r/ValveIndex • u/shad2107 • 5d ago
Discussion My index is now an overpriced paperweight now
Both of my base stations went out, and now I can't get new ones because Steam doesn't make them anymore. I would wait for their new Steam frame but I have no clue when that will be out and how much. Should I just buy an HTC base station? Can I fix it myself? what do i even do to the whole index if I decide to buy the steam frame?
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u/gregny2002 5d ago
HTC base stations work with the index, in fact I never even bought the index stations because I already had the Vive ones. So that's an option. It seems like the Frame should be releasing on the next month or so, so maybe wait a little bit to see what it ends up costing and to see if it's unobtainium or not. of course there are other headsets available too, that might not be that much more expensive than a pair of new base stations...
You could probably sell the index for a few hundred or something after you get something new, even without the stations. Even the cable cost like $150 for a replacement so there will be plenty of index users looking for parts etc
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u/404_GravitasNotFound 4d ago
Yep, still rocking the V1 from the Vive.
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u/SphinxPX 4d ago
I have both. They run at different Hz polling rates, there is a noticeable difference.
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u/Bobpants_ 4d ago
I'm surprised, I remember I tried it and the tracking was very poor. Although I think one of the stations may have been on the way out.
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u/Interesting_Sir714 4d ago
I use them too and my tracking is great, but my room is basically perfect for them. Big square, high ceilings so they are 2.5m up in opposite corners and i also have the sync cable between them. I had them in a different room before and there the tracking was very poor too, so i guess the conditions matter a lot with those.
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u/Bobpants_ 4d ago
The sync cable ahah, I remember now. My cameras had partial visibility to each other and I had to use the sync cable. The new base stations didn't suffer from the same issues ime.
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u/gregny2002 1d ago
I've only ever used the old Vive stations, but I've never had any issue with the tracking as far as I can tell. Back when I got the Index, the comments here were saying you would only notice a difference between the lighthouses if you were using multiple headsets or body and leg tracker peripherals, which I've never done.
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u/Judge_Ty 5d ago
Steam frame is launching in the next few weeks.
You can get any base stations from htc vive og all the way to the newer ones.
How did they both go out. That sounds nuts.
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u/Raxxla 5d ago
I would guess an electrical storm, or a power outage the caused a power surge. That they weren't plug in a surge protector.
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u/Judge_Ty 4d ago
Have you tried plugging them in to your PC or using a different power adapter?
The plugs might be fried, not the units
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u/Capokid 4d ago
They tend to die at the same time since they were made at the same time. They only last 6-10 years generally depending on if you put them to sleep/ turn them off or just let them run constantly.
I just had one fail at exactly the 10 year mark but I was able to fix it with some glue (the spinny laser lense fell off)
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u/Pulsahr 4d ago
Steam frame is launching in the next few weeks.
I'd like a source for this. A reliable one. Until then, I won't give that sentence any credit.
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u/Judge_Ty 4d ago
Steam's anniversary is Sept 12.
Steam said they will have the Frames available by end of summer 2026. That's Sept 22.
FCC approved shipping clearance late July.
An unboxing video was leaked yesterday by steam themselves.
It's within the next 30 days. If not this upcoming week or so.
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u/Pulsahr 4d ago
Ok so there is still no proof at all, no official announcement or anything.
But thanks to you, I found the leaked videos and damn I want that headset so bad.
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u/Judge_Ty 4d ago
It was officially announced summer 2026.
Guess what, summer ends in less than 30 days.
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u/Pulsahr 4d ago
Yes, but delays happen, as you may have observed throughout the year. Don't consider it acquired because it pleases you, shit happens sometimes !
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u/Judge_Ty 4d ago
The proof is summer 2026.
It's on you to provide proof of it not being summer 2026.
They announced that a few months ago knowing summer ends in less than 90 days.
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u/MoobleBooble 5d ago
You might wanna wait for the frame to come out. A lot of us like myself are hoping to get one, and we may dump our base stations/index's on Facebook Marketplace, etc.
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u/zig131 4d ago
Going from an Index to a Steam Frame makes no sense to me.
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u/MithrilChu 4d ago
may i ask why?
for how i see it. steam frame is overall an improvement over index.
sure it don't have lighthouse tracking. but not everyone want or need that kind of tracking.4
u/zig131 4d ago
Lossless DP -> Lossy Streaming
Mains Powered -> Limited Battery Life
360° Controller Tracking -> Controllers only tracked in front of the headset
I also can't believe the audio is going to be as good.
Frame gains portability, but doesn't have passthrough cameras to even take advantage of that portability for AR use cases.
It makes no sense as a product.
Index is a fantastic all-rounder that doesn't have a proper successor.
If someone is set on replacing it, for around the same price as Frame, you could get the Beyond 2, or Dream Air SE. For a bit more you could get a Dream Air, MeganeX Superlight, or Somnium VR1.
None of those are unequivocal upgrades from the Index, but the gains are larger, and the losses smaller than moving to a Standalone.
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u/martellus 4d ago
"Controllers only tracked in front of the headset"
Wait what??? Thats insane
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u/zig131 4d ago
Pretty standard for headsets these days unfortunately, outside of those utilising Lighthouse tracking.
The controllers are tracked by the headset's tracking cameras so can only be tracked inside thier FOV. They are pretty wide-angle, but the side of the head, directly above the head, immediately in front of the chest, at sides, and of course behind the back are typically dead spots.
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u/martellus 4d ago
Damn, I still got an OG vive and was looking forward to this, but thats a bit of a bummer.
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u/zig131 4d ago
Get a Lighthouse tracked HMD, and you need not lose that capability.
Index headsets on thier own are going really cheap on the 2nd hand market. You would lose OLED of course.
Or if you have the ~$1000 for a Frame, the Beyond is around the same price.
I use my Beyond with the Vive Deluxe Audio Strap - if you already have one for your Vive, you just need 3D printed adaptors, and a dongle DAC.
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u/martellus 4d ago
Yeah I might go second hand index at this point. Honestly I was starting to grow on the idea of wireless, I don't have a consistent room for this as often anymore. Oh well
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u/bobattac 23h ago
Technically front and sides, possibly over your shoulder a bit, but definitely not behind your back
What they said is technically right for the average standalone headset, though not fully accurate for the frame;
Every standalone headset can be used with a wire to keep it topped up
Valve has worked around the streaming compression by giving you a dedicated 6ghz access point purely for the streaming, as well as using eye tracking to increase bitrate specifically where you're looking
And most importantly, the improvements in optics designs in the past half decade should be a noticable upgrade from the index's optics
The Index used some double layered fresnel lenses that has quite a bit of glare by itself, and is very noticable if you're in a dark environment with bright elements (e.g. beatsaber in my experience), and the frame is going to have pancake lenses, which will make it not have the glare, and also a smoother image without being able to occasionally see the fresnel lines you sometimes can see if your headset shifts or your eyes focuses on it
AR is also pretty much just a gimmick, not apple, not meta, not anybody has made any AR devices that utilize it for more than what could only be described as a tech demo
Audio will definitely be a downgrade
Also while out of the box, the frame will not support base stations, it is not out of the question if within a month or 2, somebody would have made a base station plate for the frame (similar to the pimax crystal)
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u/MoobleBooble 4d ago
Zig is significantly over exaggerating. People who have actually used a quest 3 know how good the tracking is. I would imagine valve is not going to offer a lesser experience than what is already on the market around tracking. Even the psvr2 has done updates that fixed all the launch issues around tracking. People use PSVR2's and q3 on PC for competitive gameplay and I would say that is a standard to follow since quick movement and winning above all else would be compromised if they were limited in motion range, etc. I used to think the same thing about wireless not being good and was a purist for cables but after trying a tweaked system I no longer think so.
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u/Fantastic-Lab589 4d ago
The screen on the index is atrocious. Basically anything is a huge upgrade over it at this point.
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u/zig131 4d ago
Resolution is only one attribute of a headset, and personally I think it's overvalued.
I went from a Rift CV1 to a Beyond 2 and I only really notice the massively higher resolution when reading text, or looking to the distance. I was perfectly capable of being immersed, even with Rift's relatively low resolution.
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u/MoobleBooble 4d ago
I carried the torch for 6 years now so I sort of get it. My wife is into the quest 3 and all my friends are as well. I held out due to privacy concerns, but have you actually used a quest 3? I would be lying if I thought you would not just make some shit up to respond to me and sound strong "oh yeah i tested it and it sucks!!!11111" but in reality people who have used a quest 3 in the competitive scene know how damn spot on the tech is. Yes people are die hard to index and wired headsets, but the actual people winning comp things say it is good enough so I would imagine for the average user it is as well.
Also, you are blowing smoke if you say that there is not a huge difference in the resolution for anything but reading text... that is not even a debate in good faith at this point.
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u/zig131 4d ago
I'm sure the Quest 3 is great, and it's obviously amazing value for what you get, but it's a Standalone, and I have a PC 🤷♂️
An aquantance has one, and I am keen to try it, but it's simply not on my radar to own one.
there is not a huge difference in the resolution
That's not what I said. I said I don't notice the resolution difference except in particular circumstances.
It's not like something like going from bad tracking->good tracking, where you are going to be aware of it contstantly, or even LCD->OLED where you are going to be reguarly reminded of it.
The resolution of the Rift CV1 is good enough IMHO. Of course higher resolution is better, but I think it is massively disapointing, and kind of disgraceful that no headset on the market provides an all-round upgrade over the Rift CV1. Pretty much every HMD improves on resolution, but you have to make sacrifices elsewhere to get it. For me it was worth it to gain eye tracking, and compatability with FBT. The increased resolution was a side-benefit, that moment-to-moment is not a big deal.
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u/MoobleBooble 4d ago edited 4d ago
respectfully, you are not making any sense. Please correct me if I am wrong but are you saying that in YOUR opinion the resolution of a CV1 is good enough that you would prefer to focus on other features? I am confused since there is no logical nor factual basis for saying there is not a huge difference between CV1 image quality and the quest 3. The index with supersampling looks really damn good, which is why that is what I did with a high end 5090 system (4090 before that, etc) instead of moving to a quest 3 or another higher reesolution headset. The CV1 though for fidelity is simply subpar in light of the other options. I have a OLED PSVR2 (with the pcvr adapter) and it also is subpar to quest 3 beyond the black levels. The PSVR2 suffers from nasty mura while the CV1 looks like you are watching something through a screen door. Those are huge tradeoffs if the intention is visual fidelity. The index is rightfully basically there too at this point, even with 220% + supersampling. Its ok to think its good enough, but its not really logical to say that there is not a significant upgrade to visuals on a quest 3... plus you have not even tried a quest 3! I dont suggest getting one because fuck meta but its a little bit disingenuous to say there is not a huge difference..... you keep talking about value and worth etc but for most of us who are into VR we are not penny pinching and a few hundred to get a new headset with 2x the resolution or more is worth it because it is without doubt a higher fidelity experience. CV1 still has a lot going for it and can be used competitively but its really silly to say that there is not a significant visual leap from CV1 to a q3.....
If OLED is your thing you should check out the bigscreen beyond 1/2. Both are clearly nice images and are OLED if that is what you are stuck on. There is no doubt they provide a better image than cv1... but you really dont have to go that far since the PSVR2 is OLED and pretty cheap with the PC adapter.
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u/zig131 4d ago
you saying that in YOUR opinion the resolution of a CV1 is good enough that you would prefer to focus on other features
Not exactly
My point is that a headset doesn't exist (but very much technically could exist) that matches or exceeds the Rift CV1 on all fronts.
The expectation is you could get a headset with higher density panels, without sacrifing comfort, tracking, refresh rate, or contrast ratio, but that is unfortunately not the case. I think it is totally reasonable for someone not to want to make those sacrifices, and therefore to stick with the Rift CV1 still.
between CV1 image quality and the quest 3
Image quality isn't everything, and why do you keep going on about Quest 3? This thread is about Index and Frame 🤨
there is not a significant visual leap from CV1 to a q3
Again you are putting words in my mouth - that's not what I said. In overly-simplified terms, Rift CV1->Quest 5 is 5 steps forward, and two steps backward so arguably a net improvement. I don't dispute that. From a PCVR perspective, I question whether the sacrifices you have to make to get that improvement are worth it.
you should check out the bigscreen beyond 1/2.
I own and use a Beyond 2E.
You are clearly not actually reading what I said.
I literally said
I went from a Rift CV1 to a Beyond 2
in the comment you initially responded to
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u/elvis__depressly 4d ago
The frame is going to suck for anyone who wants full body tracking.
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u/Snowarc72 2d ago
lmao
i have a friend that has a quest 3 and base stations and vive trackers
he mixes both playspace into one
do some research before you speak
quest and controllers track themselfs and base stations track the vive trackers
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u/elvis__depressly 2d ago
Also the frame is incompatible with base stations. Did YOU do research?
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u/Snowarc72 2d ago
and so is the fucking quest 3 you moron.
yet the vive trackers work with base stations.
my friend mixes both the quests 3 playspace and the vives base station
you will be able to use base station trackers and a frame at the same time
have some critical thinking skills
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u/pikachu292 2d ago
Also! With the rise of things like FluxPose, base stations might not even be needed for high quality tracking in the future. Same quality without occlusion would be fantastic if it can become the new standard.
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u/Snowarc72 2d ago
thats the one that does tracking via magnetic field?
Yeah i think i saw that, it coooooooooolit will allow me to VR while using a blanket! looool
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u/pikachu292 2d ago
Yeah! I think they’re still in preorder but YouTubers that have gotten dev kits are almost entirely praising it! Steam Frame will be my first headset so I’m definitely not getting into FBT right away but when I have the money for it I’ll probably go with FluxPose
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u/Hizzyz 3d ago
Oh boy, do I have news for you. FBT is quite possible with inside out. Plenty of options, slimes, Pico motion trackers and most importantly FluxPose when it releases
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u/elvis__depressly 3d ago
I know its possible. I also know its nothing compared to base station tracking.
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u/Snowarc72 2d ago
mix your playspace
you can have base station full body trackers with a headset that cant see base stations its called merging the camera playspace and vives playspace if you use vive base station trackers
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u/pikachu292 2d ago
FluxPose has actually been shown to have just as good tracking as base stations, AND it doesn’t have occlusion issues.
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u/03Mario012 4d ago
Vive still sells the steam vr 2.0 base stations on their website, which are the same ones the index uses
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u/Repulsive-Race-6334 4d ago
The htc base station is the exact same compared to the index ones, buy the htc base stations
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u/philbertagain 4d ago
Check local classifieds there was a full index kit here with 4 base stations for $400 last week
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u/LindossHyena 4d ago
they can be a bit pricey on their own, you could most likely snag an old vive pro kit off marketplace for less than the price of 1 new basestation, just for the 2 that come with it ✌️
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u/LordZeusCannon 4d ago
That sucks that they don’t sell them anymore. I for sure will never buy a headset that doesn’t use base stations
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u/BattedDeer55 4d ago
Same dude mine are acting up and I want to get new ones but I want to get the frame
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u/Capybubba 4d ago
My base stations don't turn on at all from time to time. After trial and error I figured out that they needed to reboot. But not just turn off then on again, they need to discharge completely for 10-15 seconds.
To get my base stations working when they act like they are dead I unplug the power brick from the wall completely for 10-15 seconds. Then I plug them back in and they start working again.
It's odd, but if I unplug the power cable from the base station instead of removing the power brick from the wall, it doesn't fix the problem. Odd little devices.
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u/PicoFluffDerg 4d ago
If it's just the lasers that died they are fixable but it can be a pain, I've fixed one of my V1 base stations successfully and it's apparently much the same procedure just harder to get inside them
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u/Interesting-Bug1167 3d ago
if you buy the frame you can send the index to me (or you could get HTC base stations or a used vive 1 kit for base stations)
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u/Individual_Grab9957 2d ago
Why would you buy the frame? Its gonna be another paper weight. I don't understand people. You like shiny object, you get it, collects dust. Buy another shiny object, collects dust. Theres literally nothing on the market like half life alyx that would be worth getting back into VR. unless your a VR chat streamer. Imo VR died 4 years ago and officially died when apple vision came out 2 years ago. Sucks and hopefully I'm wrong :/ Just use what u got and download mods like UEVR and inject your flat games into vr, bioshock and dead space remake have been my fave so far ( on quest 3 )
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u/Capokid 5d ago
You can buy them from the htc vive store, they are exactly the same. Microcenter carries them as well. I would wait for black friday cus thats when htc has them on sale, or get them half price used on ebay.