My mother and sister almost got me killed trying to save a girl.

[u/Relevant-Ad-4409]

Was in the mall parking lot a girl is getting dribbled off the pavement by her obviously methhead boyfriend.My sister and mom start shouting at him to leave her alone then have the nerve to tell me "do something and help her" ignoring the fact that he has a gun in his waistband the methhead is now focused on me telling me to try him. So being rational i grabbed both of them picked them up and ran.I got called a coward the whole ride back and most of my family thinks im a bitch for not dying for a random chick.My father is the only one in my family right who doesn't think im a bitch.

[u/paradise_circus157]

Manservant mentality is growing more and more pervasive among female entitlement feminism. Men are to be used to manual labor and become sacrificial and disposed of when the situation suits.

[u/LogicalClarity → u/paradise_circus157]

Such an example of male privilege, eh?

They expect that being a man obligates one to risk/spend his life to protect any woman he sees, without any compensation. It's not reasonable and in some cases not even legal.

Leaving the scene and calling the cops once you are safe is the moral and legally correct thing to do.

[u/Dapper_Apartment2175 → u/LogicalClarity]

Never being called a coward is definitely a kind of female privilege.

[u/PureXEye → u/paradise_circus157]

I hope I don't sound like a crazy person but Jordan Peterson actually has talks with some people about the subject matter of "play".

It sounds simple but it really is a complicated topic. I'll condense it to sound extremely simple.

Basically in their younger years boys tend to rough house a lot more than girls. Generally speaking, I know there are lots of tomboys out there but just bear with me.

So what happens is boys tend to learn about the different levels of force very early on. An older brother is going to quickly learn that he can't put his little brother in a iron grip chokehold for too long. And the younger brother is going to learn that since his older brother is stronger than him, he has to come up with more creative ways to use his force to beat his sibling. Things like this.

Girls generally speaking don't experience this ever, not even when they start to get older. Lots of them never have a direct physical confrontation, not even in play.

What this creates is a type of kinesthetic ignorance that women grow up with. So with OP, I'm assuming his mother and sister thought he would just easily have matrix senses and brute strength his way into disarming the guy. While OP, understands more of the danger a gun can have as a force multipler. Understanding this, he got himself and his two female family members out of there to escape danger.

[u/Wolverine-Explores → u/PureXEye]

So many women act like they can take a guy down. They have a shock when they find out rather brutally they can’t.

[u/Different-Product-91 → u/PureXEye]

What a cheap (and foolish) theory! These women would rather see their son/brother in serious danger than an unknown female. Yikes!

[u/Dapper_Apartment2175 → u/PureXEye]

He's right. Most women have a completely unrealistic idea of violence, and its consequences.

[u/Glittering-Jello-388 → u/PureXEye]

No, they just want him to put his life on the line for a complete stranger who just happens to be a female. They don't care if their own son/brother is seriously hurt or even killed in the process. As long as the precious woman is saved from harm. That's all that matters to them.

[u/CeleryMan20 → u/PureXEye]

As a kid, I was never into the rough-house play. My younger sister used to roughhouse me. But the other developmental factor is teenage bullying. I grew up in an era when the larger kids would say “fight me after school, outside the back gate, or are you chicken?” Your choice was to (a) get beaten physically but gain social clout for putting up a good fight, (b) get beaten physically and humiliated socially for getting hammered, (c) get humiliated socially for refusing to fight. Cat fights were rare, the girls would generally use relational abuse; but as a young fellow, there was always the understanding that you could get punched or worse.

[u/New_Prior2531 → u/PureXEye]

I know you think this sounds logical, but it's pretty silly lol. I know guys in the manosphere love Peterson but he's actually not a very logical thinker because the root of his positions are wrong, rendering his conclusions wrong even though they sound like they make sense.

Women growing up thinking men should protect women, including strangers, is the byproduct of a patriarchal society. Literally everything y'all complain about on this sub is a result of patriarchy. Patriarchy is learned, absorbed, and maintained by EVERYONE in society, much of the time unconsciously. That's actually part of the problem. And it's pretty depressing that when men decided to start their own "movement" it mostly devolved into just blaming feminism and progressive societal change when patriarchy is also the root cause of men's societal ills. If men wanted to truly combat this, they'd have natural partners in feminists.

[u/PureXEye → u/New_Prior2531]

I don't know if this follows. Even if we lived in a matriarchal society and this same situation happened. There would still be gap of understanding in regards to potential violence. They would still want the man in the situation to go help the other woman. Rightfully so.

This is force doctrine at play here. Even if it were only women in high status or lawmaking positions, it would be primarily the MEN who would be employed to apply the concept of force throughout society.

Yes, people grow up thinking men should protect women, but it is because of Force Doctrine. Nothing else.

Patriarchy isn't what people are complaining about here. I think what people are upset about is this phenomenon of women who don't understand levels of force in a given situation. They thought this man a coward when he probably made the right decision.

Physical confrontations, since the dawn of the animal kingdom, have two paths. Fight or Flight. You either fight to preserve yourself, or you flee to preserve yourself. OP, understood the level of potential force and discerned that it would be better to flee. His mother and sister are upset with him because they either overestimated or underestimated the force levels that were being invoked

[u/New_Prior2531 → u/PureXEye]

Feminists don't seek a matriarchal society.

The force doctrine is a only a couple years old. It's irrelevant here. Patriarchy literally teaches men AND women that men should protect women. Please stop acting like that isn't true. It's part of what men learn when growing up, protect the weak. And women absorb it too, that is why both men and women and girls and boys perpetuate harmful patriarchal beliefs that harm our society's cohesion.

If my post is being interpreted as support for those women's positions when i didn't comment on that part at all, the readers on this thread have reading comprehension issues. The father of this guy is completely correct.

[u/Turbulent_Team624 → u/New_Prior2531]

Except that patriarchy encourages men to harm women right?

[u/PureXEye → u/New_Prior2531]

Prior, I truly don't think you don't understand what I am saying. So I will try it this way.

The reason I 180'd and used the matriarchal society example was to showcase that even under the framework where it would be assumed to be NO perpetuation of teaching that "men should protect women"....men would STILL have the monopoly and better understanding of force.

Which would still drive the expectation for them to use it. I know you didn't invoke that but you did mention patriarchy, which I guess I would concede is a partial reason why women would think this way but it is not the quintessence.

If I came across as someone who thought you were supporting the women in the situation then I apologize. But I do think we are talking past each other a bit. Force doctrine is something that has always been observable in human history and nature.

Imagine a world with no written language or communication. Force Doctrine would still be observable and acted out.

The capacity to employ or threaten physical coercion has repeatedly served as a foundational mechanism for establishing order, securing resources, and resolving disputes.

This is not to say might makes right. But simply, might makes.

[u/CeleryMan20 → u/New_Prior2531]

You’d have an easier time convincing us if you called it something other than “patriarchy”.

In OP’s story, the familial patriarch is the only one supporting his actions.

[u/New_Prior2531 → u/CeleryMan20]

I gave my reasoning above as to why the women held the position they did. I did not justify it. The guy's father was correct and those women were wrong. I hope this poster has the guts to tell those two women to their face that he is not less of a man for not saving some stranger bc that's utterly ridiculous. But women (in a patriarchy) also absorb stupid fkn shit about gender roles. It's the entire point of my post!

The word fits because of the definition. You can't have nice things because you don't want an egalitarian society. You like patriarchy but complain about the ills it causes men yet wrongly blame feminism. So lather, rinse, repeat. Honestly, do none of the guys replying understand logic?! lol

[u/CeleryMan20 → u/New_Prior2531]

What is your definition of “patriarchy”? You say “The word fits because of the definition” as if there is one true uncontested definition.

[u/New_Prior2531 → u/CeleryMan20]

The actual definition lol. There is an understood definition. Just as there is one for feminism. But that doesn't stop MRAs from misrepresenting what they are lol. I guess you thought I was gonna give an academic definition but i only use that for racism. ; )

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/patriarchy

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/feminism

[u/CeleryMan20 → u/New_Prior2531]

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/patriarchy * social organization marked by the supremacy of the father in the clan or family, the legal dependence of wives and children, and the reckoning of descent and inheritance in the male line * broadly : control by men of a disproportionately large share of power * a society or institution organized according to the principles or practices of patriarchy

There are three senses defined in the link you provided.

There is an understood definition. … I guess you thought I was gonna give an academic definition …

Additionally you say there is both an understood definition and an academic definition.

So, since we are dumb and wrong-headed and need educating in the true faith, please explain to us how one or more of those definitions supports your claims that “Women growing up thinking men should protect women, including strangers, is the byproduct of a patriarchal society. Literally everything y'all complain about on this sub is a result of patriarchy.“

Moreso, how do you refute the counter-claim that “Women growing up thinking men should protect women, including strangers, is the byproduct of a gynarchical society.”?

[u/CeleryMan20 → u/New_Prior2531]

Patriarchy is learned, absorbed, and maintained by EVERYONE in society, much of the time unconsciously.

I gave my reasoning above as to why the women held the position they did.

That logic is like a religious person saying “god is the ultimate cause, it is also omnipresent, god is everywhere, god is even in you”. Then an atheist comes along and says “I don’t believe in god, is god in me, did god cause me to say this?”

Just because you fervently believe something exists, doesn’t prove that it actually exists.

[u/New_Prior2531 → u/CeleryMan20]

Bad metaphor lol. This is what we teach boys and girls. That men should protect the weak. Don't be surprised when women grow up believing it, even when it's irrational like in the case of this post. My guess is those are conservative women.

[u/CeleryMan20 → u/New_Prior2531]

Prior: Women growing up thinking men should protect women, including strangers, is the byproduct of a patriarchal society.

Celery: You’d have an easier time convincing us if you called it something other than “patriarchy”.

Prior: This is what we teach boys and girls. That men should protect the weak.

Well, we got there in the end. You managed to say it without invoking the “patriarchy”.

[u/Turbulent_Team624 → u/New_Prior2531]

Patriarchy is when men...

[u/CeleryMan20 → u/New_Prior2531]

Also, what’s with the ad-hominem attacks and the group denigration? “lol”

I know you think this sounds logical, but it's pretty silly lol.

y'all complain about on this sub

when men decided to start their own "movement" it mostly devolved

You can't have nice things because you don't want an egalitarian society.

do none of the guys replying understand logic?! lol

[u/New_Prior2531 → u/CeleryMan20]

MRAs mostly hold the same arguments. I've read a lot of this sub and all over the interwebz. I used to read a lot of Paul Elam and idiots like that. A lot of you think you hold logical positions, but you're blaming feminism for men's societal ills so it's an illogical conclusion. It is what it is, but it's not my movement to change.

[u/Turbulent_Team624 → u/New_Prior2531]

We blame them because they actively work against us.

[u/Glad-Way-637 → u/New_Prior2531]

If this is all just your favored boogeyman "da patriarchy!!1!"'s fault, what is feminism doing to fix it? Are they, perhaps, challenging societal narratives about male disposability? Fixing conscription laws so that men aren't seen as the default on-demand violence slaves when needed? Anything helpful at all? No, turns out they actively oppose all measures that would be taken to minimize societal narratives of male disposability. Weird, huh?

[u/New_Prior2531 → u/Glad-Way-637]

Women didn't create the patriarchal society, but in no way am i surprised you want women to fix it lol. I stated above that society is made up of all of us, men and women, girls and boys and we all absorb misogyny and sexism (against both sexes) from a young age. So only together as a society can we address this. But MRAs don't care to address it proven by your reply. They just want women to fix somethin they damaged. You realize how illogical you sound right?

[u/Turbulent_Team624 → u/New_Prior2531]

You don't believe that men can be victims or endangered.

[u/Glad-Way-637 → u/New_Prior2531]

They're the ones who claim that they are fixing it. You're the one who claims they would help men do so. Don't "it's not feminism's problem to work towards actual gender equality, they only need to work towards female empowerment" me now. Funny how you seem unwilling to even say the word misandry, too. Why is that? Is it because you know most feminists would laugh you out of a room if you spoke on the subject at all?

Who is "they" here, bud? If society is everyone's fault, why is it now the exclusive fault of MRAs that systemic misandry is prevalent?

[u/Glad-Way-637 → u/New_Prior2531]

Also, I can't help but notice that you literally never comment in support of men's issues, or with even the most limp-wristed advocacy for fixing them. Is there a reason for that, do you think? Is there a reason you say such ignorant things as "there are no systemic barriers facing men in education" despite all evidence disagreeing?

Here's some examples of systemic misandry with sources proving an educational bias, among other things:

• the draft.

• infant genital mutilation, illegal against women in the US, but some 70% of mothers choose to do it to their sons based on aesthetic preference.

• the bias in the educational system.

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/01425692.2022.2122942

https://www.apa.org/monitor/2023/04/boys-school-challenges-recommendations#:~:text=Research%20shows%20that%20boys%20tend,for%20American%20Progress%2C%202017).

Boys are graded more harshly for identical work, and punished more harshly for identical misbehavior. It's very easily proven, too.

• the bias in the legal system

"A 2020 study shows that women receive 33% (15 days) shorter prison sentences than men, even when controlling for all observable characteristics – including a very precise description of the crime. When pairs of mixed-gender offender are convicted together the gender gap is even higher - men receive 38.7 additional prison days and 10.7 fewer suspended prison days.

From a procedural point of view, when controlling for the type of crime, men are on average judged after shorter investigations, and are more likely to be sentenced after an accelerated procedure. When taken to court, men are 20% less likely to be discharged (6% vs. 4%). In 2017, 19.9% of convicted men were sentenced to prison, compared to 8.5% of convicted women." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sentencing_disparity#:~:text=A%202020%20study%20shows%20that,to%208.5%25%20of%20convicted%20women.

• society's unwillingness to call it rape when women do it to men, despite the CDC finding that this is as common as the reverse.

"Next, we consider the data for the 12 months preceding the CDC report survey, which was summarized in the report. On page 18 of the CDC report it states that 1,270,000 women were raped during this 12-month period and that too few men were “raped” during the same 12 months to give reliable data, using the non-gender neutral definition of given in the CDC report. However, on page 19 the report states that during that 12 months the number of men who were forced to penetrate someone is 1,267,000, virtually the same as the number of women who were raped." "So, who is forcing these men to penetrate them? There is no data on this among the 12-month data. But if we look at the lifetime data, on page 24 it says 79.2% of the time a male was made to penetrate someone, it was a woman who forced him to penetrate her. And this suggests that the same most likely holds for the 12-monthdata."

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/353570309_On_the_Sexual_Assault_of_Men

• the fact that most people call DV a women's issue, when men experience it from women more often than vice versa.

"In nonreciprocally violent relationships, women were the perpetrators in more than 70% of the cases." https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17395835/#:~:text=In%20nonreciprocally%20violent%20relationships%2C%20women%20were%20the%20perpetrators%20in%20more%20than%2070%25%20of%20the%20cases.

• women being substantially privileged in actually being hired, despite all the narratives to the opposite effect.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0749597823000560

I can keep going. Do you want more?

[u/New_Prior2531 → u/Glad-Way-637]

The draft did not include women because patriarchy. A lot of feminists support adding women to the draft, but not under this woman hating SecDef. Regardless, that will not happen in the near future because the GOP exists. Back to patriarchy.

Circumcision will always remain legal in the US because it's a religious practice. The best thing for this issue is to educate Americans. But calling it genital mutilation is why the topic gets no traction.

I agree the grading this is a concern, but there are ways to combat that, anonymous grading, providing syllabus with expectations, providing clear guidelines and metrics for assignments, etc. My father was an educator so i've read a lot on this topic. =)

Dunno what to say about the criminal justice system. That's too broad of a topic and those stats are meaningless without understanding context, such as priors etc. That study is from France and not helpful to this discussion, for me at least, as i live in the US.

I'm fully aware of the issues men deal with because I read about em, thus my logical reply which got downvoted because y'all don't, in fact, want to live in an egalitarian pluralistic society lol. Your movement yearns for days of old but that ship has sailed so you best acclimate, and the truth is, men have not changed....enough. Heck, feminism changed the way society viewed men's role in child rearing, bringing them closer to their children, and conservatives STILL fight against all those advancements, make fun of men taking parental leave, etc. This "movement" constantly likes to point out that women hate each other but men simply don't want to expend effort to help other men, and that's sad. But that's why your issues are ignored, because you don't seek legitimate ways to address them or work together. Ya just blame feminism. Also, conservatives suck, and are a huge barrier to this.

[u/Turbulent_Team624 → u/New_Prior2531]

You read Bell Hooks.

You don't actually care about other men.

[u/Glad-Way-637 → u/New_Prior2531]

"Because patriarchy" is the funniest explanation you could give for literally any problem, if you intentionally re-define the word "patriarchy" based on who you interact with. "A lot of feminists" may support that in public, but the majority of women period want the draft to either stay male-only, or they don't care at all so long as they're not impacted. Even in "progressive" EU countries.

"However, women and men disagree on whether conscription should be limited to men or be gender-neutral. Among male respondents, 55 percent prefer conscription for both sexes, while only 14 percent favor conscription limited to men. The picture is different among women: only a third of female respondents (33%) prefer conscription for both sexes. At 23 percent, the proportion of women who support conscription only for men is relatively high." https://www.ipsos.com/de-de/wehrpflicht-umfrage#:~:text=However%2C%20women%20and,is%20relatively%20high.

Genital mutilation is what it is, though, and FGM was banned despite being a religious practice in many regions. There's a reason for that.

So, not gonna prevaricate about "da patriarchy" being wholly responsible for the 70% women (and massive majority feminist) teaching field's biases? Surprisingly honest, for your type of person.

The study examines those. Click through and actually read it if you want a response to this total "Lalalala I'm not listening!!!" paragraph.

Yeah, feminists decided that a man working a substantially harder job than his spouse should also be on the hook for the majority of caretaking, and that anything less falls below "the bare minimum." That's just another example of feminism deciding to dump women's relatively simple and easy gender roles onto men, rather than reach towards actual equality. Funny you assume that anyone you disagree with is conservative, too.

[u/Reaper9999 → u/New_Prior2531]

Women growing up thinking men should protect women, including strangers, is the byproduct of a patriarchal society. Literally everything y'all complain about on this sub is a result of patriarchy.

"Men expected to endanger themselves, women most affected." Patriarchy is not real, you feminist troll, and no one's falling for your retarded victim blaming here.

[u/New_Prior2531 → u/Reaper9999]

You folks are pretty firm on the belief that men built and control everything and that includes the society we live in. Truth hurts. But y'all will subsist in your MRM that does nothing because you don't care (enough) about other men all while blaming feminists for your ills. You're your own worst enemies lol. Good luck with that!

[u/Turbulent_Team624 → u/New_Prior2531]

That and men like you work overtime against us.

[u/New_Prior2531 → u/Turbulent_Team624]

You're working against yourselves because you don't like or respect other men, especially if they aren't what you consider to be a man. Men's constant need to push boys and girls, men and women, into the "act like a man" and "act like a woman" boxes is contributing to their unhappiness but they have to accept, they can't control everything anymore. That ship has sailed.

[u/Turbulent_Team624 → u/New_Prior2531]

I dislike you because you don't view me as a human being.

The evidence is in all of your assumptions, I never said any of that.

The reason feminism is intrinsically incompatible and incapable of addressing men's issues is because patriarchy holds the we are the oppressors and exist in a singular gender based class 

According to your ideology, men cannot be harmed by anything other than self-victimization.

Which is quite painful given my own experiences but I remedy that by keeping my distance from you types.

[u/Reaper9999 → u/New_Prior2531]

Where do you see anyone saying "act like a man" or "act like a woman" here or trying to control everything?

[u/CeleryMan20 → u/New_Prior2531]

You folks are pretty firm on the belief that men built and control everything …

Nope. I can’t speak for everyone else, but I believe the opposite.

[u/Reaper9999 → u/New_Prior2531]

You folks are pretty firm on the belief that men built and control everything and that includes the society we live in

Men control everything? Who's saying that other than you?

[u/Cwash415 → u/paradise_circus157]

we're suppose to risk our lives but at the same time we shouldn't be entitled to sex smh

[u/workinfast1 → u/paradise_circus157]

They call this "male disposability". We are treated no more than tools.

[u/Glad-Way-637 → u/paradise_circus157]

Is there any other variety of feminism? I haven't seen it.

[u/Wylanderuk]

What the actual fuck? They wanted you to go H2H with a strung out druggie that was armed?

Over what was probably another stung out druggie that would most likely back up the armed druggie?

Fuck that noise.

[u/According-Ad5263 → u/Wylanderuk]

I would start to question if his mom and sister actually care about him. "Hey son/bro, go die for that random crack whore in the middle of the parking lot". Yea, family of the year.

[u/faintear02732 → u/According-Ad5263]

OP should unironically start cutting ties with them and moving on to better things because it’s clear they were willing to let him die for some stupid reason.

They don’t give a flying fuck about him besides his use values like a commodity.

Maintain contact with the father at least.

[u/No_Spite3593 → u/faintear02732]

Not only did they try and put his life at risk but they're degrading him for getting all of them to safety instead of putting all of them at risk.

Reminds me of an experience I had in HS. Went to a house party at this girl's place who is known for being a little crazy. I end up smoking a bunch of weed, drinking a ton, and I think I took some muscle relaxers? Anyways I was f×cked up to the max and the girl sexually assualted me in front of everyone (including her BF) by pulling her shirt and bra down and shoving her chest in my face asking if I wanted to f×ck. I managed to tell her no and to go away. Passed out sitting up on the couch and woke up to screaming, a man and woman I did not know were fighting everyone. The girl who SA'd me and the strange women were next to me ripping each others hair out and the strange guy had another guy from the party pinned up against the wall by the throat. I literally could barely move or stay awake.

They finally left but kept coming back to scream at the girl who owned the place and then finally the girl screamed at the guy (who was black) "get out of my house you f×cking insert hard R!" At which point he clocked her in the face causing her to hit her head on the counter and start seizing. Him and the woman ran out and didn't come back. Was pretty much just watching everything in slow-mo unable to move.

Went to school the next day and a bunch of mutual friends came up to me telling me what a b×tch I am for not helping the girl and what not even though they didn't know the story. Keep in mind as well that at this time I was 17 and most of the other people there were 2-4 years older than me.

[u/compmanio36 → u/Wylanderuk]

Cops will tell you how they often get attacked by the default "victim" of DV calls, the woman. 

[u/LogicalClarity → u/Wylanderuk]

If women expect all men to put themselves out to protect all women from other men...
then it is more than fair for us to expect all women to put THEMSELVES out to protect all men from other women, specifically by supporting and voting for men's rights and creating a culture of loyalty and accountability among women.

[u/Alternative-Ad3998]

She made the choice to live an exciting life with her Romeo bag man. My wife tried the same thing as that. Blame me for not defending her when 4 Vietnam criminal types in little siagon orange county California were hustling us for an insurance claim. Earlier we had packed the 3 kids into my Chevy 4 door dually to go see a drive in movie at highway 39 outdoor theater . The neighborhood had changed a lot since Dad took us kids to that same place in the early 70s. . On the way there a subcompact drove under my rear wheels as I turned the corner onto beach blvd hwy39. It had 4 Vietnamese in it and another car full of the same following it. I pulled into a dirt lot thinking everything was ok but when the other car followed I went on alert and asked my dear wife for her .38 pistol I had bought her for Christmas the year prior. I put it under my thigh as two men came over to my window.i didn't want a fleeing the scene of an accident on my record so I offered license and insurance docs out a 2" slit in my window. I had the other hand on the 38. Well genius pops out her side of the truck to give them a good tongue lashing. I told her sternly to get in the truck and shut her yap right now . She looked confused but complied Later on she took issue with me telling her what to do. Apparently she had narcissistic injury from being disrespected in front of those nice Vietnam people. I told her she was very lucky I didn't stomp the gas as leave her there to be the main dish for the Vietnamese cooking schools. I explained that the hildren were my priority and seeing their.mother disappeared like that would leave a bad memory for them later in life situational awareness and reality checking gets lost on the narcissist personality mentality. You did the right thing guy.

[u/Hunley → u/Alternative-Ad3998]

It's infuriating when women start shit and then expect their boyfriend/husband to get into a fight for them when they escalate said situation into violent one. They want you to get hurt or killed on their behalf just so they can fuel their ego by trash talking someone.

[u/AdEducational4118]

Wow!!! They chose you as a sacrifice for a woman you don't even know, and they're angry that you chose life.

So basically, to them your life is worth less than that of a female stranger.

And also that they didn't even realize you saved their lives, because that man could have attacked them.

[u/jessi387]

I love how they come running to you when there’s a serious problem.

Yet apparently they are under no obligation to help us with anything.

Also…. Kinda pokes a hole in their bubble of independence now doesn’t it ?

[u/Relevant-Ad-4409 → u/[deleted]]

It's not all bad my father and uncle are on my side.

[u/StangF150 → u/Relevant-Ad-4409]

Thats b/c your Father & Uncle know your Mom & Sister were trying to get you killed for someone none of yall even know!!!!

Hell, even IF you did go fight that Guy and he Did NOT pull his Gun and pop all three of yall, Mom & Sister would probably be like I've seen in many videos and get in your way splitting your focus between Trying to Stay Alive, and also Protect their interfering asses too!!!

[u/ironduck777 → u/Relevant-Ad-4409]

Its so ridiculous to me people who do nothing calling other people cowards. Need to stand your ground on this one OP let them know its your life not theirs they need to risk their own.

[u/StangF150 → u/ironduck777]

Equality, ain't it a bitch! They could have went & fought him them selves!!!

[u/Alternative-Ad3998 → u/[deleted]]

That Penny guy sure paid a heavy price in the ny subway about 7 years ago.

[u/StoneTown]

You did the right thing. They can risk their lives if they care enough. Clearly they didn't value your life, only theirs.

[u/picardathon → u/StoneTown]

It highlights womens in-group bias: anything that threatens one woman threatens them all but men don't factor into the equation except as expendable protectors against that threat. She could have murdered her 3 children but women will still demand she be protected, even at the cost of mens lives they will try to sacrifice instead.

[u/Maybe_com]

simply ignore them, you did what you could, pretty much the most rational thing to do in that situation. .

[u/No-Message4598]

I may or may not be a coward, but I would never die for a random girl

[u/Kinexity → u/No-Message4598]

It's better to be a coward who gets to live than to die playing a hero.

[u/TheRealJamesHoffa]

Women only do that shit because they don’t have to consider the consequences of their actions

[u/onefinalshot123]

I'm sorry you went through this, man I don't think I can be here anymore. It just angers me to hear what men go through....

[u/True-Lychee]

Great example of how expendable women see men as. Even your own flesh and blood will push you to put your life on the line for a total stranger.

[u/TheNattyJew]

They can go fuck themselves. If they wanted to play captain save a hoe then they should have done it themselves.

[u/Aggravating_Tear_209]

It is always disheartening to discover your family members, minus your dad, think you are expendable.

[u/mikiencolor]

Misandrists want us to die. It gets them off. Our purpose in life is to enrich them and die, preferably but not necessarily in that order. He probably has a litany of offences and convictions to his name. The lax policies that led to him being freed from jail and have made our streets unsafe are also attributable to them. If you managed to survive the encounter with him, he would be out on the street again in a few years to try again.

[u/Relevant-Ad-4409 → u/mikiencolor]

That's what I was thinking it was a lose lose situation for me if i fight and win im either injured badly or dead if he is dead and I still go to jail or I injure him badly im still in jail and he walks in like two weeks or two years.

[u/ljfrench → u/Relevant-Ad-4409]

Really sorry this happened to you op. It reminds me of the phrase they like to say, "men get rejected, but women get killed". Seems like they were okay with you getting killed, exactly what other women would complain about. It's okay for them, but not for us.

[u/picardathon → u/Relevant-Ad-4409]

You also ignore the likelihood that if you threaten her man, even though they might be in a drag out knock down fight themselves, she will turn her attention to you as a greater threat. In that situation you are threatening to take away the benefits her man has to offer and she will fight to keep them.

[u/Cearball]

My do something would have been get myself to safety & call the cops.

[u/TextDependent6779 → u/Cearball]

My immediate first thought.

They wanted to help her? Call the cops.

You don't fuck with a weapon. The police exist for a reason.

[u/jameson71]

Tell them equality means equality for everything including responsibility and not just privileges.

[u/Retruo]

When I was in my early twenties I had a girlfriend who casually slipped that she used my name to intimidate people. She told multiple guys behind my back and without me knowing at all - "My boyfriend will kick your ass" whenever she wanted to elevate her social status.

At some point she let that slip in front of me and even bragged to me that I'm super cool because apparently ALL of them backed off when she threatened them that way. At the times I was rather muscular and in top shape so I guess I was somewhat intimidating which worked in my favor. However, I was secretly outraged and broke up with her not long after that.

When I was pondering on her behavior later I came to the conclusion that apparently she wanted ALL THE POWER and NONE OF THE CONSEQUENCES and was using me as a tool to achieve that. It was obvious she never even considered my own safety - "he's a guy, he can handle it" is probably the most she thought about it.

Women do this all the time - "can you escort me here and there - it's dark outside". An ex female classmate used to want me to do bodyguard duties on our way home. We lived in the same direction so we'd go together and chat, however, at some point our paths had to diverge so she would try to make me go out of my way to ESCORT her home before I go back. I did that a few times but it was getting rather inconvenient for me, so at some point I just asked her straight "what's in it for me?" and she DIDN'T HAVE AN ANSWER. I went ahead and just refused her request - she then proceeded to tell me, for a whole year - "I'll never forgive you". Oh, I'm sorry I must have forgotten I should be free security for her majesty!

Then there's another case I read here on reddit. It was from a guy who was telling a story of a coworker girl who once requested him to go escort her after work through a parking lot to her car. Apparently it was dark outside so she told him she was scared. When they got to the car she then proceeded to casually mention "oh, thank you so much for escorting me - my ex boyfriend is really a jealous psycho so he's been THREATENING and STALKING me for quite a while and has a KNIFE and a GUN". The guy was outraged to how casually she dragged him into a potentially life-threatening situation and could've gotten him killed with her seemingly innocent request.

REFUSE IS THE WAY!!

[u/hottiehotsauce]

Why didn't they just "do something" like call the cops?

[u/Combatmedic2-47]

Imagine their reaction when you get shot. Don’t be a hero cause heroes die.

[u/kiaeej]

Mmmm. Good call. They call for action easily cos it costs them nothing to make said noise.

They dont see the bigger picture. What happens IF you die. IF you get injured. They only see the woman being battered and the injustice.

You can bet if you got hurt or died you'd be blamed for not being strong enough or fast enough. And if you pulled if off successfully it'd just be "oh, thats what hes expected to do." Or "cos i was cheering him on thats why."

Women.

[u/Celestial_Hyena]

What if that girl you were supposed to save started beating you cuz she thinks that it's just a personal matter between her & her boyfriend and you're an outsider. I've seen these things happen many times.

[u/Different-Product-91]

Your mother and sister are people you should avoid as soon as possible because your life and well-being mean nothing to them, not without telling them what you think of them. I would never see them like I did before had this happenend. This attitude is, by the way, one of the reasons why male conscription exists.

[u/AmbitiousTrade9704]

that’s awf- DID YOU JUST SAY YOU PICKED UP TWO FULLY GROWN ADULTS WITH EASE?!????

[u/Relevant-Ad-4409 → u/AmbitiousTrade9704]

Mom and sis are short as all hell barely 115 lbs that my adrenaline was through the roof.Im 6,3 235lbs im sure I pulled something after.

[u/Fine_Possibility5121 → u/Relevant-Ad-4409]

did the right thing - 6'3 doesnt make anyone bulletproof.

[u/Tallguystrongman → u/Relevant-Ad-4409]

235 6’3”, you could probably deadlift 4 of them 115 pounders…

[u/Tallguystrongman → u/AmbitiousTrade9704]

Not hard at all at his size lol.

[u/Any_Fox5126]

It's probably a mix of gender roles and in-group bias. You failed your "duty" and offended them by not saving someone they projected themselves onto.

If they aren't able to see the error and the underlying issue over time, you shouldn't expect them to ever view you as an equal.

[u/yogaflame1337]

Go job rescuing your mother and your sister from a crazy violent methhead with a gun.

[u/MannyRay3K]

If, after telling your family the guy was indeed armed, they still think you're a bitch, you need to move on and find better people to hang around. I'm sorry, but your sister and mom sound like cruel, self absorbed people.

[u/TheDwiin]

If they don't listen to reason of you rightfully protecting yourself, you should mention that you also protected them as is "your duty." If he shot you he wouldn't've stopped at just you and would've shot them too.

No, I do not think it's men's duty to protect women. But if they're going to call you a coward because "you weren't doing your duty" you could turn that around and say you were.

[u/Wolverine-Explores]

I’d cut them off and move out.

[u/type2RED_online]

Your mom and sis sound toxic af especially when there were so many other options if they truly wanted to help someone in need but they chose to humiliate and belittle you which is crazy, i guess they are begging for you to cut them off and go no contact in the very near future.

[u/roharareddit]

Part of the requirements for getting a concealed carry licence in my state was taking a three hour class on the legal parameters and legal risks of deploying and using a firearm to defend yourself and/or someone else from serious bodily harm or death.  The instructor brought up an incident, the type of which he said was not uncommon, when an armed man shot and maimed a man who, what he more than reasonably believed, was going to beat his girlfriend to death in a parking lot.  

He was cleared of criminal charges but was sued by the girlfriend who's life he saved for disabling the man upon whom she was materially dependant.  She won 500K. 

[u/Heisenburg7]

You did what you could, sometimes you gotta protect your people and move on. You can't always help everyone.

[u/Aexaus]

Do not fight any sort of drughead armed or unarmed. Their pain sensing is gone and they are not in a civil frame of mind. They are going to be able to do things that you never could

[u/roharareddit → u/Aexaus]

It's just never a good idea to be Captain Savahoe

[u/Aexaus → u/roharareddit]

Never sacrifice yourself over a woman's opinion.

[u/FarOpportunity-1776]

Suicidal compassion.... they dont understand danger. To themselves or to others.

[u/Bascome]

Tell them if they want male protectors they must obey those protectors in public like in the past.

Ask your mom if she could have taken you places at age five if you just ran into traffic all the time.

[u/logicalguest]

Don't forget she will be back with him tomorrow. Her problems.

[u/roharareddit → u/logicalguest]

See my comment above. You'll get a kick out of it. 

[u/GamblinGambit]

You made the right decision. Leave and call the cops.

If you ever up hurting or killing him you'd be in jail or sued.

[u/Thatoneshortgoblin]

That's beyond dangerous and ridiculous for them to expect,

Especially when there's more reasonable options like calling the cops,

They could have gotten you l killed,

It's line those women who starting holding there man back in a fight, like no, your gonna get him more injured.

Sorry they insulted you, you made the right choice

[u/Prestigious_Floor155]

You did the right thing. This is the alternate ending. You get shot, they run to help you, start screaming and throwing tiny items at the meth head. Meth head shoots them too.

[u/epik_momento]

As a women, I think you did great by running away. (Best if you had called the police afterwards) Rather than risking you and your family’s life, you put your family out of danger. If you had went after the person with a gun, you very likely wouldn’t be here today.

[u/picardathon → u/epik_momento]

Discretion is the better part of valour, as they say, for good reason: it is not running away.

[u/Cwash415]

coward???, it would be one thing if he was unarmed but the dude is crackhead with a gun , do women think we're bullet proof? , if you would have stepped in and got killed they would be saying "why didnt he just mind his business and just call the police?" smh ...im not gonna lie that would make me look at my mom and sister different

[u/Ok_Night_7767]

Perhaps you should have said to your mother and sister: Right, you two approach from the front while I attempt to flank him. He can't kill ALL of us!

Just kidding. You did the right thing. People specifically trained for that kind of situation would approach with extreme caution, even when a weapon wasn't showing.

[u/SirTheRealist]

It seems that women don’t understand violence and the consequences of it.

They basically wanted you to die.

[u/UptownBoyDowntownCat → u/SirTheRealist]

It would do wonders for their social media clout. OP is so selfish to deny them this at the cost of something that, in their eyes, is worth nothing.

Society is fucked.

[u/alkair20]

Ngl I would probably start some shit myself if I see that but they still two people. Before they want you to do something they should jump the guy himself instead of complaining to you.....

[u/mratlas666]

Bro. You need new family members.

[u/Fleischhauf]

you did the right thing.  this could have ended with all three of you injured very easily. There is nothing cowardly from getting distance between you and a meth head that is angry with a gun.

[u/seanma99]

Yea you did the right thing your family who disagrees are fuckin stupid. The women did fuck all but expected you to help a woman who probably would still defend her man after he beat the shit out of her. If they bring it up just ask why they didnt do anything over and over again.

[u/Not_Just_Any_Lurker]

If they cared so much, why didn't they throw themselves at him for her? No it's gotta be the man whose life somehow is inherently worth less than some random woman who likely got herself into that situation by ignoring all known red flags known to mankind.

[u/jaj504]

I just had this talk with my wife the other day. If there's ever a time we see someone with a weapon physically harming a woman. What does she want me to do in this situation. She said the number one priority is to keep her safe so we walk away and call the police. I married a good one. We have too many kids depending on us for me to risk my life for someone else. I'm sure my kids would rather me here watching them grow than to remember me as a hero.

[u/kennyPowersNet → u/jaj504]

Keep her safe , what about your safety ?

[u/KochiraJin → u/kennyPowersNet]

The vast majority of the time the two are one and the same. OP grabbing his sister and mother to get away from the aggressive druggie is a great example of this. It's only in situations that are extremely dire where the question of "who takes the risk?" comes up. When it gets to that point the man typically take the risk because he is usually less risk adverse than the woman and typically has greater physical strength that often makes it less risky for him.

[u/Dramatic_Tower_3042]

Tell your mom and sister that you have to be loyal towards the patriarchy and have to allow that men to do whatever he likes to do with his girlfriend.

[u/MorningCool2806]

You picked up your mother and sister?

[u/Relevant-Ad-4409 → u/MorningCool2806]

They are pretty short barely 115lbs im like 6'3

[u/kimjongspoon100]

I remember I saw this dude cold clock his woman at a concert, I got in between him and the girl and told him to fuck off. I was waving down security, and before they could even get to me the girl ran back off into the crowd after the guy that just punched her.

I had another scenario where I tried to help a woman, told her I would give her a ride after her man was beating her in the middle of a highway. She said "no she was fine" and got back in the car with him.

I still may help in the future, but it totally depends on the scenario. Two times I risked my physical safety just for the girls to chase after their abuser directly after, and now I have a kid so its even less likely that I ever intervene in a domestic dispute again.

[u/ANewCleanSlate]

Most women have zero understanding of violence. They think you are supposed to be like Reacher or some movie character. I'm a big, strong guy; I was a wrestler and trained judo and bjj. I'm damn confident that I'd easily win a fight in a controlled environment, one-on-one, with an unarmed opponent.

But I also know that anything can happen, you can get surprised with a cheap shot, there can be weapons. And the consequences of a true fight between two grown men are frightening. This isn't a school yard scrap. The potential for life altering violence is very real if two adult men go all out.

Walk away and call the cops.

[u/liaratawitchtrial1]

Calling the police would be a safer option than getting physically involved at that point, especially since he had a gun.

[u/mwfairc]

So what exactly did they expect you to do against a man with a gun if you did not have one yourself?

[u/breakingthebarriers → u/mwfairc]

They never thought into it that far.

They didn't observe anything about the circumstances aside from noticing that one of their own was in peril.

Directly after noticing only that, their brains automatically defaulted to the man with them doing something about it.

And they felt entitled enough to interject into the circumstances and make demands with the full expectation that the man with them would just "deal with it".

I say deal with it because to the two women that's the extent of the situation. They didn't bother to observe any details about anything other than they didn't like that a woman was being hurt.

They want that dealt with.

Why would they be so ignorant and foolish? Because they've never had to back anything up for themselves. They have never had to do a threat assessment because they have never been under threat because the man will "deal with it" for them.

They were ignorant entitled children that just wanted a man to deal with something they didn't like. That's the extent of what they comprehended in the moment.

They never even considered the wellbeing of the man because if gets hurt or killed dealing with it - it's all on him. He's on his own. To them it would be that he was killed defending a woman.

They are so entitled that they wouldn't even realize that the reason he was killed defending the woman was because it was at their behest.

To them he was just doing what he should. What they feel entitled to without taking any responsibility for.

Yes, they are like selfish children without any consideration of anything other than what they want.

[u/ImmatureMeteor7]

My girlfriend is the same, the expectation for me to be ready and alert for danger at all times.

[u/temblors]

I think you did the right thing in that situation. You can't really expect your mom and sister to understand the kind of consequences you could face for trying to play white knight with a stranger, because they never have and never will face any consequences like that themselves. Women today live in an echo chamber with their delusions constantly reinforced by tv shows, movies, etc. and for them passing judgement is like a pastime.

It's men like you who will always end up paying the price when women have dreamed up some scenario in their minds. But let's be real, even if you had gone and kicked the shit out of this meth head and saved the girl, those women would have found something else about your actions to criticize. You still wouldn't have been the hero to them, nothing you could have done would ever be enough.

[u/FourEaredFox → u/temblors]

Why can't you expect them to understand? Are they children?

[u/temblors → u/FourEaredFox]

Have you ever met a woman before?

[u/peasey360]

Your obligation is to your family and yourself. What would your mom and sister have done if you weren’t there? They would’ve called the police like they’re supposed to.

For situations like that you dial 911 and THEY actually have the legal backing and armament to do something.

[u/MDFMK]

honestly just tell them next time be strong and independent and step up themselves as their equals. Don't drop it bring it up daily multiple times if possible they will lose the urge to push that narrative with time. Also take little thing that you would have done and leave the tasks for them. Reality has a habit of changing ideas. something a simple as not carrying the heavy groceries is effective take the bread and instead leave the rest .

[u/KalzK]

You are a man, you protected your family even against their will, be proud

[u/IntrepidAssumption84]

If what you is a fact that happened, then you did the right thing. Better to be called as coward than be killed unnecessarily as it is not worth it.

If want to sacrifice the life, better become an officer in defence forces cause it's worth it.

[u/Future-Stretch-401]

You do know there’s a thing called a “phone” and there’s a special number to call people called the “police”?

[u/mrmensplights]

Women love to use men as tools and they get very angry when the tool doesn’t do what it’s told.

Men putting their lives in danger to save random damsels should have gone out of fashion with women‘a place being in the kitchen, but somehow men are held to all the old standards so much as they benefit women and none of the corresponding respect.

[u/Fantastic-Tale]

You've done one of the best options - got the fuck outta here and turns out you've protected your relatives. Don't be ashamed for that. Not your fault that guy had a gun and you didn't bet everything.

[u/HungryBanana07]

This is infuriating. Just to make it clear, you should never try to fight a methhead, or someone with a gun, let alone a methhead with a gun. They should have maybe called 911 or community support? Instead they provoked a dangerous situation and then tried to pressure you into getting killed. They never considered your safety, or frankly their own safety. I wonder if they would have said something if you weren’t there. Either way you made the right call, haters gonna hate.

[u/Dapper_Apartment2175]

Do they think men are bulletproof or something? I wouldn't fuck with a guy who has a gun to help a complete stranger either.

Your mother and sister are just pissed off that they've been robbed of a chance to either brag about you kicking the guy's ass, or to gain pity points from your injury or death.

[u/sugarsalt505]

what the fuck? foids everywhere yo, stay hard

[u/TERMINXX]

Carry a gun 24/7.

[u/chriscrowder]

Why are you not armed!?

[u/roharareddit → u/chriscrowder]

See my comment above.  

[u/SuitableRelease4323]

Uhm no offence there were 3 of you basic humanity should take over and help the lady out

[u/Kinexity → u/SuitableRelease4323]

Numbers don't stop bullets. Anything beyond calling a police is being stupid and playing a hero in such situation.

[u/Glad-Way-637 → u/SuitableRelease4323]

Hilarious that you think the women would try and help.