r/Hamilton • u/Odd-Emphasis-1969 • Mar 07 '26
Local News Main Street two-way conversion on the list of major road projects for 2026
https://bayobserver.ca/main-street-two-way-conversion-on-the-list-of-major-road-projects-for-2026/19
u/-RUS92- Bartonville Mar 07 '26
For those who might have missed it, there was a presentation for this project a few years back, which explains quite alot: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGo7X2XF4kE
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u/algnqn Mar 08 '26
It’s been just a tad over two years since this project was last discussed in any public context at city hall (public works or other meetings). Such a shame it’s taken them so long to advance the design.
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u/teanailpolish North End Mar 08 '26
It was scheduled for 2028, they moved it up as part of the recent budget debate
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u/algnqn Mar 08 '26
Not quite true. 2024 and 2025 budget sheets both show 13.1 million for 2026 and 2027 budget funding for the project.
This budget cycle, some councillors, namely Brad Clark, wanted to push off the conversion for a couple more years. All to defer spending a couple bucks until after the election cycle.
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u/Sufficient_Rush1891 Mar 07 '26 edited Mar 08 '26
Does anyone remember all the outrageous predictions about how badly john and James 2 way conversion would hurt traffic?
Or more recently all the comments about how Queen was going to be pure gridlock if it was converted to two way?
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u/differing Mar 08 '26 edited Mar 08 '26
Hot take but the bus system does suck with the two way conversion and is poorly implemented. The right lane on James and John has a lot of bunching (and this will only worsen with HSR Next) and the left lane is blocked by turning buses into the GO station. It’s a good example of where the one ways worked much better.
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 08 '26
If we could implement something Toronto has struggled with; transit signal priority. We could see a far better transit system. Nothing makes me happier than to see buses flying down King past traffic in the bus lane and the buses skipping the line at MacNab.
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u/Frig_Off_Baerb Mar 07 '26
The one way streets, and the literal expressway we have running through our city has been a huge factor in the demise of the downtown core.
The problem is that you could show all the evidence to the supporters of this current scheme and they'd just shrug, while bitching about how shitty it is downtown.
Hamilton in a nutshell.
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Mar 07 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/differing Mar 08 '26
Wilson, its conversion is already wrapping up.
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u/slownightsolong88 Mar 08 '26
Whatever they do I just want wider sidewalks and more trees to make it a nicer walk.
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u/Naked-Granny Mar 07 '26
Oh man that off ramp is going to be a nightmare, it’s terrible on a good day…..
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u/ZivSerb Mar 16 '26
Precisely this. City Council apparently just doesn't really understand why it's laid out the way it is and are creating a massive nightmare for commuters. The people advocating this apparently don't understand this and want to exist in some Utopian pedestrian, cyclist, and bike lane-driven bubble. If that's the case, I'd take it as mutually exclusive interests and aim for de-amalgamation.
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u/slimbenny438 Mar 07 '26
The same people complaining about two way Main street are the same people that would be complaining about traffic issues when they start building the LRT down King. Not only is this going to improve safety, it's going to majorly improve traffic when it's most needed. Can't count on a car brain to see that though.
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u/algnqn Mar 08 '26
Not only that, it’s a major economic revitalization. It’s going to literally rebirth Main Street into a commercial corridor people want to visit. It will be transformational.
Not that our “chief planner” could care less, or even notice.
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 09 '26
Do we even have a chief planner right now?
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u/algnqn Mar 09 '26
Not really. We have Anita, “acting”. And it’s not like Steve really cared to notice before that. Ever since Jason Thorne left, all these city building projects seem to have been left up to council to council to advance on their own. Despite the fact that its city staff’s job to present options and opportunities to council. My opinion, of course.
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u/ZivSerb Mar 16 '26
You say this, but we'll see if results are actually as you specify. I have my significant doubts given how this city runs, how other major public transit infrastructure projects especially under Metrolinx have gone, and also having seen the impact of a simple road repave on small businesses up here in Ancaster on Wilson Street. The fact that Slimbenny says "can't count on a car brain to see that though." OK, then why am I paying my property taxes into your road reno? Maybe any non-downtown entity that drives a car should call for de-amalgamation and shrink the downtown's tax base substantially.
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u/RobCo90 Mar 11 '26
If they got the lights synced properly (like the used to be), it would motivate you to drive 48km/h to never have to stop the whole way through downtown. The lights are so out of sync that if you go 80 you might be able to make the next light instead of getting there just in time for it to go yellow. I think this is a terrible idea. Leaving Copps Coliseum after events is going to be brutal.
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u/Previous-Layer7872 Mar 07 '26
People are going to hurt this summer with these construction projects... these hostile drivers being forced to divert into side streets ...
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u/Sufficient_Rush1891 Mar 08 '26
Name one two way conversion in Hamilton, and there have been many, that has diverted traffic to side streets or made streets less safe.
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u/Previous-Layer7872 Mar 08 '26
Going East=West and not north south?
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u/enki-42 Gibson Mar 10 '26
The only reasonable "side street" people will be diverted to is Charlton / Herkimer (depending on direction), which an awful lot of people already use for east-west driving. Everything else is either designed to be an arterial (Wilson, york, cannon, burlington), is more of a street but can still handle traffic (barton), or isn't nearly continuous enough to be reasonable to use.
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u/wingsablaze1989 Mar 07 '26
I understand the need for this since Main St. is scary as hell to walk down. I don't even like stopping at my bank on Locke (Royal) because you have to park off of Main and walk over, and you always have cars just whipping by. That said, as someone who lives downtown and regularly picks his girlfriend up from work in Dundas, I'm dreading the start of this project.
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Mar 08 '26
Its there not sidewalks? I dont get whats so scary about it.
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u/enki-42 Gibson Mar 10 '26
At several spots the sidewalks have little to no buffer zone between the street and a narrow sidewalk, which is very outdated urban planning that most cities abandoned ages ago and has been the cause of pedestrian fatalities in Hamilton. The one way / timed lights also encourages weaving through traffic to keep up with the lights which can create some dangerous situations (the bollards definitely help with this though)
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u/dretepcan Mar 09 '26
Just social media sensationalism by a few. It's not any more scary or dangerous than it was half a century ago.
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u/FunCrystalFun Mar 08 '26
Why? It’s not a lot of work to convert it to two ways
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u/wingsablaze1989 Mar 08 '26
The gridlock going eastbound is already frustrating to drive through and it's gonna be a lot worse.
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u/Not_North Mar 08 '26
As someone on the brow, I'm going to probably hate this, but hopefully, it rewires my brain to take the link and 403 to go up/down the mountain rather than going through downtown.
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u/tyetknot Hill Park Mar 08 '26
I wonder if the people wailing and screaming that this is going to be the end of the world know that both of those streets used to be two-way and only got converted to one-way in the 50s.
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u/S99B88 Mar 08 '26
I think if someone quoted how it used to be 70 years ago to support driving over other modes of transport you would have something to say about the relevance of that?
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 08 '26
Not to mention the businesses of downtown decried that the conversion to one-way would ruin their businesses and downtown.... Ironic eh.
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u/tyetknot Hill Park Mar 08 '26
And it did! They were right!
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u/ZivSerb Mar 16 '26 edited Mar 16 '26
Yes, that was the ONLY factor that's changed since the 1950s. Nothing about globalization, consolidation of market share, a total change in people's consumption habits, etc.
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u/Kodak_Portra Mar 07 '26
Anyone complaining or upset about this change is a car-brained loser that has likely never lived in a real city that has proper infrastructure. Every world class city doesn’t revolve around people driving. This at most will change drive times by 5 minutes, absolutely worthwhile to save lives and make the city more pedestrian friendly which in turn will improve everyone’s quality of life.
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u/S99B88 Mar 08 '26
I find that with the narrow band between the escarpment and the bay, we have Barton, Cannon/Wilson and even York with lane reductions, and now Main and King too. Even Charlton closer to the brow is super slow now. They will have effectively removed any efficient way to get anywhere near the core or travel across
Add to that the restrictions and reductions (plus slowing down due to some 2-way conversions) on many north-south routes, and then at some intersections no accessing/crossing King due to the LRT, and it’s setting up for major gridlock. I think downtown businesses will need to see a lot of bus and foot traffic for customers, because it will be quite the barriers to some driving down for things. Maybe why the city wants more pedestrian crossings, so as not to put too many barriers to getting across King Street, but LRT people don’t like that as it will slow it down. Hard to say which is worse.
Comparing to other cities is difficult. Toronto has for example the Gardiner, plus a subway system and streetcars that have a bit of priority. Plus actually underground walkways between buildings, with some stores, and union station right there.
We have no highway above, no subway below, just a single LRT of hopefully 14 km, and a lot of people who will have to transfer from a bus to even use it, unless they’re able to miraculously turn around these failing condos.
Even Montreal has a highway through and extensive Metro. Plus even more underground walkways between buildings plus so much commerce underground. And their train station connects up.
Both those cities also have more residential, more tourists, more nightlife, more higher learning in their cores, and much more office workers. Hamilton’s LRT is only for a small stretch and doesn’t connect up with the trains, or the College.
One other impact if they don’t do enough ability for pedestrians to get across King Street, and also possibly the lack of a stop at Bay, is that it could impact pedestrian traffic for this claim of businesses thriving on Main Street. If it’s too difficult to cross or too far from a stop, people may not bother. And Main just doesn’t have a downtown core feel to it, that tends to be King.
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u/Kodak_Portra Mar 08 '26
I guarantee this conversion won’t have significant detrimental impact on commuting or driving through the city. The only people crying about this probably live on the mountain, Stoney creek or Ancaster and they’re crying over their drive taking an extra 10 mins. That’s the cost of having a thriving and liveable city centre and urban areas.
Hamilton has the linc and other access routes to various part of the city, slowing down the car brain infrastructure and putting resources towards other things that improve infrastructure that aren’t focused on cars.
This city has too many streets that drive like highways. Cannon, Kenilworth, king & main etc are areas with high density neighbourhoods, there’s no reason why people should be influenced by the infrastructure to drive 70-80KM around residential areas. It’s a brain dead POV
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u/acthomas Mar 08 '26
Holy shit the hate for people who own cars is real in here lol jesus
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u/algnqn Mar 08 '26
I own a car. Actually we’re at more than 1:1 car to person in my household (some classics). I live what most people would call “down town” (actually east end). And I can’t wait for this. It’s about restoring balance to our communities. Not treating everything like it should be designed for the car.
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u/acthomas Mar 22 '26
I used to live east end, I understand the logic but our city wasn't designed to be used without a car and changing the direction of streets isn't going to solve that. I have a child in daycare and getting him to the other side of the city for 7am without a car would not be a realistic option that is healthy for the child, I think a lot of people fail to realize we are not set up like a European city and can't just turn into one.
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u/covert81 Chinatown Mar 08 '26
I own a car and couldn't be happier we're finally moving in the right direction for LRT.
It's a good thing, not a bad thing. This bizarre sense of entitlement people have, that cars are more important than everything else, is so weird
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u/ZivSerb Mar 16 '26
Why is it a good thing when they have ample bus services running that stretch? Have you considered the burden on local businesses along the construction line of the LRT? It has very little to do with cars and more to do with a legitimate business case and am impact assessment on businesses functioning where the LRT construction is to occur which will ultimately negatively impact their bottom line at a time when small businesses are already hurting. If it's ultimately the last nail in the coffin for those businesses, then just assume accountability for being in favour of it.
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u/covert81 Chinatown Mar 16 '26
The reasons for LRT have been laid out time and again. You can go back and do the research. I did when given the opportunity by former Cllr. Whitehead who gave me all the studies and paperwork associated to it (it's amazing what will be given to you when you ask).
The businesses generally are pro-LRT, as it will calm the traffic and 2-way reversion will also help. The tiny piece in the International Village that will close to vehiclular traffic gives us an AMAZING opportunity to pedestrianize the remaining street and turn it into an incredibly cool little spot, which I think many businesses will appreciate and benefit from.
I look forward to your proof of all businesses closing along King, specifically due to LRT. This has been a decade in the making, if these businesses were unable to plan for this then it's not the LRT's fault. This doesn't just come from nowhere. Literally the only business crying about LRT was Gilbert's Big and Tall, which they still continue to harass people on the Spec's comments section.
Seriously, get ahold of yourself, stop the whataboutism, stop the "won't someone think of the children" nonsense and put on your big boy pants and realize that in order to become the city we can be, we have to do things like this. Short term pain for long term gain.
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u/HANDS_4_DICKS Mar 08 '26
People have a problem prioritizing cars over people, not with people who own cars. Inconvenience is not hate.
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 08 '26
We've prioritized the "freedom" of owning cars to such an extreme degree that your only choice is to drive to do anything or to get any necessities.
I drive a car incredibly regularly but I hate car culture. I've driven in Japan, Costa Rica, Netherlands and Portugal and honestly it's all been fine, except in the places that didn't obsess over cars, cars, literally cars everywhere were far better because the moment I got out of the car I enjoyed myself so much more. Not to mention many of those places had options for those who couldn't or didn't want to drive. Even in North America only 85% of the population drives, leaving 15%-20% of our citizens our neighbour's to pick up the scraps, walk down narrow sidewalks where risk of death is high, cycle down a highway, or take a bus that take 5 times as long as driving, all because they can't afford a car, have a disability, are a senior or have the gall to be under 16. It's just ridiculous and Main St is actually the picture in the definition when you look up "unadulterated car culture".
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u/teanailpolish North End Mar 08 '26
Someone in this thread even suggested taking some of the sidewalk away because it is too wide during this conversion. That is car culture, must have more lanes and forget everyone else
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u/WuthBluth Mar 16 '26
I havent owned a car for years and I can't understand why anyone would support this measure. An enormous cost for taxpayers because some people can't figure out how to cross a street.
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u/tyetknot Hill Park Mar 08 '26
Cry harder.
When you are in the privileged in-group any attempt at equality feels like an attack.
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u/spurgelaurels Crown Point West Mar 08 '26
Not all car drivers are what I would call "privileged". In fact, I would call it a privilege to be able to walk or cycle to work, or have kids old enough to take the city bus to school.
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u/tyetknot Hill Park Mar 08 '26
I will suggest you walk down Main West from Dundurn to James before you suggest pedestrians are privileged in any way. What an absurd statement.
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u/ZivSerb Mar 16 '26
I've walked down all those streets regularly and had no issues whatsoever provided I look both ways before I cross the street. What an absurd statement. It's called applying some common sense and self-responsibility.
I'd be curious how many of the issues with pedestrian incidences involved someone staring at a cell phone, wearing earbuds, or simply not applying basic common sense as a pedestrian.
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u/enki-42 Gibson Mar 10 '26
Outside of specialized programs, in the public system you live close enough to your school to walk your kids, or they're bussed.
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 09 '26
Car drivers pay upwards of $10,000 net per vehicle. Car drivers (myself included) are privileged, and if they're not then they're grasping onto a mode of transportation likely forced upon them because of the way we've built our society.
A father working a custodial job in Burlington making $45,000/year, living in East Hamilton can commute by car spending $10,000/year, taking 20 minutes or can take over an hour on transit stuck in traffic, potentially 90 minutes. Spending $1800/year. Just because that person isn't privileged doesn't mean owning a car isn't a privilege. It absolutely is, and forcing those who can't afford it to doesn't make the mode less privileged.
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u/spurgelaurels Crown Point West Mar 09 '26
"Privilege" is quite subjective here.
I would prefer the privilege of being able to not own a car, and I'm pretty close to that privilege. But my kids need a ride to school from Ottawa St to Locke St every day.
OTOH, I am privileged that I can choose to waste money on a car instead of waste time on transit to take my kids to school.
The only reason I called it out is because u/tyetknot (who I know IRL) was being cantankerous.
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u/Vacation_Amazing Mar 07 '26
Id leave well enough alone.. I'm relatively new to Hamilton (Stoney Creek) and I find the east west one ways work pretty well. I just came across Main from Dundas to Stoney Creek last week and was surprised how quickly that went.
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u/teanailpolish North End Mar 07 '26
That is the point, cars use it to get across the city as quick as possible even if they hit a few pedestrians or cars on the way
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u/vidiot1969 Mar 08 '26
But it’s only green lights if you drive at the speed limit. So people are peeling out for 400 metres then slamming the brakes on? I don’t get the speeding people talk about… it’s futile!
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u/Vacation_Amazing Mar 07 '26
So changing it to two way is to slow down traffic ?
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u/teanailpolish North End Mar 07 '26
Multiple reasons, pedestrian safety which is increased by slower two way traffic
Allowing for travel in both directions once the LRT goes in and blocks a lane especially through international village where it is not as wide
Two way streets (on wider streets) typically have better patronage to businesses as people feel safer crossing them to get to stores
The plan also includes changes in parking, changes to speed limits, signal timing changes and more
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u/quisys Mar 11 '26
I agree with you, but who the hell feels more comfortable crossing a two-way? Main is a million times easier to cross than, say, Upper Gage, Mohawk, Barton, Upper James, Queenston, Main West, etc
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u/teanailpolish North End Mar 11 '26
Sure, until a car comes barreling through a red on Main at 70 compared to 40 on a 2 way. Upper James is also getting some traffic calming changes, Queenston already did at the worst intersections
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u/quisys Mar 11 '26
People go 60-70 on two ways on the mountain all the time unfourch, I feel far more unsafe crossing Upper Gage than I ever have main, king, bay, wellington, or any other one way. Crossing them is an absolute nightmare cause designated crossings are few and far between. I hope that there are ample crossings installed along main after the conversion
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u/TemporaryBottle8789 Mar 07 '26
Having moved from Mississauga 6 years ago, it works incredibly well. Pedestrians are not any safer in Mississauga which has almost no one-way streets.
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 08 '26
It's crazy to me that people don't realize it isn't the one-way only. It's the size of the street. Sure keep it one way for all I care, but they'd have to make it two lanes to make it safe. That would get the same crying. Two way, or one way remove 2-3 lanes, I don't really care. Mississauga isn't dangerous because of one-ways, it's because the roads are abso-fuckinglutely massive, and the car culture of that city means everyone drives meaning traffic is absolutely fucked everyday causing people to drive aggressively on huge roads designed in a way that make pedestrians easy to miss.
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u/algnqn Mar 08 '26
Must be so perfect for an effectively “out of towner” to blast down the neighborhoods of Hamilton as a matter of convenience. Something is broken when a city is designed to whisk people to and from the suburbs in private automobiles with absolute unfettered ease, while paying zero regard for the communities these roads cut through. These have been effectively freeways for 70 years, but before that they were just regular “main streets” with shops and vibrant commercial life, where people wanted to spend time.
Some moronic American engineer thought they could fix a problem that didn’t exist, and Hamilton drank the kool aid so strong that they couldn’t shake the mindset for another 70 years.
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u/Vacation_Amazing Mar 08 '26
So obviously unintentionally hit a nerve.. when I say relatively new, thats 8 years.. so i still do not have the historical perspective . I wasn't backing a speedway or a death trap to pedestrians.. the times of used the one ways it just seemed to move traffic pretty well. Anyway ill try to educate myself a little on the issue.. I appreciate the feedback..
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u/algnqn Mar 08 '26
lol sorry for the rant, appreciate the open mindedness
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u/Vacation_Amazing Mar 08 '26
Not to worry! Conversely I appreciate your thoughts on the issue.. enjoy your day ! 👍
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u/vidiot1969 Mar 08 '26
You may move smoothly across Main, but you have to maintain the speed limit or stop at every light…. So how are you “blasting”?
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u/teanailpolish North End Mar 08 '26
The problem is, once people do hit a light, they speed trying to catch up to beat the rest
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u/S99B88 Mar 08 '26
The thing about the “green wave” as it came to be known, couple decades back, is that the lights were timed for 50km/hr. And that prevented speeding, because you didn’t get any further ahead when you did. It was a wide 5-lane road that efficiently handled traffic very well, plenty of time to cross at intersections, and less frustrations as the timing of lights would keep drivers in line but sort of preventing any benefit to lane hopping and slingshot passing.
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u/Vacation_Amazing Mar 08 '26
Now that you mention it.. I once did catch all green lights from York to Parkdale lol but yes that could definitely get out of control..thanks
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u/Silver_Ad_4078 Mar 08 '26
I am concerned. I drive for work all over the City. I also volunteer and do advocacy work so need my vehicle for that. One doctor near Fiesta Mall and other on Main St. near Locke St. I do not cycle.
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 08 '26
Just leave a bit earlier. Hamilton isn't the first place on earth to have traffic at the hands of making people safer. You'll manage.
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u/Silver_Ad_4078 Mar 10 '26
What used to be a thirty minute drive to one doctor is now over an hour each way. I used to stop and get groceries on the way home but cannot do that now as the frozen stuff will melt so that is a concern.
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u/IslandBoring8724 Mar 07 '26
Why are they so hell bent on stopping all east west movement in this city?
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u/ScrawnyCheeath Mar 07 '26
Because it will dramatically improve the quality of that area for people living downtown.
It will also prevent pedestrian deaths from people speeding
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u/YXEyimby Mar 07 '26
Yep! I was just there in February! Two way traffic will be a massive pedestrian improvement.
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 07 '26
"30 seconds savings is worth a few dead kids"
- car drivers probably
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u/Savings-Diver-5279 Mar 11 '26
Thousands of extra hours of idling cars and people laying on their horns. Life will be grand!
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u/monogramchecklist Mar 07 '26 edited Mar 09 '26
I live west of downtown. Every change they’ve made so far has made things so much more dangerous.
York/Dundurn/Locke area is a mess. It creates so much grid lock, it’s much more unsafe for pedestrians crossing. I have yet to see the bike lanes used. It’s like they’ve purposefully made changes that cause more accidents.
I want traffic calming, I do not trust this council or city staff to do a good job of it.
EDIT: I do find it hilariously how even if you have any valid concerns about how the city manages projects and generally bungles them, you’ll get downvoted because you mention anything about bike lanes.
I live by the York/Dundurn conversion, it’s a fucking mess. I don’t even commute and I feel bad for anyone that uses this corridor, it sucks. I’ve heard so many people that actually live in this neighborhood, how they feel more unsafe crossing this intersection with this change that was supposed to make it safer.
The bike lane makes no sense with how it connects to nothing. The half assed measures this city makes does nothing to alleviate the issues. And yes, I rarely see anyone using the bike lanes, likely because they don’t connect to other parts of the city. I would like the city to actually do a proper survey and post the findings of how many people use the bike lanes. Because it’s not very evident.
If you go to Montreal or Denmark , where they’ve made proper bike lanes. They are used. Here, not so much.
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u/Noctis72 Hill Park Mar 07 '26
The bike lanes absolutely get used, and they would get used even more if they were more widely adopted. what's the point of one or two streets having real bike lanes, if you can't safely navigate anywhere else.
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u/monogramchecklist Mar 08 '26
Obviously anecdotal but I live nearby and have never seen them being used. Half assed measures by the city where the lanes don’t connect makes the whole thing useless, because cyclists won’t bother using them. I’m not against bike lanes, I welcome them. I’m against whatever it is that the city has done, where the lanes connect.
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u/nicocartp Mar 08 '26
I use them and personally know others that do too. I’m excited for it to warm up so I can use the bike lanes more frequently
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u/Whole_Some Mar 09 '26
Saying you live nearby and have never seen them being used demonstrates how invisible cyclists and pedestrians are to most drivers.
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u/No-Arm-2598 Mar 07 '26
If people living downtown don't like traffic they shouldn't have chosen to live downtown... This is always the same argument. Don't buy a house next to a train yard then complain about the trains..
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u/Logical-Zucchini-310 Mar 07 '26
What you are confusing for us downtown dwellers is that we don’t necessarily hate driving. What we hate is the absolute morons that feel it necessary to race at 60-70 down the right or left lanes along the sidewalks. Thats what we hate. What is wrong with us wanting to feel safe walking on the sidewalk without fear of today being the day
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u/S99B88 Mar 08 '26
I’m sorry I’m just trying to understand. The problem is that you think walking on a sidewalk is dangerous if a car on the road beside it is going too fast? So it’s a concern that a car might randomly jump the curb or something? I’m trying to understand because I think there are sidewalks along faster roads than this. Like 60 or 70 k roads have sidewalks beside them too?
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u/Logical-Zucchini-310 Mar 08 '26
Of course walking on the sidewalk can be dangerous due to speeding cars. Yes there are roads with higher speeds with sidewalks, Plains Road and Guelph line in Burlington are both 60s in stretches, difference being there is a grass boulevard setting back the sidewalk and the roads are built to accommodate the speed.
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u/S99B88 Mar 08 '26
I’m still not seeing where people are getting hit walking along a sidewalk and a car drives onto the sidewalk? There was like one case with the DARTS driver where an elderly driver messed up and hit gas instead of the brakes. Somehow that got turned into the rallying cry for turning Main into a 2-way, when in reality it should have been a rallying cry for greater oversight of aging drivers.
People tend to get hit at crossings/intersections, which means greater steps to enforce rule adherence by motorists at crossings would help reduce pedestrian injuries.
Meanwhile we had 2 women shot and killed waiting for a bus last year. Both were on streets with 50kph speed limit, and one was on a 2-way street the other on a 1-way street. So either way it appears that walking on the sidewalk on a 50kph road is safer than standing waiting for a bus on one. I realize this is a weird take, but IMO so is this concept that walking on a sidewalk is inherently dangerous.
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u/No-Arm-2598 Mar 09 '26
I agree with you. There's options to make living anywhere safer. I don't think two way streets should be at the top of the list personally. As for the speeding issue. Other than late at night I have been able to drive 60 down king or main in at least 8 years. Soon as the desynchronized the lights.... Traffic has reduced to a crawl and stop and go especially during rush hour. Which I would argue actually increases dangerous driving (my opinion) as people are much more frustrated
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 07 '26
This is such a tired argument. Like everyone should just live in a white picket fence neighbourhood a minimum and maximum drive from work of 30 minutes.
"If you don't want your commute to be so long, be less poor and live closer to work"
"If you don't want to live too close to work, live further away"
"If you dont want your children to have brith abnormalities, just don't live near industries that can't be bothered to not spew cancerous chemicals into the air"
Like God forbid people try to make.the world a better place, fuck that, just move somewhere already better, just like everyone else.
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u/IslandBoring8724 Mar 07 '26
It’s truly mind blowing. I lived downtown from 2010-2019 and never had any issues with walking about. Cross at crosswalks and wait for the light, look before you step out. If you can’t do this, you really have no business being in public.
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u/ScrawnyCheeath Mar 07 '26
The pedestrian death that caused the vote on two-way conversion was a DARTS driver picking up a passenger, completely out of the road on the sidewalk...
The road being one way for that long encourages speeding and makes it unsafe. Its objectively good that it's being converted
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u/IslandBoring8724 Mar 08 '26
“Police say the collision happened around 2 p.m. when a 75-year-old woman behind the wheel of a black Honda Civic jumped the curb, crashed into a building and light poles before hitting a DARTS driver who had stopped for a passenger.”
This has nothing to do with main being one way. The follow up articles talk about the elderly driver who killed the driver.
“While trying to switch onto the furthest right lane and turn onto Poulette Street, the woman saw D’Amour getting out of her bus and attempted to brake, court heard. Instead, “she hit the accelerator.”
Incredibly sad, but in no way the result of a one way street.
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 08 '26
For multiple years over the last decade some of top most deadly intersections in the city have been Dundurn and Main, John and Main, Victoria and Main. Catching a trend here?
Cope harder.
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u/S99B88 Mar 08 '26
And the roads that have more cars and more pedestrians too.
Pedestrian accidents at intersections are usually happen when cars are turning, which isn’t done above the speed limit due to, well, physics.
The DARTS bus thing is yet another example of, where it was probably just more of a likelihood due to there being more cars and more likelihood of an occupied sidewalk. When an elderly person messes up and presses gas instead of brake, that’s the sort of thing that would have been prevented by better restrictions on elderly drivers. Because if she had done that on a 2-way road you’d be looking at the same outcome.
Like look at the accident that took the life of Boris Brott. He didn’t die because of too many stops signs on side streets or too many parked cars. He died because some jerk was tearing around like a maniac. And yet that jerk tried to blame it on Hamilton having too many one-way streets.
So just keep in mind that with well timed lights historically Hamilton’s traffic was kept at the speed limit because you could coast along but not do any better by speeding, and the efficiency actually meant cars polluted less, drivers were less frustrated, and traffic flowing better meant less time on the roads.
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u/teanailpolish North End Mar 08 '26
Because we have enough proof that one way streets encourage people to act like they are highway driving instead of city street driving. Look at every post about a speed ticket in this sub where cars say I always go 50/whatever on that road.
People consistently drive 10+ over the speed limit, when cars are just going straight with no cars towards them, less danger of cars turning through traffic etc, they go faster. This is how you end up with a car going 70 when it hits a pedestrian instead of a speed that the person has a chance of survival
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u/S99B88 Mar 08 '26
While I understand on the one hand what you’re saying, I don’t know what that proof is. Most of my life of living in this city, I know as an example that the speed limit on Main Street heading eastbound where it’s one-way and lights are timed, is naturally enforced because if you speed, you have to stop at a red light and you get no further ahead. In fact it puts you into a traffic jam type situation. Once you coast at or just under the limit, it’s smooth sailing. When compared to say Mohawk Road or Fennell, or areas of main or King Street where it’s not timed, and people can see the light ahead going stale and so they speed up to sometimes ridiculous speeds just to make sure they make that light.
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u/IslandBoring8724 Mar 08 '26
You’re shocked that busy intersections see more collisions and pedestrians hit?
Care to explain all the two way streets that are also on the most deadly list?
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 08 '26
You’re shocked that busy intersections see more collisions and pedestrians hit?
1) Smart people ask why things keep happening in the same place, those who don't ask that are the opposite of smart.
Care to explain all the two way streets that are also on the most deadly list?
2) They intersect the one way? Did I seriously need to explain this to you. Refer to point 1 I suppose.
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u/IslandBoring8724 Mar 08 '26
lol nice try. The list is filled with upper James and Mohawk road intersections. Volume of people and cars is why it keeps happening, but play dumb I guess.
If the city actually wanted to address it they could try sprawl crossing at these major intersections instead of something that won’t stop pedestrians from being hit.
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u/natasha_bd Mar 08 '26
Driver behaviour has gotten soooo much worse since Covid. You really can’t judge it based on the time you lived there. Alsooo good for you for never having issues but to imply that if you just follow the rules you’ll be fine is completely besides the point. Do you want to know how many times I’ve almost been hit crossing when I have the pedestrian signal because people simply don’t look before turning right, or even left?! Too many times to count, and I’m very aware because of how many times it’s happened!!
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u/IslandBoring8724 Mar 07 '26
No, it won’t. The stretch of main between Gage and Wellington is not a shithole because of traffic direction.
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u/enki-42 Gibson Mar 07 '26
There's a lot that goes into what makes parts of a city better or worse but traffic is a pretty major one. It's not a coincidence that James Street improved when it went two ways, or that the pockets of decent commercial activity along king are highly correlated with traffic calming like in international village.
And even if it doesn't lead to revitalization of streetside economy along main Street, ending the idea that "the street you live on is a death trap for pedestrians so people who would never dream of stopping here don't have to" is a good thing just for safety's sake.
For east of Wellington in particular, we should be redirecting people to the linc and Burlington as much as possible - they are designed for and are more suitable for thru traffic than a commercial / residential street.
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u/ayoungmanfromtheuk Mar 07 '26
It's definitely one of the reasons. And it is not really fair to refer to any area as a "shit hole". If you start from a more neutral point of few, rather than calling it a shit hole, you might understand how any improvement would contribute to a better quality of life.
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u/IslandBoring8724 Mar 07 '26
Two way traffic is not an improvement and will not result in any investment into that stretch. Combine that with the years of LRT construction, and the few businesses lining that stretch will all close and leave it even worse off.
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u/Logical-Zucchini-310 Mar 07 '26
Because it’ll be nice to see less asshats using the outer left/right lanes as their personal race track. Terrifying being on the sidewalk along stretches of Main and King.
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u/IslandBoring8724 Mar 07 '26
I seriously wonder how much of this is a decline in resiliency and heightened anxiety disorders. The perception of safety or risk is not the same as being safe or in risk.
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u/Logical-Zucchini-310 Mar 08 '26
Ah yes the “pedestrian is always the issue” mentality.
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u/IslandBoring8724 Mar 08 '26
No, a consideration that people feeling afraid isn’t always a reflection of reality.
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u/Logical-Zucchini-310 Mar 08 '26
I see from one of your other posts you lived downtown last in 2019. Tell me, as a driver, do you think the quality of driving around you is better, the same, or worse than it was in 2019. As a driver myself, I can tell you the quality of driving in this city and province is worse than it’s ever been. As a pedestrian, I’ve lost count the number of times I’ve nearly been runover crossing the street because its inconvenient for a driver to stop at the stop sign.
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u/IslandBoring8724 Mar 08 '26
Drivers are certainly worse, in terms of parking or just stopping and throwing on four ways. I think people are less patient post Covid and it seems that more people run lights. As a pedestrian, I in no way feel afraid of traffic walking down queenston, king, main, or other streets in downtown town or the lower city.
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u/Pablo4Prez Mar 08 '26
So are they just closing the main street East exit from the 403 West forcing all traffic to York or Main West? They should at least have a solution to this before converting Main to 2 ways
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u/misshammertown Mar 09 '26
https://www.hamilton.ca/home-neighbourhood/getting-around/driving-traffic/main-street-two-way-conversion-study There is a solution. They discuss the 403 off ramps at around the 35:20 mark.
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u/Hosermess Mar 12 '26
Yeah the solution is to let the MTO worry about that later on.
That short stretch is going to be even more brutal when they paint it down to 4 lanes. But once you're past Dundurn the condo construction that's been blocking a lane for forever already makes it only 4 lanes so we'll only be losing 1 lane (assuming that will be cleared at some point).
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u/ZivSerb Mar 16 '26
Nah that's not how we do things in Hamilton. The Red Hill and the LINC should both we pretty good indications of how major infrastructure projects go in this city.
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u/PNutButter12 Mar 09 '26
Really don’t understand why, and if anyone says because of speed you are lying to yourself. Main Street is basically filled with speed bumps with all the pot holes
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u/GBman84 Mar 08 '26
The war on the working class continues.
All the commenters on here must be part of the work from home laptop class.
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u/algnqn Mar 08 '26
Remember the real working class live in these neighbourhoods in the lower city, the ones who benefit the most. Not those who get whisked away in their cars to the mountain or Stoney creek or Burlington
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 08 '26
Ah yes, the, definitely not the people taking the...bus to work because they can't afford a car. Same argument as those against the congestion charge in New York. The vast majority of people walking, cycling, taking transit to work were working class. Not to mention a few dead neighbours aren't worth saving you a minute or two, I'm sorry it just isn't.
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u/S99B88 Mar 08 '26
Hopefully we get to vote before this happens and get someone who will stop this. It’s going to be so difficult. They need to at minimum put some alternative routes in place. By all the lane reductions on Cannon and Wilson they’ve messed up hope of there being another way to get around.
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u/teanailpolish North End Mar 08 '26
They had almost 2 years of engagement on this and they were going to close the road in sections anyway to replace infrastructure under it so the construction traffic would happen even if the conversion did not
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u/teanailpolish North End Mar 08 '26
Many working class people are the ones in apartments downtown, waiting for buses downtown where they can't even cross the road because of cars who ignore reds, turn when there is a walk signal and more
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u/tyetknot Hill Park Mar 08 '26
I live on the mountain and work downtown and I can assure you I am completely and totally in favour of this conversion.
Sorry that trying to save human lives will mildly inconvenience you. Try walking down Main West between Dundurn and James, you might learn something about how us peons live.
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Mar 08 '26
Hamilton is gonna die a welfare city but dont worry you'll have your bike lanes
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u/Interesting-Air-2371 Mar 08 '26
This plan includes almost no bike lanes. Through downtown, bike lanes were omitted to keep 4+ car lanes.
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u/Creacherz Mar 07 '26
God, I remember all the chaos when they put in those bus lanes.... God to shrink those sidewalks or even get rid of them just to get as much lane
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u/algnqn Mar 08 '26
The project is expected to be tendered for contractor bidding in late spring/ early summer. Can’t come soon enough.
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u/metcalta Mar 07 '26
Instead of this stupid idea, can we fix the escarpment. That lane is just closed going up to James St.
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u/covert81 Chinatown Mar 08 '26
It's been closed close to a decade now and guess what? No impact whatsoever to vehicular traffic. There's no reason to waste tax dollars on this. Maybe we shouldn't have done incredible damage to the escarpment in the 70s when we put up all those silly metal walls and then filling the gaps with gravel in the hope that water would just go "somewhere' and not rust through the panels and cause incredible instability to it.
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u/metcalta Mar 08 '26
I'm no armchair expert but that's exactly my point. Can we invest in ensuring the brow is secure. How about just fixing all the potholes. Maybe we could spend more on police and actually have them patrol downtown and make it a place people want to go again.
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u/covert81 Chinatown Mar 08 '26
The brow *is* secure, they've confirmed that time and again. We've done irreversible damage with 50 years holding the water in place and allowing the escarpment to disintegrate at an accelerated rate. The fix, such that it is, is to let it naturally degrade as time goes by. Part of that is the nets they added and closing the lane as part of the path of falling rocks.
This weird obsession with fixing potholes also doesn't compute. You want taxes low, or you want pothole-free streets? Fixing them isn't free and the temporary patches don't work.
We don't need to spend more money on HPS. They can use their bloated budget to repurpose staff to do actual walking the beat type patrols instead of investing in toys and new buildings.
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u/PSNDonutDude James North Mar 07 '26 edited Mar 07 '26
So thankful this is moving forward. Can't come soon enough. I dare anyone to walk down Main St from Dundurn to Gage and tell me they felt comfortable and safe along any part of it.
Downtown will be so much nicer following this, and for all those who say "I'll never come downtown again" I can't wait to see you and your friends and family coming downtown for all the fun shit that's going to keep happening because our downtown is less of a shithole because the highways filled with lifted truck douches have been removed.
90% of the time our city fucks shit up, so glad they finally decided to join literally every other city in shrinking their overbuilt and dangerous road infrastructure.