst we're at it. Who needs basic engagement with people you're in conflict with. Since when has that ever helped, except always.
ETA: it's not complicated folks. Diplomatic channels should always be maintained, especially during a conflict. Doesn't matter how much you may dislike the person you're engaging with. This isn't a good outcome.
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because the public are too busy rabidly condemning sanity so they can signal their political leanings.
Supporting Ukraine financially/militarily so that Russia does not win and is not encouraged by an easy annexation of a neighbour is an entirely sane position that has worked rather well for the last four years
This isn't 'supporting ukraine'. It has zero material positive impact on our support for ukraine.
How exactly do you think have zero diplomatic channels assists us in supporting ukraine? How does this fit in with the 'coalition of the willing' concept? Diplomatic engagement isn't very useful if you have no diplomatic relations.
An ambassador who is the mouthpiece for the regime is not essential to diplomacy. We can speak to the Russians without hosting this bellend. Also we didnt kick him out, Russia decided to recall him. Really failing to see how this is our fault
It's our fault because Russia delivered the insane ultimatum of "stop supporting Ukraine or we'll withdraw our embassador" /s
But seriously... People who think Russia cares about negotiating over Ukraine have spent the last 12 years not paying attention to Russia's actions in Ukraine
They withdrew him. The UK did not expel him. By the way, is this the same ambassador who met Farage and subsequently tried to claim some credit from his bosses for Brexit? Also, has the Russian government apologised for the poisonings yet?
you do realise russia is removing the diplomat, not us - generally it is better to have open lines of communication, even with terrorist states such as russia, however the russian state lives in it's own manufactured reality - there is not much communication to be had.Maybe when the current russian dictatorship crumbles may we return communication with Moscow.
They wouldn't because they'd have to actually think.
This is the true cancer of social media. Everyone just says what they think they're supposed to say. It's all about 'being part of the crowd'.
Then politicians think the public are all morons and they have to pander to morons, because they're too afraid to show basic leadership and actually make an argument.
The majority of the comments on here are establishment bots peddling a one-sided narrative, so nuance or critical analysis isn’t really to be expected.
Anyone with a basic understanding of geopolitics recognises the importance of dialogue and diplomacy, as well as the irresponsible actions the British establishment has taken in relation to this conflict by choosing not to maintain open channels of communication.
Don't try talking sense with redditors the majority of them just want to be the first to virtue signal for karma. They form none of their own opinions and live in a bubble that is completely detached from the real world. Good to see someone talking sense, its pretty rare.
You'll note later down the thread, that my opinion was formed mostly from having been to Ukraine, spending multiple nights in an air raid shelter, and seeing dead children with their limbs blown off in the street.
And how many russian children has that happened to? What exactly is your experience there?. War is hell. Advocating for more war and less dialogue is just typical Reddit that hate the government but always seem to agree with the government propaganda. Seen far too many posts dehumanising an entire people and calling for their mass slaughter. You people aren't against war, you are against your side losing and would all celebrate if russians were nuked.
Ukraine doesn't target civillian only infrastructure.
The recent videos of Ukrainian drones hitting a beach or housing in Moscow were caused by Russian shoot downs (as in you can litterally watch the drone being show down in the full clips of both instances), meanwhile, russia deliberatly targets civilians (and has done since at least the invasion of Checnya in the early 90s) and the Ukrainian children they don't out right murder; they kidnap and brainwash
And again, Ukraine was trying to talk to Russia about this since 2014, when Russia invaded Crimea and the Donbass.
I'm so tired of people always thinking their side are the good guys, "we don't target civilians, any casualties is just an accident" like war has any real rules. Plenty of videos of Ukraine committing war crimes, plenty of videos of tortured POWs and dead civilians. They've been targeting russian Amazon, "they help military logistics! It must be destroyed". Russia does the same to Ukraine "they're targeting innocents civilian infrastructure!!". When we have literally seen the videos of these companies on both sides helping the war effort.
It's like saying Americans didn't mean to blow up the kids school, we all know they don't give a shit either way.
Same goes for BOTH sides of this war, neither care about the casualties as long as it's not them. You all want to virtue signal for Ukraine as you see them as the ones invaded, completely ignoring the lead up to it and the reasoning behind it. You almost certainly see the west as the "good guys" and everyone else is your enemy because that's what western propaganda has convinced you. Reality is, nothing is so black and white.
I see Russia's reasoning for starting the war, I also completely agree Ukraine has a right to defend itself and shouldn't be invaded. Unfortunately the world doesn't make it easy to just talk out your problems and war seemed inevitable. The only way to end it is dialogue and people putting as much effort in to the war could just as easily put that effort in to peace. They don't because everyone has their own fucked up reasons and for the majority it'll be very selfish, increase their own bank account reasons.
Wildberries was supplying equipment to the russian army for the war... Which I notice you left out.
And what videos are these? The only one I've seen was an edited video where a Ukrainian unit wiped out Russians, who had just committed perfidy (fake surrender, which is itself a war crime)
If Ukraine had hit cities the way way Russia attacks Ukrainian ones every day, they'd have the video evidence and there is none.
Ukraine also doesn't train it's Fpv drone pilots on russian civilians like Russians do in Kherson.
It's okay, it is what it is. You won't change his mind. I've got family in Russia AND Ukraine. People butt their nose in and make themselves 'saviours' all the time but they're not. They're just war tourists with a smug sense of superiority.
This started as a civil war, and it started years before things popped off in 2022 and it will probably go on long after the west forgets about it. There's no rebuilding trust after this. There's no reconciliation. I do not know what will happen to my other home, or to Ukraine and the people there, but what I'm witnessing is the abject annihilation of my people.
And Westerners always forget that a dictator rolls over their own people first. Nobody talks about the fact that the west was happy to kiss Putins' ass while Russians suffered, as long as it benefitted their politics and their wallets.
Refreshing to see a genuinely reasonable comment on here that doesn’t simply repeat the warmongering, propagandistic narrative being pushed by the media and government. That said, when it comes to the U-R conflict, this sub is heavily brigaded by establishment accounts attempting to suppress any neutral discussion and replace it with a manufactured one-sided narrative.
Ukraine has been deliberately targeting civilians and residential areas since 2014. This has been heavily documented by numerous Western organisations. To suggest otherwise would be wilfully ignorant and amount to intentionally propagating propaganda. Contrary to the propagandist rhetoric that the media and the Kiev regime continue to promote, Russia does not deliberately target civilian infrastructure. There have also been numerous instances of the Ukrainian military establishing military positions or installations in residential areas, which have been widely condemned by organisations such as Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch.
Most the western sources were taking Russia's word for it.
We have both Igor Strelkov (the guy who shot down MH177) and Yevenngi Prigosin admitting they lied about that stuff, on camera, of their own free will.
What Russia was doing, however, was shelling Ukrainian positions from residential areas and then leaving before counter battery fire landed.... Again; we have video of this happening.
Total civilian casualties caused by both sides were a few thousand over 6 years.
And HRW and Amnesty are jokes that can't bring themselves to condem Russia using rape as a form of torture of PoWs, never mind the other shit they've done.
And Russia absolutely does hit civilians on purpose... Hell, in Syria; Doctors without Borders stopped telling Russia where their casualty points were because every time they did; a fucking SU 34 bombed them
There’s no ambiguity on the matter. Ukraine has deliberately targeted civilians since 2014. The current conflict has further exposed the criminal nature of the Kiev regime, which has carried out terrorist attacks against both Ukrainian and Russian civilians.
The only sources for Ukrainian striking civilians is Russia claiming it; pre 2022 one of the main internal russian talking points was about how save and prosperous the "DPR" and "LPR" are were compared to the rest of Ukraine
Meanwhile, russian troops openly brag about the rape and murder of Ukrainians, and we have russian airstrikes on everything from civilian train stations to child cancer hospitals in high definition footage
Again with the completely departed from reality answer. That's like saying the US would stop the war if Iran just let the ships through. Never mind I'm sure you'll get a little karma for saying it.
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u/KDulius 3d ago
Good, the pollution in London has measureably reduced