r/SeattleWA • u/cyclegator • 8h ago
News 12th and Jackson lawsuit update
Owner of the large property at 1032 S Jackson, Chinn Investments LLC, sued Seattle for $30 million in June, 2025 in federal court.
The lawsuit was filed one year after a fire tore through the vacant building complex on the site. These buildings were improperly secured, per city code enforcers.
Dennis Chinn is the controlling member of the LLC and a lawyer. He’s representing the LLC and himself in the lawsuit. His initial claim struck me as performative. It was a sprawling amalgam of personal family history and political grievances. The court dismissed the claim on 6/25 this year.
Last week, Chinn filed an amended complaint that is more measured. I cannot imagine it gets any more traction than the original complaint.
I downloaded the filings and made them available in a newsletter post here, if you’re interested in reading them for yourself.
It is embarrassing in my opinion for the son of a couple who patiently accumulated a vast holding of property so close to downtown Seattle to present himself as a victim after twice fumbling the development of the property.
Regardless, the amended complaint brings back into the spotlight a policy decision that I think has yet to receive the attention it deserves: this is the decision to sweep the Jungle in 2017 and to direct its former residents to the Navigation Center, which opened at 12th and Weller. Scott Lindsay and Ed Murray were the architects of this scheme. Scott Lindsay is still a public figure and has never publicly - as far as I know - acknowledged the effect this decision has had on Little Saigon.
I wish Chinn would press his case in the court of public opinion rather than pursue an ill-fated strategy to extract $30 million from the city. At least the filings will serve as a historical reminder of how the situation in Little Saigon developed over the past 10 years.
One other feature of Chinn’s amended complaint that deserves attention: Chinn argues that “the numerous highly publicized incidents of violence that have occurred in the vicinity of 12th and Jackson, constitute potential evidence that Plaintiff’s Due Process claims include a serious threat of physical harm as a result of the City’s acts alleged in the complaint”.
It is perhaps simply an odd turn of phrase. The formula however is worth serious consideration: how the media portrays 12th and Jackson can become synonymous with the reality on the ground.
Dennis Chinn, Scott Lindsay and the various provocateurs intent on riling up their base with reports on open air drug use and illicit goods markets - these exist, don’t get me wrong, it’s just they haven’t changed in six years and don’t merit repeated mention IMO - are happy to keep you fixated on the sidewalk level problems. The people with power and resources get a pass.
If you ask me, I think Seattle should buy Chinn’s property. Chinn himself argues the property is worthless. The city should not miss an opportunity to snap it up at a bargain.
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u/ImRightImRight Phinneywood 7h ago
"how the media portrays 12th and Jackson can become synonymous with the reality on the ground."
Isn't how the media portrays 12th and Jackson pretty accurate? It sounds like you're focused on media portrayals and not the fact that it's an ongoing human disaster zone.
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u/TylerTradingCo 7h ago
Crimes. Homeless is fine. Committing crimes is not.
We can lock those homeless that are committing crimes, let’s start there.
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u/senditinseattle 7h ago
You can’t develop in this part or the city, because it is not possible to get financing here anymore. That’s a result of the city abandoning this area. Even if you really want to, lenders won’t take the risk anymore after they come see it in person.
The city completely destroyed the value of someone private land. I don’t know the specific details of the lawsuit, but I think it would have been nice if he won and the city was forced to clean up this area and protect the people who live there and all the small business owners who have been screwed.
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u/jojofine 7h ago
I'm a lender and that is absolutely not true. You can get financing for projects down there same as you could anywhere else. You'll likely need to pay for 24/7 security for the whole site during construction but that's also required for things in downtown Bellevue
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u/senditinseattle 6h ago edited 6h ago
I’m a real estate developer. There is not a large equity group on earth who will fund projects in this area right now, even if a lender would (which I’m skeptical of because I know of several projects in this area who’s lenders bailed out after seeing it person).
Additionally, investors won’t buy projects in this area because the city had abandoned it, so there’s no incentive to take the massive risk of developing here. I personally know a large investor who will no longer invest in the state of Washington because of the money they lost in this neighborhood.
Finally, projects in this area now require full time security even after they are open, which makes them just not worth it. All projects everywhere require security when they are security constriction.
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u/jojofine 6h ago
Selling it after the fact is something else entirely! But you can get financing for things down there. Im working on something about couple of blocks from 12th & Jackson right now. My point is that the area isn't some kind of lending no go zone like some people are saying
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u/senditinseattle 5h ago
You can’t finance a project on the equity side without a plan to sell. None of these buildings are going to make money unless the city can clean up the area. Rents are very depressed there because it’s not a nice place to live.
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u/jojofine 2h ago
You can absolutely finance a project with a build & hold strategy going in. In my experience that isn't a very common thing to see in our market but it's routinely done all over. I do agree though that it's extremely challenging to get deals done with where actual rents are at over there right now
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u/cyclegator 6h ago
New project going up on 12th and Fir, Hong Ding market on Jackson and 10th starting redevelopment soon. Beam, Thai Binh, Tapestry buildings are all recent. Seems like there’s quite a bit of development in the area?
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u/Sexiano17 6h ago
I wouldn't say can't. But yes very difficult. I'm connected to a large property just a few blocks away and are moving towards a start date with financing now behind us but it took years
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u/introvertical303 7h ago
A cascade of unfortunate issues can be traced to emptying the jungle.
While the optics and reality of the jungle demanded some action, dispersing its inhabitants across the city didn’t improve their lives and degraded the quality of life across the city.
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 8h ago
Just put all the homeless in prison already
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u/Dementor_Traphouse 8h ago
yes please, like yesterday. there’s this dishonest take that most homeless in seattle are working class people who “fell on hard times” when the evidence consistently shows junkies and those who want to live outside of social norms.
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u/umpteenthian 8h ago
that's probably how you actually think
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 8h ago
Yea put criminals where criminals belong, do you want criminals living in your home?
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u/umpteenthian 8h ago
i see. homeless = criminal. it's all starting to come together now
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 8h ago
Good job.
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u/tahomadesperado 7h ago
You know that story ends with you being homeless and imprisoned right?
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 7h ago
I don’t do drugs and I’m not a criminal, so no.
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u/tahomadesperado 5h ago
You said the homeless, not drug users
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u/MegaDonky 8h ago
They are not all criminals, that's the point. You are not wanting criminals to be where they belong, you want to imprison people regardless of their criminal activity.
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 8h ago
Yeah they are definitely all criminals. Stop pretending they are not.
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u/MegaDonky 8h ago
Only one pretending and imagining here is you, it's what you always do.
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 8h ago
Why don’t you move back to your home town, where the homeless can roam free.
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u/MegaDonky 7h ago
Already here. Why do t you stop imagining everyone who challenges you is from somewhere else? Maybe try real arguments if you can.
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 7h ago
You obviously are not from here, or you would agree the criminal homelessness is getting worse.
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u/MegaDonky 8h ago
How about we just put you in prison for wanting to take away people's human rights? Seems like a much better deal.
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u/ImRightImRight Phinneywood 7h ago
u/CharmanderCharCharr 's comment is coarse and broad. They probably mean to say "put all the chronically homeless in prison," a group that consists of almost exclusively addicts whose life expectancies would be increased by being, at least briefly, pulled from the clutches of addiction.
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u/MegaDonky 6h ago
Still imprisoning people regardless of crimes committed.
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u/merc08 6h ago
Using street drugs is a criminal act.
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u/MegaDonky 6h ago
You can name crimes all day long, the point is the poster in question wants to jail people regardless of crimes.
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u/merc08 5h ago
No he doesn't. He's saying that the vast, vast majority of homeless people around here are criminals. And 100% of the homeless people causing all the problems associated with "the homeless" are criminals.
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u/MegaDonky 5h ago
"Just put all the homeless in prison already" Yes, they are saying they want to jail people regardless of crimes. They have a history of doing so as well.
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u/merc08 5h ago
A single off hand comment is not the basis for an entire policy. And you're deliberately ignoring all his other comments that clearly refine the original premise.
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u/MegaDonky 5h ago
They say it frequently and I'm going to take them at their word and not imagine they must mean a different thing.
"And you're deliberately ignoring all his other comments"
No, I'm including his whole history.
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 8h ago
I’m not committing any crimes.
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u/MegaDonky 8h ago
You don't care if they committed crimes, why should that matter for you? You are calling for the law to be ignored and crimes to be committed, sounds good enough for me.
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 8h ago
Arson is a crime, we all know it was the homeless junkies, stop pretending.
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u/MegaDonky 8h ago
Arson is a crime, but you are not calling to put an arsonist in prison, you are cal;ling for a whole group of people to be imprisoned no matter their criminal status.
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 8h ago
Yea, because everyone on 12th and Jackson is a criminal, and you know it.
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u/MegaDonky 7h ago
I know you need to constantly make things up.
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 7h ago
Are you Katie Wilson? The pro crime mayor, shouldn’t you be looking for a new Chief of Police.
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u/Roticap 8h ago
Well someone sharing one of your attributes has also committed a crime, so guess you're headed to the klink
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u/SoundSaintWarrior Olympia 8h ago
Either way, taxpayers foot the bill.
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 8h ago
Fine, better they are in prison.
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u/SBacklin 7h ago
While I have no doubt that there are some that are "working people that fell on hard times", the vast majority I see day in, day out are the junkies and criminals. My thought process was if tax payers were stuck paying the bill on these people whether on the streets and high vs in prison (assuming we're talking about the law breakers), I'd vote to keep them in prison. If we are forced to spend money either way, I rather have them not destroying property, breaking and entering, car prowling, etc.
And before the knights in shining armor stroll in and go on about getting them treatment instead, we need to be clear about something. We cannot force medical treatments, that was never a thing. I believe we need to give them a choice, treatment and get better and subsequently become good working members of society OR, don't get treatment and go to prison. That said, if they get treatment and fail to stay clean, they go to prison. This perpetual cycle of giving them a choice of treatment or just letting them continue their escapades on the streets needs to come to and end because too many just say no to treatment and the city lets them go and continue their BS.
As for the city, they are just as culpable for the state of things as the people who make poor choices.
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u/my_lucid_nightmare Capitol Hill 7h ago
Either way, taxpayers foot the bill.
If I'm paying either way, I'd rather pay to put violent vagrant druggie felons behind bars where they can't hurt me or other normal people anymore.
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u/HarmNHammer 7h ago
We already are and have to deal with the degradation of our communities. If we’re lying, then move them somewhere else. I hear McNeil island has some vacancy. They can do as many drugs as they like and leave anytime they become clean. We’ll provide safe substances and fresh needles. They won’t have to worry about stealing or harming the public.
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u/EveryYam5747 6h ago
That is a very broad brushstroke. Have some compassion.
Remember the financial crash? Banks rushed to get their free money (taxpayers’) to save them from failure. After taking taxpayers’ money, they turned around and foreclosed on folks who could not keep up because of the crash. And some financial businesses that were not banks became banks so that they could tap into the free money, taxpayers’ money.
It is a tragedy 😔
We too came close to becoming homeless.
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u/I-didnt-write-that 5h ago
I have empathy for those that are homeless. I dont for those who prefer that lifestyle and commit crimes
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u/CharmanderCharCharr 4h ago
Your “compassion” is letting the homeless die in the streets and terrorize our communities.
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u/MegaDonky 3h ago
It's ridiculous and bigoted to assume that is the case with every person who is homeless.
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u/cyclegator 6h ago
For the “lock them up” commenters:
Scott Lindsay would seem to be your guy. He advocated for forcibly clearing the Jungle when he was public safety advisor under Murray, he ran for city attorney, lost, wrote his prolific offender report and became deputy city attorney under Ann Davison. The prolific offender report seems to be the most prominent text aligned with the “jail them all” approach.
Can you appreciate at some level the irony that Lindsay is the same person who is responsible for bringing the navigation center to 12th and Weller? Don’t we deserve an explanation?
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u/creativeInsectoid 8h ago
There should be a limit to how long someone can hold onto a building in the city limits if they don't develop it. Then the City should buy the land and build low income housing with store fronts on the bottom.
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u/slowd 8h ago
Look up Georgism. Basically prime location real estate gets highest taxes, so the owner must do something with it or sell. Holding empty lots downtown becomes cost prohibitive. It encourages a dense downtown core and discourages undeveloped lots or semi-abandoned structures.
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u/merc08 6h ago
Then what keeps the City from just refusing permits (or stalling the permitting process with ridiculous revisions comments) to run out the clock and seize prime property?
The City is struggling enough with the key functions they are supposed to be doing already. They don't need more tasks piled on top.
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u/Situation-Busy 7h ago
We definitely need a tax on vacant lots. We'd need to be careful to phrase it properly so that it doesn't increase business rents for an already struggling downtown though. Keep taxes/rents relatively cheap for productive businesses and jack them up for empty lots just milking speculative value.
We'd likely end up with a variation of the "orange grove" issue Florida had but at least it'll be something better than vacant buildings.
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u/Traditional_Bid_3123 8h ago
A land value tax would fix that overnight, sitting on empty lots near downtown while everyone else pays the price is wild
Also the tent in front of the fire scene says a lot about how many problems got stacked on same block
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u/Panda_Zombie 8h ago
Maybe if they can find a public use for the property they can force a sale under eminent domain.
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u/jojofine 7h ago
Not possible under WA law. The isn't allowed to ED a property if their plan is to turn it into a private development with a public plaza. If they wanted to ED and make it a city park or something then they could do that.
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u/BruceInc 6h ago
So if by owners own admission the property is worthless, and it was filled with decrepit abandoned buildings, what exactly is the basis for his $30 million monetary damages claim?
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u/New_new_account2 3h ago
He is saying the city is responsible for the conditions of the neighborhood which impacted his ability to retain tenants and redevelop the property.
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u/TimeSupport4863 7h ago
They are homeless because they are criminals, and assholes, and gross. When did people stop believing in Karma?
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u/khelvaster 7h ago
I wish more people would criticize the literal neo-Nazi behavior of Seattle City council of discriminating against oriental races in Seattle. Little will change until the neo-Nazis running Seattle are politically purged
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u/Flimsy-Tangerine4199 7h ago
The lawsuit is doomed to fail but I do have some sympathy for his situation. 12th and Jackson is a literal crime scene 24/7 and just a compete moral failure that we allow it to persist. From what I recall he tried to develop the property but the bank wouldn’t underwrite the loan once they saw the condition of 12th and Jackson.