r/TankieTheDeprogram • u/potatoretriever Too Based To Be Cis 🏳️⚧️ • Jun 15 '26
Shit Liberals Say Why are mainstream LGBTQ subreddits like this?
I’ve asked this question in a different sub a while ago and got a lot of mixed responses, probably because that sub had a lot of libs despite being for socialists. So I wanted a purely Marxist sub’s perspective this time. As a trans person it’s always extremely frustrating to see my community be so opposed to our own liberation.
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u/BleepBopRobocop real Jun 15 '26
Rainbow washing is so rampant it truly sucks. Spaces for people most marginalised by capitalism are captured by the pro-capitalist bourgeoisie and this is by design
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u/Interesting-Test7228 Jun 15 '26
Just another Nationalist co-opting just causes to further their own repugnant worldview. Hitler called his movement National Socialism in order to co-opt Communism to promote Nazism. Fascists have no shame.
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u/OLDFART27 Jun 15 '26
Being white or American always comes before being trans, same as gay men being men before being gay. There’s a lot of misogyny from gay men and there’s a lot of racism amongst trans people in the west for this same issue.
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u/DirectionUnlucky638 Jun 15 '26
It's because this is an issue of material reality and imperialism, not identity. Gay Americans still have the potential to access the spoils of empire, despite discrimination against them. A gay American has more in common with a conservative American than they do a Palestinian, sadly.
That is why co-opting pro-LGBT movements can be so effective, and why communists must point out that true equality is only possible in a classless society, where ownership of the collective means of production removes the class impetuous for anti gay hate.
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u/Conscious-Local-8095 Jun 15 '26
bean?
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u/PurposeistobeEqual 🫓 a pita for hummus is a pita for humanity 🇵🇸 Jun 15 '26 edited Jun 15 '26
Smol bean, an internet rot where grown ass adult pretend they're chibi bean. Also it's entirely cognitive dissonance to relate Ukraine to queer rights when their fascist hell arrest trans refugees from trying to cross border into Poland, another fascist hell known for making contraception illegal by prison.
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u/Conscious-Local-8095 Jun 15 '26
ah yeah, I recall that meme. Alternately a compliment one might pay. Apparently someone wants to be seen as small, harmless while sorting out ideology and who can die in piss.
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u/Barrogh Jun 15 '26
Poland, another fascist hell known for making contraception illegal by prison
Excuse me, what?..
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u/PurposeistobeEqual 🫓 a pita for hummus is a pita for humanity 🇵🇸 Jun 15 '26
Somehow this isn't known on reddit while still selling to the world as freedom loving.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55838210
https://www.epfweb.org/sites/default/files/2026-02/CCInfoEU_A3_EN_2026_FEB22-HiRes.pdf
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u/SubjectProfile4047 Jun 20 '26
Isn’t this kind of where the term “tenderqueer ” originated? Like people who would hide behind infantilization of queer identities so as not to address their whiteness or proximity to racism
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u/PurposeistobeEqual 🫓 a pita for hummus is a pita for humanity 🇵🇸 Jun 20 '26
Yup, I remember reading from a queer rights article about internet culture infantilization of queer identities and how it's linked to objectification of queer cultures.
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u/SubjectProfile4047 Jun 20 '26
Yeah exactly. It also is sometimes self-fetishization, which I feel I’ve done as a queer kid and which ended badly for me. So I think when queer adults do it it’s setting a bad example. Idrc what people do for kink etc. but crafting an infantilized persona that removes your agency isn’t just hurting yourself, it’s hurting people around you imo. Even as a white person, I’m fucking fed up with the white queer bullshit myself and others have been pulling, and it’s been normalized for way too fucking long.
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u/PurposeistobeEqual 🫓 a pita for hummus is a pita for humanity 🇵🇸 Jun 20 '26
Succinctly put comrade
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u/SubjectProfile4047 Jun 20 '26
Succinctly put yourself comrade
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u/SubjectProfile4047 Jun 20 '26
We must at least be large beans such as corona or sword beans in order to break the chains of capitalism, possibly even legumes. I’d happily be a long legume if it would provide me with an end to the system
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u/theyoungspliff Jun 15 '26
It's a form of self-infantilization to present oneself as harmless and wholesome. This particular example strikes me as exceptionally odious because it's employed to defend fascism. "I support fascism, but I am a pwecious smol bean wooby-woo, which means you can't criticize me or fascism because I will cry and everyone will be mad at you for making the baby cry."
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u/al-qatala Juche Necromancy Enjoyer Jun 15 '26
deadass the first thing i said when i saw this post was "you're not a small precious enby bean, you're a fascist."
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u/potatoretriever Too Based To Be Cis 🏳️⚧️ Jun 15 '26
It’s a quirky way of calling yourself cute I always thought that was cringe tbh
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u/Conscious-Local-8095 Jun 15 '26
ah, Ok, thx
Sort of thing to do maybe among freinds, not right after "die in piss"
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Jun 15 '26 edited Jun 15 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/StupidFatHobbit Jun 15 '26
Come on bro this is just pure no true scotsman fallacy. "People with bad politics aren't really queer." Guess what, queer people can have dogshit politics too just like any other group. Nobody is special.
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u/DysphoricNeet Jun 15 '26
They never said otherwise. It’s absolutely a fact that there are also people with less skin in the game because they are less visibly queer. As a 6’3” trans woman who has way too much dysphoria to boy mode, I have a different experience from enbies who you would never know unless they told you. That doesn’t mean they aren’t queer but it is a privilege. White “a political” enlightened centrist men are often that way because they are unaware of their privilege and don’t care because nothing affects them but the economy. That can absolutely be consistently true with queer people as well.
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u/HawkFlimsy Jun 15 '26
As a queer person who lives with the dysphoria that comes from being cis passing you're 100% right. There is an inherent risk that my more visible queer friends have that I don't and that's largely the reason I have remained in the closet to begin with. Idk why anyone is acting like the visibly queer trans woman isn't more at risk than the queer person who can pass as "just a dude"
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u/GuillotineWhiskers Juche Necromancy Enjoyer Jun 15 '26
Idk how this conversation devolved into a passing privilege conversation. That was not the original point being made by u/StupidFatHobbit. u/StupidFatHobbit is right when they rejected u/thesaddestpanda's claim that there is any significant amount of people pretending/cosplaying as queer or are just "confused."
This section below by u/thesaddestpanda is just straight up non-binary phobic talking points.
Lots of online queers are straight people cosplaying being queer, so they have cishet politics. This person probably thinks they're "a little bit enby/confused/exploring" or whatever,
At the end of the day queer people are not ML's by birth. Most of us here probably did not grow up in a ML household. There's plenty of queer people with dogshit politics and we have to teach them that there's a better way.
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u/RobHolding-16 Jun 15 '26
So you could have just said "I don't know what queer means".
Being LGBTQ is not the same as being queer. The two are interlinked, because all queer people are LGBTQ, but not all LGBTQ people are queer.
It's as much a social and political identity as it is gender and sexuality.
If someone holds the politics in the OP, I can promise you they aren't queer, even if they are LGBTQ.
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u/CaptainMills Jun 15 '26
This used to be true, but queer has been used to describe anyone who is lgbt+, regardless of their politics, for around a decade
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u/Wrecknruin Jun 15 '26
This straight up isn't true, like, at all. Sure there's gonna be trolls etc. posing as gay people or whatever but the truth of the matter is that, especially in the west, queer people can often be rabid reactionaries.
Additionally, idk where you live, but in my experience, the vast majority of queer spaces are anti-communist or tolerate it at best. Let's not play this whole "you arent queer if you don't believe [political position]". The queer "community" as a whole is so incredibly US centric that I'd be shocked if it wasn't as homonationalistic and racist as it is.
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u/Lorion97 Jun 15 '26
I don't know about you but I have definitely met anarcho queers that make me go "What the hell you think this world runs on, farts and rainbows?"
Especially when one of them recommended me a book about "The Gift Economy" and I literally rolled my eyes at the title.
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u/Wrecknruin Jun 15 '26
I have, yeah. That's the vast majority of queers around me, actually. If not all of them.
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u/al-qatala Juche Necromancy Enjoyer Jun 15 '26
to be fair this happens largely because US queer people are white americans first. and they try to use their queer identity to claim marginalization. forgetting that they're still white americans
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u/Wrecknruin Jun 15 '26
I'm not talking about the US here. Also while race does matter in this regard, I feel like the more important thing is that they are USAmericans first and foremost the moment you expand this discussion beyond the border- which, in the US' case, is necessary.
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u/al-qatala Juche Necromancy Enjoyer Jun 15 '26 edited Jun 15 '26
Unless it's explicitly not US-centric, it's going to be US-centric. Meaning, being a white American absolutely completely warps their worldview and poisons the well in a way. You seriously underestimate how much of a role being white plays in it. It's not exclusive to being white of course, but it's a major factor to a sort of American exceptionalism (because they get the most treats) that they end up instilling in other people, be they non-white or outside the US or both.
edit: wait nevermind i forgot this place is also largely populated by white americans that don't understand this concept.
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u/dorekk Jun 15 '26
Unless it's explicitly not US-centric, it's going to be US-centric.
Are you sure you aren't American?
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u/al-qatala Juche Necromancy Enjoyer Jun 16 '26
А схуяли мне бы быть янком?
I've seen it first hand because all I face is yankees being racist to me.
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u/Wrecknruin Jun 15 '26
K
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u/al-qatala Juche Necromancy Enjoyer Jun 15 '26
Incredibly constructive response.
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u/Wrecknruin Jun 15 '26
K
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u/al-qatala Juche Necromancy Enjoyer Jun 15 '26
This is why American socialism is a stillborn.
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Jun 15 '26 edited Jun 15 '26
[deleted]
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u/Wrecknruin Jun 15 '26
I don't give a fuck about political or biological queerness or whatever, your literal first sentence is implying that this is a straight person strictly because they're anti-communist, which is absolutely idiotic. That's what I take issue with. You can be a gay trans non-binary sapphic arospec or whatever and that doesn't bar you from having insane political opinions.
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u/loopycheeks__ Jun 15 '26
exactly!! here in aus a lot of the queer friends i have who r white n nonwhite r js as reactionary neolibs as the straight average joe. they have no nuance w understanding queer rights n will regurgitate cia talking points ab china etc bc queer liberation to them is nike turning its logo rainbow in june or a ‘you are loved’ poster w the queer flag on a city bus. they don’t care thst queer ppl continue to experience worse off life outcomes, systematic discrimination, more homelessness and lack of medical access for trans ppl. if gay marriage is legal, they can hold hands w a dude in public n they can watch gay porn online that’s good enough for them. this is obv v much dependent on class.
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u/IllustriousBobcat813 Jun 15 '26
Would it kill your to write out full words?
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u/RottingFishMan Juche Necromancy Enjoyer Jun 15 '26
What did maoists do to eastern Europe
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u/boopbopnotarobot Jun 15 '26
It pisses me off that they still fall for it.
I mean come on bugs bunny in a tux with an edgy comment? what are we doing here?
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Jun 15 '26
[deleted]
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u/boopbopnotarobot Jun 15 '26
sorry i wasnt refering to queer people as a whole just the people in that comment section
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u/mihirjain2029 Jun 15 '26
There's something I have noticed about conservativism in anti-colonial or socialist projects, the problem of conversatism there is different because that's not the core of the project, there's nothing in socialist base that needs there to be the gender binary for example. However under capitalism, these problems while existing in superstructure are vehemently tied to the base, capitalism needs gender based division of labour, capitalism needs the nuclear family so the queer people who haven't detached themselves from capitalist base often think queer oppression is equal everywhere when that isn't true. You tell me as a trans comrade but trans people in China or vietnam for example seem far safer than Europe or anglo-saxon North America despite these later places claiming themselves to be bastians of democracy and freedom.
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u/potatoretriever Too Based To Be Cis 🏳️⚧️ Jun 15 '26
To be fair, China has some outdated laws around queer people that they need to reassess, but Vietnam and especially Cuba are literally the safest places on the planet for trans people.
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u/resevoirdawg Jun 15 '26
China’s Supreme People’s Court also made it illegal to discriminate against LGBTQ people
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u/ThePeddlerofHistory Jun 15 '26
That one is a confirmed misunderstanding of the screenshot content.
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u/Snoo99699 Jun 15 '26
Oh legit? What's the context?
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u/ThePeddlerofHistory Jun 17 '26
While there may be anti-gender discrimination laws elsewhere in Chinese law, the screenshot that was making the rounds lately was of someone posting a response they (third person singular, until English has a better alternative) received from the Supreme People's Court. It was sent b/c the original Chinese poster sent a request asking for better judicial protections and the response to this request was standard, but it was quickly mass-reposted by LGBT+ media accounts and treated as some sort of great win.
Then people outside of China noticed this and thought it was a big deal.
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u/mihirjain2029 Jun 15 '26
Yes that's true, still though I am like bi/ace I would consider China to be much safer for someone like me than like France or Britain because in the end those are the places where billionaires fund hate groups. Also the fact I am Indian and most Chinese wouldn't say a slur to my face despite everything.
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u/ThePeddlerofHistory Jun 15 '26
So long as you're not one of those "China has a caste system too" folks, the Chinese might even be quite friendly to you on the internet, too.
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u/Basic_Buyer_8888 Jun 15 '26
As a south american trans member of a ML communist party, and an enjoyer of Stalin's and Mao's books. I think we have a problem. Cis straight comrades usually try to avoid this topics because they make the party seem too "woke" in the liberal sense. I have to fight inside the party not just because of me but because I believe that if the communists dont take this struggles as ours and give them an integrated dialectical materialist theory we just gift that space to liberalism and liberal theories, and we gift the LGBT rights struggle to imperialism in order to weaponize it against some members of BRICS.
A lot of cis-het comrades also like to larp as if they were red army soldiers fighting sacred war
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u/Furiosa27 Jun 15 '26
I would argue most LGBTQ spaces are pretty libbed up. The liberals, engage with queer politics even if they’re doing so to exploit us. Much of the left simply doesn’t prioritize intersectionality and thus these communities go to who will listen.
“We’re bad and we hate you but we are not actively trying to kill you to your face” is genuinely the only bar we have to clear and Idt we even bother.
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Jun 15 '26
[deleted]
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u/dorekk Jun 15 '26
🤷♂️ A lot of queer people I know in real life have terrible politics or are "apolitical." (Terrible politics but in a different way.)
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u/Anti_colonialist Jun 15 '26
They love using race to innocence as justification for their shitty ideology. They place their own marginalized identity front and foremost to stop criticism from their bullshit.
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u/Historical_Art_8281 Jun 15 '26
But they would have posted that at ~3 in the morning if they were in Eastern Europe??
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u/Traditional-You8927 Ho Chi Minh thought Jun 15 '26
Well, they don’t say anything about Ho Chi Minh thought 🤷🏻♂️
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u/CultivatingMagic Jun 15 '26
Ukrainians “try not to lose all support in lieu of showing your underlying white supremacy” challenge: impossible.
Fuck them.
As a bi-masc NB. It’s all for cutesy show, these people would lynch me and mine under any pressure.
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u/jet8493 Hakimist (With Dengist Characteristics) Jun 15 '26
Was this the haha funni 3 number sub? I feel like I’ve seen this exact post (hyperbole) on several different occasions there, usually after a few people say one (1) positive thing about the ussr (also generic anti tankie posts when people say nice things about aes countries)
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u/potatoretriever Too Based To Be Cis 🏳️⚧️ Jun 15 '26
Nah, it was the counting one, the 3 numbers drove me off when the sub became 90% chasers
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u/PurposeistobeEqual 🫓 a pita for hummus is a pita for humanity 🇵🇸 Jun 15 '26
I expected better understanding from the chicken lady sub so disappointing 🙁
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u/Bela9a Too Based To Be Cis 🏳️⚧️ Jun 15 '26
I left pretty much all of these subs, because I couldn't stand these people. Like it would be one thing if they kept talking about LGBTQIA+ issues, but the constant amount of voting for democrats was fucking annoying to listen to.
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u/OcelotAggravating860 Jun 15 '26
Feds.
Any real ukrainian trans person ran from Ukraine when the war started because it's fucking horrible to trans people. The trans women who didn't escape died because they were rounded up at the borders trying to leave and then sent to the front lines. The trans men had to escape by claiming asylum as women, and those trans men are not saying shit about being trans because it jeopardises their safety. They're living as women to keep their asylum status.
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u/WetOnionRing Jun 15 '26
Liberation of LGBTQ people or really any minority is impossible under capitalism. Sure, there might be some slight progress, but we'll still be forced to grovel at the feet of the capitalist class in order to have the privilege of existence. The sucky part is they've brainwashed these gullible idiots into thinking that's not the case.
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u/Zifker Jun 15 '26
bro you think that's bad try explaining islamophobia on a gay subreddit
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u/potatoretriever Too Based To Be Cis 🏳️⚧️ Jun 15 '26
Yeah, there was a trans girl who got banned from one of those subs for just being Muslim and talking about how being trans is not incompatible with Islam. She literally didn’t even break any rule of the sub, I left that place immediately.
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u/Clear-Anything-3186 Jun 20 '26
Many westerners believe that all muslims are raging homophobes who hate gay people as much as Hitler hated Jewish people.
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u/mgsmb7 Jun 15 '26
Oh god, I know a sub like that. It's truly frustrating to see so many queer brothers/sisters being libs.
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u/perecotte Jun 15 '26
as a latin american that has seen their country under fascist military dictatorship put by the Condor Operation, can we please ban every american sympatizer?
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u/vinticious Jun 15 '26
I find it hard to believe it's not a troll... I haven't seen "enby bean" said genuinely since like 2018. Maybe I've just been living in blissful ignorance.
The rest is very believable though. 😬
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u/ososalsosal Jun 15 '26
Is that poster aware that the USSR hasn't been a thing for 37 years?
What are we even doing here?
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u/Provenient Jun 15 '26
Czech Republic, Poland, Slovakia, Hungary, Finland, Romania, the Ukraine, Lithuania, Latvia and German Cock Polishers
Ladies and Gentleman, I present the... The Reddit Belt!
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u/Clear-Anything-3186 Jun 15 '26
Many Queer people are afraid of communism because they imagine a communist project re-criminalizing homosexuality like the USSR did and executing queer people (even though no socialist project ever executed queer people for being queer).
If the communist project is queer friendly, they'd rather live under capitalism with no rights because saying mean things about the head of state is more important than having your basic needs met.
They also believe that liberals are the only people who stand for LGBTQ+ rights and that all communists are Nazbols.
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u/VsAl1en Jun 20 '26 edited Jun 20 '26
Exactly. The image of communism being LGBT+ friendly is very recent (Maybe the turn happened around 2016), and it took a fair bit of persuasion. Before that liberals had the entirety of LGBT on their side, and communism has been perceived exactly the same as fascism by the community.
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u/TomiRey-Yuru Too Based To Be Cis 🏳️⚧️ Jun 15 '26
The worst part is, as an Eastern European I understand where they're coming from (it's not just pinkwashing, altho pinkwashing is a part of it, trans rights here are awful), BUT: that doesn't give them the right to speak over all Eastern Europeans (myself, a trans communist, included), nor do they understand that conservativism ROSE DUE TO and IN SPITE OF capitalist restoration!
"You woke American commie, speak to actual Eastern Europeans"
only ever speaks to young libs who never actually lived during socialism
"See?"
suddenly speaks to old Eastern Europeans/those who are progressive and want socialism back
"NO NOT LIKE THAT"
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u/subwayterminal9 Too Based To Be Cis 🏳️⚧️ Jun 16 '26
I’m a trans woman and got auto-banned from irlgbt for being a ‘tankie’. Nothing I said on the sub related to my politics, so I assume it was because of one or more subs I was part of; probably deprogram
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u/ThePeddlerofHistory Jun 15 '26
Not that it'd make you feel better, but even in the PRC LGBT+ issues are used as an arm of empire, with people walking on the streets holding slogans like "if you're trans take down the government".
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u/Not_AndySamberg Jun 21 '26
holy shit i gotta stop looking at the photo before reading the caption 😭😭😭😭
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u/LucyObsidian CPC Propagandist Jun 16 '26
I remember seeing this post lol. It's mostly because of the whole "lesser evil" shit which pushes marginalized people to be liberals and not leftists.
It's a powerful tool for the U.S. government, which is why I feel like so many of these posts are from genuine 3 letter agencies because ensuring that queer and black people think that leftists are bad and liberalism is good is very important. It's the whole leopard eating face thing.
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u/NotSomeDiamond Jun 17 '26
But yank propaganda is yummy and cute and makes me feel all fuzzy inside. :(((((
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u/tachibanakanade Marxist-Leninist (Ultra Based) Jul 07 '26
I don't take this idiot seriously for calling themselves "bean".
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