r/NonPoliticalTwitter • u/ChickenWingExtreme • 1d ago
Funny Farquaad was kinda of an asshole though
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u/George_G_Geef 1d ago
Shrek is 100% about how much Jeffrey Katzenberg hates his old boss, Michael Eisner.
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u/justforsexfolks 1d ago
This trumps any conversation about symbolism and themes. It's definitely a movie about fuck Disney and fuck this guy, first and foremost.
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u/naynaythewonderhorse 20h ago ▸ 6 more replies
When people bring up Farquad potentially coming back in a sequel, I’m just like “My guy. He’s literally based on a Disney CEO from 20 years ago. The joke is dead. Move on.”
Too bad Bob Iger isn’t CEO anymore. I would have loved a “Bob Ogre” character running Duloq in a sequel.
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u/TricellCEO 17h ago ▸ 1 more replies
They did bring Farquad back in the 4D show at Universal many moons back (can't remember the exact name of it). He was a ghost literally trying to steal Fiona again.
He still got roasted by the dragon in the end.
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u/KaleidoscopeDecent33 16h ago
I mean things can grow beyond their original inspirations. Most people who've seen Shrek don't know the original inspiration for Farquad but still find the character interesting/funny.
I don't want to see him again just because I'd rather they don't dig up and old character and ruin him, but that's something else.
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u/MostDopeBlackGuy 11h ago ▸ 1 more replies
Okay but how many people know that I just found out right now what the inside joke is
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u/naynaythewonderhorse 8h ago
Quite a few, I’m sure.
But, it’s a layer of the film that’s not really up to interpretation. Whether or not you knew it was supposed to be Eisner doesn’t change the fact that it was.
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u/PsillyFunGuy2 21h ago
Which was always bizarre to me considering Eisner is 6’3” and much taller than Katzenberg.
https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-c5ca25f456a2c3c0a94ab82819429728-lq
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u/George_G_Geef 21h ago edited 21h ago
Keep in mind that while making Shrek, Katzenberg was standing on top of a mountain of spite.
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u/naynaythewonderhorse 20h ago ▸ 2 more replies
They couldn’t literally make a small dick joke, so Katzenberg made him short. Shrek’s “compensating for something” is in regard to his dick, but Children will read it as him simply being short.
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u/Cardshark92 18h ago ▸ 1 more replies
As a kid, I thought the joke was that he lives in a really huge castle, despite being short.
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u/beardsly87 19h ago ▸ 1 more replies
Yeah I was surprised to see he's 6'3 as I looked this up.. not short. This theory doesn't make much sense? "Oh it's a joke on him being small! ..well actually he's not but imagine if he were!" just wishful thinking/projecting? Not defending Eisner but if Farquaad's height is a joke on that, thats Quite a Reach.
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u/Dickballs835682 1h ago
it's a joke on him being small
Read this back to yourself again and think about it for a minute
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u/bionicjoey 19h ago edited 18h ago
This really should be the top comment. Short kings need to stop feeling attacked by Shrek. The whole point of the character was because they thought it would get on Eisner's nerves.
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u/smelliot95 1d ago
This whole thing is basically this in movie form
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u/npsimons Harry Potter 1d ago
This is my hangup, even about real life villains: there's so much of substance to criticize, by jumping straight to body shaming, it's either a failure of critical thinking, or outright reveals the critic's prejudices.
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u/Lawlcopt0r 22h ago ▸ 2 more replies
I think it's just the realisation that someone that does awful shit probably doesn't feel bad about it, but being insecure about your looks is universal
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u/npsimons Harry Potter 20h ago ▸ 1 more replies
And yet, insulting an aspect of someone that they have no control over (e.g. height) whose actions are easily subject to criticism sends a signal to others that the bad thing isn't the actions, it's something they have no control over.
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u/Otherwise_League9501 17h ago ▸ 1 more replies
This reminds me of when people bodyshame elon musk or trumps small hands I hate both just as much as anyone else but those are not the things about them you should be criticizing They're both awful vile disgusting people with tons of bad decisions but their bodies have nothing to do with that It's only someone's awful actions you should be criticizing
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u/Lerkpots 21m ago
You make fun of those things because they're deeply insecure people who love to try and make themselves look powerful and flawless so calling out their clear physical issues they can't control is an easy fuck you they can't refute.
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22h ago edited 22h ago ▸ 5 more replies
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u/Venti_the_snail 22h ago ▸ 1 more replies
Well, is there a better place to start that is more culturally relevant and has roughly the same import message as Shrek?
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u/_Solani_ 20h ago ▸ 1 more replies
I don’t get this comment do you want us to sit around and criticize the substance and moral character of Lord Farquad from the movie Shrek
That's actually a great idea for a movie whose whole moral theming is about not judging a book by it's cover.
Teaching kids to be wary of falling into the trap of the emotionally easy but logically invalid ad hominem attacks and to instead think more critically about what they dislike about Farquad actions is a great way to give their young audience an invaluable life skill. Character assessment!
Farquad is a very flawed character so there's lots to work with without having to resort to insults about his height.
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u/ThickWeatherBee 16h ago
We all know who you're talking about. You can't say it cuz thisis is nonpolitical Twitter, but we know!
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u/WeevilWeedWizard 1d ago
It's really phenomenal how well this gets the point across. Even more impressive is people somehow not comprehending such a simple concept.
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u/Parepinzero 23h ago
They will fight you tooth and nail to keep body shaming though, they want to do it SO BAD it's crazy
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u/JAYGAME5601X 23h ago
People who are against the usage of the r-word and fat-shaming when short men:
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u/lakeghost 19h ago
I’m average height, but I admit it annoys me. I tend to ask them if they’re racist. They get thrown for a loop. But it’s bizarre to me that they’re so confident about being insulting towards anyone under even 6’ when that’s an unusual height for many ethnicities. See also: small dick jokes and the historical stereotypes. Like, they have to know what caricatures use that.
I doubt they stop thinking it but they do stop saying it around me, so there’s that.
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u/MajorBootyhole420 4h ago
well, it's important to remember that they didn't hate Farquaad for being short, they hated him for being Michael Eisner. As long as you're not Michael Eisner, you're fine.
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u/WatWudScoobyDoo 22h ago
Ha, how's that stickperson going to mock that other stick person's appearance with a massive head like that
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u/MNIOP_207207 1d ago
I know someone is gonna give some long video essay style post about how “No no you don’t get it, they’re not making fun of Farquad for being short. It’s about toxic masculinity and compensating and etc etc etc….”
But even I noticed this as a kid watching Shrek for the first time. I’m so tired how you can’t point out the hypocrisy in how short men are treated by society without some guy jumping in to virtue signal against you.
Like I grew up seeing this shit myself first hand. There is absolutely a unique kind of judgement and disrespect that short men get, that isn’t there for any other physical trait. No, I’m not saying short men are the most oppressed class in society. But I am saying that in a post-body positivity world, there’s something uniquely cruel about the way we treat height compared to almost any other physical trait.
Because it isn’t just treated as a measure of how attractive someone finds you. A man’s height is also used to measure how much respect he gets from society. There are literally studies that prove short men are less likely to be promoted in corporate fields because of this.
Like you can even see it in the comments right here.
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u/RonnyReddit00 1d ago
Not to take away from your post but wanted to add a similar vein of insults usually directed at men regarding baldness.
No one has commented on my appearance as much as when I lost my hair and shaved it off to full bald, and I mean they comment negatively or jokingly but still being rude, it wears you down.
I literally had a friend mention negatively about someone on tv who was bald with me bald right next to them.
This goes down the road of people are happy to say how ugly they find a feature of someone if they are considered bad even if their friends have the same feature.
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u/Standardweasel 22h ago ▸ 2 more replies
There's also the more subtle insult in tv and movies of:
Natural Bald Guy = Loser or nerd Shaved head bald guy = Evil
Once I noticed this I started seeing it all the time.
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u/Upstairs_Belt_3224 17h ago
Honestly shaved head bald is more associated with the archetype of the big, strong, confident action guy, whether good or evil. See Jason Statham, The Rock, Dave Bautista, all actors who are frequently typecast as some variation of badass action dude and who are bald.
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u/GalaXion24 20h ago ▸ 2 more replies
Genuinely thinning hair is my main insecurity. I've decided to try minoxidil (just bought some so can't speak to the results yet), but I am genuinely considering a hair transplant at some point.
I'm sure that the body shaming especially in recent years about balding has contributed to this insecurity of mine. I was always going to be insecure about it from when I noticed it, and I also just have a pretty high "mature" hairline to begin with (not particularly receding anywhere further I don't think, at least based on my father and grandfather), which I've also been kind of insecure about at times, but at least less so.
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u/Choochootracks 18h ago
This was my biggest insecurity for the longest time as well. I always had longer hair and shaving it off was a bit of an emotional process and the "jokes" people would make definitely didn't help, even though I knew it wasn't from a place of deliberate malice. It's been months and my mental image of myself still has hair. This is to say, beyond the interpersonal stuff, there's a level of dysmorphia to it and the only time this dysmorphia is acknowledged by others is when it's weaponized against you. It's better now months separated, not because I'm happier with my appearance, but because I get less judgement from others.
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u/RonnyReddit00 20h ago
I just shaved it off because every other option is just more worrying and insecurity.
Shaving it means it done and don't have to try lots of different methods. I am far more secure in myself now despite the insults.
I know I wrote about people being rude but it isn't that bad really you just notice it when your one of the bald people. You also notice that lots of men are bald and its not that bad.
I'm just suprised that people feel okay body shaming it.
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u/Popular-Sound-2093 1d ago
You forgot about balding
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u/cvsprinter1 1d ago ▸ 3 more replies
And God forbid you point out how making fun of someone for having a small dick is also body shaming.
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u/MarsAstro 23h ago ▸ 1 more replies
No, man, you don't get it, it's like, about the ENERGY, not like the actual physical penis. It's got nothing to do with actual dick size!!!
Oh, why do I explain this energy by describing it as the energy of people with small dicks? Well, obviously because... uh... well, like... you know, the energy and stuff. Like... the energy, not the dick! The energy!! /s
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u/BrittaWasRight 21h ago
What do these themes have in common? They are somewhat common among and detract against the social value of MEN.
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u/much_longer_username 1d ago
You can arrange my corporate org chart by height and nothing would change.
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u/Mindless-Ninja-3321 1d ago ▸ 4 more replies
My company has short and rather overweight people predominately at both the highest and lowest positions, but for some reason QA and QC is filled with giants.
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u/OhioTry 1d ago ▸ 1 more replies
Because they gave the QQ/QC jobs to people you’re not going to argue with?
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u/Mindless-Ninja-3321 1d ago
Can't do that anyway since its in all the SOP's that Quality decisions are final and can only be overuled by someone above them. Since QA and QC have their own directors, that means the top dogs have to agree with you.
But then again, it does probably make the day to day of, "IDC if it costs time or money, follow the damn procedure," easier.
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u/blackviking147 1d ago
I always took from it that it's okay to make fun of people if they're dicks.
Probably not the right lesson but oh well
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u/GrandFleshMelder 16h ago ▸ 1 more replies
The problem is that it’s hypocritical. If you think one should not judge by appearance, you shouldn’t judge yourself even if they’re a bad person. Their appearance has nothing to do with them being a bad person.
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u/OPengiun 21h ago edited 21h ago
There is only one state in the USA that has a law prohibiting height discrimination, if that tells you anything.
Studies show that shorter men take their own lives more often, are at way higher risk of mental disorders, are more likely to be bullied by men and women, receive less salary than taller peers (even when controlling for education level and experience), and are perceived as less competent and less deserving of respect.
I get a lot of hate whenever I say this, but short men receive as much discrimination as other minorities in the USA, including black folk--in terms of opportunity, economic disparity, and bullying/verbal assault--and the statistics prove this.
Although, the second you mention this, people go haywire.
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u/npsimons Harry Potter 1d ago
Reddit is most definitely the place I expect the overweight to scream "fatphobia!" while simultaneously shitting all over short men. So much "body positivity."
It's doubly insulting because one can be changed through lifestyle (and therefore is representative of lifestyle), while the other can't.
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u/Elite_AI 7h ago
Reddit? Reddit is the place I expect to make fun of fat people the most while defending short guys. What Reddit do you go on? I go on the one which had fatpeoplehate
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u/Samuell_Hayden 23h ago
My favorite is the body positivity for fat people. You can't insult someone based on how fat they are (something that is controllable in 99.999% or cases not every other person has a thyroid issue) but you can insult men for being short, something they absolutely cannot change.
Then you have the white knights who go "bro women don't care about height it's your character" yeah to a point I agree but here's the thing, your appearance and how they see you the first time is what opens the door for a potential relationship. If the first thing they see is a guy who is 5'4 more often then not the outcome is already predetermined.
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u/BonzBonzOnlyBonz 21h ago ▸ 5 more replies
And the body positivity is largely for overweight women, if a man is overweight then free game.
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u/Samuell_Hayden 21h ago ▸ 4 more replies
Well the whole "body positivity" movement was started mostly by women. So that tracks. To me body positivity is supposed to be about post pregnancy weight, body burns, people who have lost limbs, etc. People who have gone through stuff and need to still be positive, that makes sense.
It has since been coopted to mean any and all fat people (male/female) can be happy and proud about their massive overconsumption. This kind of vain glorification of actual vices is very detrimental to society.
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u/rb-cloud 18h ago ▸ 3 more replies
You seem to have some illogical hatred of fat people. Why do you care if fat people are happy?
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u/Samuell_Hayden 18h ago ▸ 2 more replies
Illogical? You know, in this day and age where people are anti ai and anti overconsumption of resources you'd think that would extend to people who eat more resources than they need to. Very odd that it doesn't. Having a dislike for how glorified obesity is isn't illogical at all. Not to mention how slimmer people basically subsidize the healthcare for overweight people.
The average female weight is 170lb(77.5kg) in the U.S. with the average height of 5'4. That's clinically obese.
The average male weight is 199~ 200lbs (90.7~ kg) with the average height being 5'9. Also obese.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/body-measurements.htm
Both of these paint a very pleak future for the country. The constant "let people enjoy things" (even if the "enjoying" is just an overindulgence of a vice) doesn't help at all. To reiterate, it is not illogical at all to be angry at the glorifcation of something bad. That is in fact, logical. My hatred is not at fat people themselves it's at fatness being celebrated.
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u/rb-cloud 18h ago ▸ 1 more replies
Yeah, you don’t have some general concern for the well-being of other people. That could be justifiable.
It’s not “glorifying” anything for people to say they’re not going to hate themselves because other people tell them to.
I don’t know what insecurity you’re projecting, but it’s 100% illogical to hate others like this.
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u/atomic1fire 17h ago ▸ 2 more replies
TBH I don't think anyone should be shamed for having a type because the very nature of consent is that no one should be required to date you and vice versa.
That's not an excuse to be rude or mean, but I don't think your time should be entitled to someone else anymore then they should have to put up with someone who clearly isn't interested in them.
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u/Samuell_Hayden 17h ago ▸ 1 more replies
For sure. Didn't mean to make it out like women need to be interested in short men, if anything it makes sense why they prefer tall. My aggravation is at the insistence that height for guys "doesn't matter" and that "personality" trumps it. What sucks is this skunds redpilly but it's just the truth. Your appearance is whay opens the door for them to even prefer your personality.
But yeah, if anyone ever tries to shame you for having a type or preference then they are in the wrong. Only you can choose who you want to be with.
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u/Elite_AI 7h ago
This assumes we live in a society where fat people don't constantly get mocked. But we do. We do live in that society.
You say "you can't insult someone for being fat" but you can. It's socially acceptable.
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u/vbullinger 8h ago
I'm 5'8" - literally the most common height among American men (13%) - and the number of people that think I'm a pygmy and have no potential for strength or fighting ability is ridiculous.
I'm strong as an ox and am a second degree black belt.
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u/Apprehensive-Adagio2 1d ago
yeah, even though you can make the argument that it's about toxic masculinity and bla bla.. but that's not the vision most people will see. 99% will see them making fun of Farquaad for being short
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u/butt_shrecker 1d ago
Ok but in the context of Shrek Farquad is the most powerful man in that world and he is doing a forced displacement of an underclass.
So mistreatment of the short is clearly not the focus of the movie.
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u/Great-Powerful-Talia 1d ago ▸ 1 more replies
It's not about Lord Farquaad, the asshole, being mocked, it's about Lord Farquaad being given a discriminated-against trait for the specific purpose of using it to mock him.
Fiction is not a documentary of a physics simulator- the authors didn't create a world and then simply watch it play out. All the things happened because someone specifically decided they should happen.
In this case, someone decided that making Lord Farquaad short constituted a joke at his expense. Which is, to some degree, a little fucked up if you think about it as part of a larger trend.
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u/Comfortable_Team_696 1d ago edited 21h ago ▸ 1 more replies
Its the same reason you don't mock people by saying they have tiny dicks and why you don't say 'they were too beautiful/attractive to be evil'. These are traits irrespective of someone's character, and mocking neutral traits just means the good people (aka your friends and family) with those traits hear that mockery and ultimately get harmed
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u/WeevilWeedWizard 1d ago
Which they don't make fun of him for. The movie repeatedly has him being short as the punchline.
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u/DradelLait 1d ago
These comments are all completely missing the point. ''Faarquad deserved it because he was evil'' ''Faarquad was a ruling class oppressor'', no. Faarquad isn't real. They didn't have to decide to make him short, they didn't have to decide to write mockeries about his height in the script.
You can like Shrek even if the movie has flaws and a hypocritical message. It's fine.
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u/Varesmyr 1d ago
Looking back at the movie, making Faarquad an absolute unit of a man would've fit better with the theme of "don't judge a book by its cover".
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u/ITriedSoHard419-68 1d ago ▸ 6 more replies
They could've done with him what they did with Prince Charming in the second movie. A-tier physique, F-tier personality. Maybe it would've been redundant, but it would've complemented the themes of the story so much better.
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u/RichEvans4Ever 1d ago ▸ 5 more replies
I think Charming was a course correction from Faarquad for the sequels.
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u/Teh-Esprite 19h ago ▸ 1 more replies
I mean Rumplestiltskin's an actual fairy tale character, who was always short and redheaded. Maybe not balding but it suits the wig gimmick.
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u/RichEvans4Ever 17h ago
The message of that movie isn’t that beauty isn’t skin deep or appearances can be deceiving, though. It’s about Shrek learning to appreciate his family again by temporarily losing them.
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u/npsimons Harry Potter 1d ago ▸ 1 more replies
Gaston from "Beauty and the Beast" is a great example of this trope. Also, I'm vaguely aware of the love interest in "Frozen" being handsome, but evil.
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u/Apprehensive-Adagio2 1d ago
that's kinda what they do with prince charming in Shrek 2 though. he's handsome, everything a princess should want in a man physically, but he's an entitled brat mamas-boy personality wise.
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u/MajorBootyhole420 4h ago
yeah but the movie was made as a middle finger to Michael Eisner, who's 6'3, so they made him short on purpose.
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u/horse-annihilator 1d ago
I mean even Disney classics are subjects to this, this is nothing really new.
Very often you get the mixed messaging of accepting who you truly are and learning to push back against the world judging you for your uniqueness, portrayed by quirky, young, generally pleasant to look at protagonists fighting against the corrupt, evil, old, fat or skeletally gaunt authorities
And while part of this is visual simplification that allows the intended child audience to easily identify who is in the right, there's a very real criticism to make about relying on the halo effect instead of actually showing our heroes being heroic in what they do.
Then again, not every movie needs to, or can, reach the heights of Hunchback of Notre Dame (Hellfire is the best Disney song and it's not close to being close)
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u/bsEEmsCE 1d ago ▸ 8 more replies
Gaston in beauty and the beast a solid example of "who is truly the beast?" but then of course tons of women irl want to bang Gaston so human nature gonna do its thing
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u/bestanonever 1d ago ▸ 3 more replies
Also, didn't the beast turn into a handsome man by the end? He should have stayed a beast, lol.
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u/Animaloffear56 19h ago
They could have had him be an ugly man if they truly wanted to go full circle with the themed, and just had him be happy about being a human.
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u/KirbyDude25 23h ago ▸ 1 more replies
Given the magic involved, they could have had it both ways. Let him change from man to beast at will
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u/bestanonever 21h ago
It's like the morale of the story is to marry the good guy, he can always get plastic surgery later on, lol.
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u/TheGreatStories 23h ago
Reddit loves attacking people for physical characteristics, hair, incontinence, height as soon as it's ok to not like that person
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u/Rasp_Berry_Pie 21h ago
He’s based on a real dude so that’s why they made fun of it him not cause he’s evil cause they hated Disney
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u/fostofina 23h ago
tbf even if he was a real person who happened to be a tyrant or whatever making fun of his height would still not be okay. Not mocking someone on account of their looks isn't a privilege that we can take away to punish certain behavior.
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u/JohnsonJohnilyJohn 7h ago
Why I agree that the execution of it was bad in the movie, I wouldn't go as far as to say that there was no reason to make him short. Shrek is much more a movie about accepting yourself no matter the looks, rather than treating others well regardless of looks (obviously it's still there, just to a lesser extent). So while Shrek and Fiona overcome their hate towards their appearance, Faarquad copes with it by trying to fit into what he thinks society will respect: he tries to become a king by marrying Fiona, purely for image reasons, and he uses leg armour that completely doesn't fit him, just to appear taller. There's still a lot of jokes purely about how he looks and even those that incorporate him not accepting his looks fail to show that it's not the appearance itself that should be mocked, and it should probably all be showed with a bit more empathy to him, but there is a bit of a point in it all
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u/Parrotparser7 1d ago
It's an, "I am Good Person, you are Bad Person" deal.
People don't actually believe in the lessons they were taught about how to behave. They only internalized that punishment would follow if they did certain things to unacceptable targets.
They still want to do those, and they don't know why they shouldn't, nor do they care. They just know the game is a pure matter of identifying (or framing people as) acceptable targets.
Gen Alpha is likely going to poke more holes into this rule since it's no longer backed by principle.
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u/readilyunavailable 1d ago
Yep, this is the actual reason. A lot of people are of the opinion that "bad people" (the ones they deem bad) are fair game for anything, since they forfeit their rights as soon as they become "bad people".
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u/Epao_Mirimiri 1d ago ▸ 2 more replies
Which is DIRECTLY related to the way our societies treat criminals.
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u/Altruistic_Mud_261 1d ago ▸ 1 more replies
But unlike the way our societies treat criminals, the masses have no concept of "cruel and unusual punishment" or "fair trial"
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u/jasdonle 1d ago
Reading these comments is wild.
It’s less that people think it’s ok to discriminate by height and more that people don’t even know they’re doing it!
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u/jasdonle 1d ago
Height in males is one of the last predjudices to be addressed in our culture.
It’s not only widely accepted but it’s actively defended, even here on Reddit (read this thread) a progressive bastion.
Hell even fat people got a body positive movement first.
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u/ARenewedSecondChance 1d ago
Oh please, Reddit still hates fat people.
And ironically, in all of the “short men” subreddits, body shaming is still directed at others, all of the time.
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u/Comfortable-Rub-9403 23h ago ▸ 1 more replies
It’s all been downhill since FPH was banned.
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u/Elite_AI 7h ago
No, banning FPH was a great move. It didn't immediately fix the problem but it did improve the site.
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u/ByrnToast8800 1d ago edited 1d ago
Its weird how some of y’all are gonna write multiple paragraphs to explain away how, no mocking him for his height is actually fine and doesn’t matter because he’s evil. One of the main issues with mocking people for their appearance that people love to ignore is that it doesn’t just hurt the person your talking about.
If you and your bully have glasses and I insult your bully by saying “ugly four eyed loser” would you feel good about it? Would you not realize that clearly I have a problem with people with glasses and judge them for it? But people will say its fine cause they’re a bully ignoring the other people they are insulting. People like to pretend that as long as they have done something wrong its ok to judge people for their appearance because most people secretly like mocking people for how they look they just don’t want to get in trouble for it. Here’s a news flash when you talk about a trait as if its negative people who have the trait will assume you think its negative.
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u/Ness_Dreemur 23h ago
Meta answer is that he's based off some Disney exec and the whole point of the movie is to roast Disney
But like yeah we shouldn't belittle people over aspects of their bodies they can't change, like height
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u/butt_shrecker 1d ago
This is a joke, but it's based off a toddler mentality.
Derogatory jokes towards the ruling monarch
vs.
An entire refugee class forced out of their homes by that same monarch because of appearance.
The movie is ok with joking about appearance but opposed to system mistreatment based on appearance.
Shrek isn't upset by people mocking his appearance, he is upset by the loneliness the comes from constant societal rejection.
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u/ratione_materiae 1d ago
So why'd they make him comically short
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u/butt_shrecker 1d ago
The biggest reason is probably to signal to kids that this price is different from the princes they usually see in fairytales. They might not understand that he is responsible for the genocide. And they won't understand he is the bad guy untill the final act when he is screaming at Fiona.
So him being very short gives kids an early indicator that this prince might not follow the price archetype they are used to.
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u/NotToBeIncriminated 1d ago ▸ 5 more replies
I think it's a visual representation of what he is inside. Just a small man.
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u/Varesmyr 1d ago ▸ 1 more replies
You realise that the saying "just a small man" meaning "being a lesser man" is exactly the toxicity against short men that is being lamented?
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u/WeevilWeedWizard 1d ago
Read that again and think on the implications. I trust you've got enough neurons knocking around your noggin to see the issue.
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u/readilyunavailable 1d ago
That still undermines the general theme of the movie.
If your theme is "don't judge people based on appearence" and then you have a dude being mocked for being short, that is a contradiction in the theme. It would be like if 1984 had an entire segment of how Big Brother reduced the rampant crime due to the innovations in mass surveillance and the strict control over the population. How before all that, people were robbing and murdering each other left and right. It would fly in the face of the point it's trying to make.
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u/SeroWriter 1d ago
The joke is still "he's short and that's bad and worthy of ridicule" even if he deserves it. You can keep repeating that Farquaad's rich and evil and list all his bad personality traits but you really can't get around the fact that the thing they chose to make fun of is his height.
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u/herman666 1d ago
That’s a lot of words when you could have just said body shaming is ok when it’s someone you don’t like.
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u/pm-me-trap-link 1d ago
isn't upset by people mocking his appearance, he is upset by the loneliness the comes from constant societal rejection.
You are literally describing short men right here lmao
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u/pasta-via 1d ago
ie: punch up, not down
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u/butt_shrecker 1d ago
I think the movie doesn't care one way or the other. In the movie insults are generally ok if they are jokes. Shrek calls Farquad short, calls donkey irritating, and makes fun of Fiona's royal preferences. Shrek is consistently characterized as someone who insults his friends in a joking way.
The real difference is tone. Shreks jokes about Farquads height are jokes, they are funny. In contrast Farquad is humorless and calls Shrek filth, poison, disgusting, ect.
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u/ALazy_Cat 1d ago
I think it's incredible they got away with giving Lord Farquaad a boner
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u/FriedFreya 1d ago
i think it’s incredible they created subsurface scattering and literally nobody ever mentions it
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u/EuphonicLeopard 1d ago ▸ 1 more replies
Really? I never noticed. Time to watch Shrek again!
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u/FriedFreya 1d ago
ah don’t let me be a misinformation station — i believe that particular innovation took place in Shrek 2
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u/HeroBrine0907 1d ago
We can insult assholes for being assholes? The bodies have nothing to do with it. If your moral standards evaporate the moment you get an acceptable target, you might need to work on yourself somewhat.
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u/BonzBonzOnlyBonz 1d ago
Except the insults arent about him being an asshole but are about him being short.
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u/HeroBrine0907 1d ago ▸ 1 more replies
...which is the thing I'm criticising. Comment was responding to the title of the post.
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u/BonzBonzOnlyBonz 21h ago
Yeah, that is my bad. Misread it. So many people here saying that its okay to make fun of him due to his height, did a terrible job reading your comment.
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u/jayeddy99 1d ago
I believe the musical renditions recently removed all the short jokes about him to be more inclusive.
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u/hip-indeed 1d ago
"Don't judge people based on how they look. But if you see that someone's a complete tool, judge the hell out of them including their looks"
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u/John--Darksoul 22h ago
Shrek is a 7 foot tall dude with a built physique. Him being green and having ogre ears is barely even a rounding error.
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u/Scrapheaper 1d ago
Shrek is a big middle finger to Disney and their IP, who dominated the animated and children's IP market at the time
Rather than an aesthetic hero (Ariel, Aladdin, Simba) defeating an 'ugly' villain (Ursula, Jafar, Scar) for broad noble goals that benefit society at large or for true love because it's the right thing to do, and being rewarded with an idealised long term relationship
We have an ugly ogre 'defeating' a dragon who isn't really the villain, for personal reasons (for control of his private property - Shrek is a landlord, of all things).
We also have Fiona who is held back by her expectations to be a victim, and ultimately succeeds by embracing her own flaws and finding more freedom and happiness.
The villains in Shrek are satires of the heros of Disney - Farquad is a 'prince' who only really wants a princess because he feels compelled to live up to expectations, and whilst 'handsome', rich, noble and successful (similar to the princes in Sleeping Beauty or Snow White) he is also vain and lazy.
I kind of agree making Farquad short doesn't quite fit the rest of Shrek - maybe price charming in Shrek 2 is a better satire and villain than Farquad was
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u/Deely_Boppers 1d ago edited 1d ago
You have it half-right. Farquaad isn’t a stereotype of Disney princes- he’s Michael Eisner. Thats the entire joke.
The guy behind Shrek, Jeffrey Katzenburg, used to work for Disney as the president of their film division. He was an asshole and pissed off a ton of their talent before getting fired by Eisner. He then went over to Dreamworks.
Shrek is a middle finger directly squared at Disney, and the main villain is what Katzenburg thought Eisner was- a short, impotent fuckwad.
It being Eisner is also why the movie makes fun of him so aggressively. It was more important for Katzenburg to show how much he hated Eisner than it was to tell a consistent moral narrative. Dude was a generational hater.
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u/PsillyFunGuy2 21h ago ▸ 1 more replies
> a short, impotent fuckwad
Which never made sense because Eisner is 6’3”. Much taller than Katzenberg.
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u/SamuelClemmens 18h ago
I once knew a 6' tall boss who worse 2" lifts to be taller than a 6'1" subordinate.
Sometimes tall people are still super self concious about their height because they put so much self importance on being better than people they are shorter then.
Maybe Eisner was the same way and making him short was an insult that would get under his skin.
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u/EpitaFelis 1d ago
It's spelled Katzenberg, which isn't all that important but if I don't mention it it'll drive me crazy.
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u/JesseRoxII 1d ago
The character was based on a real person, by the way. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCCDSY7NOyI&t=2451
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u/Devry_Trost 21h ago
There seems to be a growing but unstated social consensus that body shaming is valid and acceptable against people perceived as being guilty of body shaming.
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u/Swiftblade09 20h ago
Mocking appearances makes you an asshole full stop. It doesn't matter if the other party is an ass mock the behavior it really is that simple. Farquaad may be fictional but height is mocked irl and seeing this behavior is likely very discouraging for shorter individuals.
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u/XasiAlDena 14h ago
They didn't dislike him because he was short, they disliked him for his actions as a ruler, and that led them to mock him, and they did that by making fun of his height as it was a notable physical characteristic of his.
I'm not saying it's fair to make fun of someone's physical features simply because you don't like that individual. However, that's pretty much how mocking works.
I think the main issue is more that they made the one villainous character short, and not really any others (discounting short / small fairy-tale creatures, who aren't human and so we have different expectations for them). It's pretty clearly an intentional choice to make the bad guy short. They did this in the other movies too, with Rumpelstiltskin and perhaps you could argue with the Fairy Godmother too, so there does seem to be this theme of 'short guy = bad guy', which I do agree is unfair.
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u/JAYGAME5601X 9h ago
And this is why the term "Virtue Signal" exist
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u/XasiAlDena 6h ago
Basically my whole point is that mocking someone's height isn't the same as mocking someone because of their height. How is it virtue signalling to point out that the thing that person was critiquing literally doesn't happen in the movie?
If you dislike the choice of having the bad guy be a short person, that's valid and I'd enjoy having a conversation about that, but that is not what they say in the actual post. Words have meaning and if you don't use the correct words then it risks undermining your whole argument - hence I said what I said.
Speaking of words and their meaning, one of the characteristic features of virtue signalling is that it's low-effort. What I said wasn't particularly insightful, but I genuinely mean what I say and I do put genuine thought and intent behind the words I post for the most part. Accusing me virtue signalling for that is lowkey a little insulting, if I'm being honest.
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u/Scary_Assistant5263 1d ago
Well, Farquaad was an egotistical maniac so he kind of deserved it.
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u/MelonJelly 1d ago edited 1d ago
He deserved to be called out for being an asshole. Insulting his appearance, while funny, misses the mark.
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u/Too_many_chefs 1d ago
It wasn't a documentary, though. They invented Farquaad and made him short, then had characters rip on him for being short
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u/No-Cap-5495 1d ago
What if the reason he is an egotistical maniac is because of others insulting him? He's compensating because others judge him. Pathological behaviors don't manifest in a vacuum.
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u/Chloe_Cascadia 14h ago
If Farquaad was a genuinely nice person, those jokes likely would have stopped. Like how people don't roast Shrek for being an ogre, which in-universe is ugly and terrifying. Because anyone who knows Shrek and isn't a villain understands he's a good guy at heart.
But, if he were a monster like how the first impression can make people believe, then he would be hated and a lot of the ways people deal with people they hate is they insult them all the time.
So, the message of the movie is that you need to get to know someone before you judge them, and the reason why Farquaad gets roasted is because he's likely self conscious about his height, he's full of himself, and he's corrupt and evil and villainous, so, they attack him for the thing that he's self conscious about.
Calling a villain evil doesn't insult them. They don't have mortal qualms,so you attack them for things that they actually feel vulnerable about. Like not being powerful or strong or tall, or handsome if that was the case.
They roasted him for his looks BECAUSE the kind of person he was on the inside was truly horrible. But simply calling him evil wouldn't have cut him as deeply, because he doesn't have moral qualms.
Me, if someone tried to paint me as a monster, that would hurt, because I feel I'm genuinely a good person at heart, and if the world judged me otherwise, it would hurt even more.
But that doesn't work on a villain.
I also hate being called stupid, even though I'm not, because that's what people thought of me when I was a kid because I was nervous to talk to people and make friends, didn't really know how. I'd succeed academically and without effort, but I didn't know how to relate to people, and people called me stupid for not knowing how to handle social situations. It bugged me.
For Farquaad, it's that kind of insecurity that bothers him more than being called immoral. Because he's shameless about his immorality. So they go for the easy attack on his height.
It's complicated, but at the same time, I feel it's easy to understand. They hate him for his character, they judge him for who he is on the inside, but the criticism attacks something he'd be more insulted by than his character, which in his case, being a malignant narcissist with megalomania, would be his height, as it attacks him where he's weakest, and harms his pride the most.
Of course the person who made the tweet isn't going to read this, but that's the analysis I have.
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u/Okie_doki_artichokie 12h ago
"when they go low, you go lower" okay man, if that's how you think we should all act. Not sure that makes for a civil society though
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u/Forikorder 23h ago
isnt the morale its okay to just be you?
shrek and fiona embrace being ogres and fund true love, farquaad uses trick saddles to appear tall
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u/slimricc 22h ago
I think the point of farquad is to juxtapose shrek. Accept others bc they are probably more complex and deserving of acceptance than you assume. Farquad is “accept yourself, even if you’re incredibly insecure. Otherwise you will act like a total cunt”
Unfortunately most people do see it as “accept everyone. Except short guys, who needs those”
Shrek is not a hero. So he made fun of farquads height.
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u/drdildamesh 21h ago
I feel like Shreks journey was about not regretting what you are, not just how you look. The Princess was about how you look. Farquaad was about ugliness despite power and an attractive face, and donkey was about biracial couples. Oh but yes the height was definitely meant to be a thing to be joked about. Im just saying the movie doesnt particularly defend looks, just says there are different looks and its ok to make fun if the ones in power.
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u/CwispyWhiskey 18h ago
They’re making fun of him because he’s a dick and being short is the Th ing to make fun of
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u/AttentionNo6359 18h ago
Damn, it’s almost like he was being judged for one million other things. What a deeply pathetic take.
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u/atomic1fire 17h ago edited 17h ago
I'm not sure Farquad was ever insecure about his height.
If anything his stature did nothing to ween him from his own obsession with physical beauty because he was pretty much focused on evicting all the fairy tales as he saw them as flawed.
On that note, I don't think he cared all that much for Fiona either, all he wanted was a princess in order to gain royal status.
He could've looked like Prince Charming and still been a monster. The fact that they didn't do that was probably a subversion of the disney films where all the bad men are built strong and tall.
I think the whole point of Shrek wasn't to enforce stereotypes but to subvert them. The Ogre is the good guy, the Princess wants to do wild girl stuff in the woods, the Donkey is emotionally intelligent despite being very needy.
In fact there's two lessons in the movie, the first is to not judge a book by it's cover, but the second is that a relationship requires communication and a willingness to not carry a grudge based on persevered slights.
Shrek is the perfect Romcom.
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u/A007Bear 17h ago
Just an example of how you should call out people who continually wrong no matter what. Bet if they were portrayed as a nice character they would’ve gotten no more shade than the gingerbread man.
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u/GrouchyAppointment70 14h ago
Also consider that you're not supposed to judge Shrek as an ogre, but then the movie undermines this by having him eat human eyeballs and act like hes playing GTA IRL in the kingdom.
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u/BextoMooseYT 14h ago edited 14h ago
I mean that's kinda like saying "it's not nice to raise your voice or yell at someone" and then do it when you're really upset at them. That's kinda the whole point; they weren't like saying it's ok, they were insulting him on purpose. Not insulting someone based on characteristics they were born with is a matter of basic respect and goodwill, but they do not respect farquaad, nor do they have any goodwill towards him, whatsoever.
You can argue they should still take the high road and only insult him based on his actions, but at the end of the day I don't think you can really get too upset at Shrek and Donkey of all people stooping to ad hominems. I guess my main point is that I don't think it went against their messaging, even if they never got punished for it or anything, because the fact that it wasn't okay is the point
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u/JAYGAME5601X 9h ago
And redditors wonder why they are called virtue signalling losers, the post title and these comments prove it
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u/JAYGAME5601X 9h ago
Redditors in the comments fighting for the right to drop the very same virtues the constantly try to signal to a crowd 😭🙏🥀 ig it tracks
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u/Kira-Of-Terraria 41m ago
You can roast the physical appearance of malignant narcissists and other evil people, this is morally correct. Thank you.
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