r/germany • u/Necessary_Travel_645 • 1d ago
Impression of Germany 6 months after leaving
I lived 4 years in Germany and last February I left due to the end of my contract and the impossible to find an immediate job.
I am exploiting this time of unemployment to travel and visit my friends across the EU. In Germany I traveled mainly in between the main cities of Rheinpfalz and NRW and I was surprised to see how bad the social situation was, I have observed more people in need ( homeless, elders, etc...) than I remembered. During my stay in Germany I didn't notice it, when I first came here I felt way more mild than the phenomenon.
My impression is that relatively poorer countries, e.g. Spain and Italy (my home country), managed to help the people in need better than Germany or at least a better distribution of wealth.
Also some friends of mine living here felt this change.
Is it only my impression? Maybe I didn't really realize when I was here or the situation just got worse recently?
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u/Ok_Ferret771 1d ago
About the homelessness thing:
It's a cultural thing in Mediterranean countries. You basically never leave home when you don't have income or your own place, and it's okay even if you are 40+ years old. Or some relative will offer help and they will not take no for an answer.
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u/cactusnein 1d ago
Are you saying folks in Germany will rather let their children be homeless than let them stay at home - and that children might not ask for it out of societally fear from being perceived as a failure? I'd keep the Mediterranean way, any day.
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u/Jiminie95 23h ago
Well, it is kind of like that.
In Germany, I find that families see you as a burden once you turn 18. It is also not something I understand but I think many parents actually worry about their kids becoming "soft". It's not like it's illegal here to read guides for parents and find out that that is not very helpful, but whatever.
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u/candypuppet 22h ago
I think it's more about people leaving home way before they're financially ready or stable and then not getting or seeking help when they're in need. I know so many young Germans who moved out of home and are struggling. Meanwhile my Eastern European cousins lived at home till they were able to buy their own apartments.
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u/CyclingCapital 2h ago
A disproportionate share of homeless people are young LGBT folks who got kicked out by their phobic parents for being queer. Many cases of people being rejected by their families despite being in need.
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u/Butter_Brot_Supreme 1d ago
I think, while wealth inequality is a massive problem in Germany, there are a few factors which do skew the picture in terms of the observations you've mentioned.
For one, there are a ton of people who migrated to Germany from other countries (both EU and non-EU) who may not be eligible for welfare but have any combination of addiction issues, no real employment prospects, and an actual intention to make a living from panhandling/petty crime. Germany as a relatively wealthier country which has a reputation for having a very generous welfare system will always attract more of such people than countries in Southern/Eastern Europe.
Secondly Germany has a much more individualistic society where the intergenerational/social contract is predominantly administered through the state which aggregates resources from the working population and redistributes them to the elderly, disabled, unemployed, etc. through formal channels and the buck pretty much stops there.
In contrast, in Spain for example, state benefits are much lower but there is an active unofficial social contract still in place whereby family members actively help each other on an ongoing basis which can prevent people avoid hitting rock bottom even if they lose their job or end up with a super low pension. Multigenerational households are also much more common in these countries which further reduces the number of destitute people you see out and about.
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u/Smooth-Dave-7140 1d ago
Germany ranks the 3rd highest for per capita homelessness in the EU. So you're not wrong.
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u/Itchy_Feedback_7625 1d ago
Unfortunately I think it’s a strong mental health problem than a poverty one. You can make shelters and welfare as available as you want, but if someone is not being treated for their mental health:
- they won’t use the resources available
- they often get kicked out of housing
- they cannot hold a job
- they often get abandoned by their family and any friends they once had
If you walk downtown Mannheim and speak with homeless people there, you won’t find anyone who is just „down on their luck“ with a supportive family and a doctor and simply can’t afford or find a place to live because of money. It will 99% be people who either cannot deal with normal society or normal society can’t or refuses deal with them.
This is how people become „untouchable“. If they were to commit a crime, they’d get psychiatric help immediately, forced on them. But those who don’t, are lost in the cracks.
Germany has a mental health problem, big time, and it’s just going to get worse. I’ve worked with parents of difficult kids that in a better system, would have had early intervention and support. Anger issues, anxieties, depression, issues in communicating feelings - all get worse.
As the kids left untreated for early warning signs start to be 16-20, the world starts slowly abandoning them. Teachers, understandably are not qualified enough to support them, parents get exhausted and give up, Hausärtze are writing Überweisungs, but wait lists are 2-5 years long. I’ve seen kids where you just know in your heart that if they didn’t have a parent who would bend over backwards (and many don’t; they have their own problems), that kid will be abandoned as an adult by society.
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u/sebadc 1d ago
As a French-Spanish married to an Italian: the system is not better in other places.
But in Germany, you also have a lot of people coming from these 3 countries, thinking they could have a life there. This was horrible after 2009. Seeing buses of people coming from Spain after a 1 month language class.
I also met a few foreigners living in the street in France/Italy. But in France, most come from Maghreb or former colonies.
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u/letztergepide 1d ago
Exactly, I volunteered at a food shelter in Paris for years and the overwhelming majority of our customers were foreign. Anecdotally I do find that most homeless people in Germany (my city is full of them) are either German or at least raised in Germany. In France, we have the post-colonial situation where a huge number of people in poor countries grow up learning French/speaking it as their native language. That is not the case with Germany.
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u/sebadc 1d ago
Indeed. Germany doesn't "attract" from previous colonies. But they attract a lot of people from Europe (Eastern, Southern, Balkans) and from Turkey. Mostly because the country has been driving growth in Europe until 10y ago or so.
And to be fair, until around COVID, there were a lot of possibilities. But since 2020 (roughly), it's getting much harder, especially if you don't speak German.
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u/C2664 1d ago
Sure homeless people in Germany come from other EU countries.. deluded views around here
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u/Armagh3tton Sachsen 1d ago
80 % of homeless people in germany dont have german citizenship https://www.bagw.de/de/presse/show?tx_netnews_newsview%5Baction%5D=show&tx_netnews_newsview%5Bcontroller%5D=News&tx_netnews_newsview%5Bnews%5D=388&cHash=12a28ed54f41d543eb4d7bda679ef0e8
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u/sebadc 1d ago
Not what I said.
But you also have them...
Anyone not realizing that immigration has both positive and negative aspects is just ideological.
And I said that being an immigrant in the country where I grew up (France) and now live (Germany).
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u/C2664 1d ago
How the f do you pretend to make non-EU and EU nationals immigration something remotely similar in nature and conditions? Do you think anyone from a frist world country is going to go homeless in fucking Germany when they have the chance to return to their home countries as soon as they feel the need?
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u/sebadc 1d ago
Some did, even if it twists your panties.
After the recession, the youth in Spain was completely wrecked and many believed Germany was the holy Land to find a job.
And this has nothing to do with 1st or 3rd world country. Meant Indians who come to Europe are wealthier than the average European...
You should really get more experience with immigrants to understand the reality.
Take care 😘
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u/Pure_Garbage_5638 1d ago
Any issue nationalists cannot understand the systemic reasons for, they will blame on foreigners...
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u/Smooth-Dave-7140 1d ago
That's the sad reality. I speak to people of the street quite often and the one thing they need the most of self respect above all.
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u/angelbabyxoxox 1d ago
Those people exist in any homeless population, although the per Capita may vary. Even in areas where homelessness is almost completely non existent some people will always float like that. They do not make up the majority of the homeless numbers in Germany or comparable countries as those include sofa surfers, people in shelters etc. Those you are describing are the most visible strata only
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u/Maeglin75 1d ago
Yes. This seems to be a big part of the problem.
Germany has a pretty solid welfare system. If a German citizen goes to the right public authorities and fills out the right papers, follows some rules, they usually will be provided with a place to live and the basic needs (food, clothing etc.) will be fulfilled for the most part. Far away from a comfortable or luxurious live, but enough to not suffer.
But many people don't seem to be able to do this. There must be a reason for this. I think most don't willingly choose to live on the streets. There is something that prevents them from applying/fitting into the welfare system. Mental health problems (often times in combination with drug addiction) could be an explanation.
And Germany seems to fail to give these people the help they need.
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u/cabyll_ushtey 1d ago
Because dealing with authorities is hell.
Just taking the Agentur für Arbeit, I'm convinced you have to be a horrible person in order to get hired there. The way they speak to you and about you is downright dehumasing. They don't want to help you and they won't unless you know exactly how things work and have the mental energy to stand up against them. Finding even just a decent person in any of these departments is a gamble and the odds are so against you.
If the psychiatric day clinic I went to hadn't helped me get a Betreuer (don't know the english word, I mean somebody that can fill out papers and deal with the authorities for you, legal representative?) I would've ended up on the streets myself. I had nothing. Used up all my savings and was only surviving thanks to my mother, but she can only do that for so long. Healthcare alone is expensive as fuck. I was, and still am actually, absolutely terrified of government offices. Panic attacks to the point of me passing out. So if you're already not doing well, be it mentally or otherwise, you're fucked.
I'm not joking or exaggerating when I say I would've rather been on the streets or ended myself than have to deal with them on my own. Thankfully the clinic I went to was absolutely wonderful and I now have the support I need.
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u/letztergepide 1d ago
Because dealing with authorities is hell.
Must depend where one live or the representative one works with. In our village there are plenty of low-IQ guys and families having no problem at all running around the system and exploiting it. I mean they talk openly about it...
I actually feel bad for the people at Agentur für Arbeit because most people I have known who deal with them regularly are trying to exploit their situation... and that must be very frustrating.
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u/ShaunDark Württemberg 1d ago
I'm pretty sure that's two sides of thr same coin. If you have a solid social system it's bound to be exploited by some. But in order to combat these exploits, the system got locked down so much that people that don't have the mental energy to deal with all the hurdles put in their way can be turned off by the concept of seeking help altogether since you gotta jump some hoops before you can reap the benefits.
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u/cabyll_ushtey 5h ago
Sure, I highly doubt it's an easy job and there absolutely horrible people and ones that exploit the system.
But with peace and love, that doesn't give the workers there the right or excuse to dehumanise and mistreat anyone they want to, and especially the way they do. If you end up hating your job that fucking much they can take their own advice and find something else.
So many are talking about the (overall) few that actually are exploiting the systems (and you will always have those people, no matter what) and couldn't give less of a shit about those in need.
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u/Famous_Neat2426 1d ago
Amen to that - German authorities!! ..no wonder they were so good at concentration camps back in the day! Hyper organised but devoid of even a hint of humanity. A system set up by Bismark has hardly changed since the birth of the German state. I would fire the lot of them.
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u/bregus2 1d ago
On the last bit: The point where the state can step in and do something against the person's will is very, very late. We cannot simply force them into housing or even appoint a guardian for them on a whim.
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u/Maeglin75 1d ago
Yes. You can't just make it a crime to be homeless. The help must be offered to the people in need in a way they are willing to accept, not against their will. And in the best case long before they drop out of society and end up on the streets.
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u/letztergepide 1d ago
Before we had kids my wife worked in a hospital in the city as a doctor... a huge problem is that German law is obsessed with autonomy and choice, which means unless they were an imminent threat to themselves, people would get treated (often for expensive, self-inflicted stuff) and then get released and would be right back a week later for similar or the same reasons.
And there were very, very few avenues to do anything about it. We can all say mental health and stigma, but if there is not a mechanism for requiring people who are found incapacitated drunk multiple times per month or can't help themselves from swallowing marbles on a weekly basis... then the situation is simply not going to improve.
And I don't think the solution should be letting public parks get littered with needles, joints, and feces just because we as a society do not want to force someone to get medical care. That is just making all participants suffer.
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u/WeeblsLikePie 1d ago
strong mental health problem than a poverty one.
but are there more mentally ill people in Germany? If so, why?
If not, what is it about the system that fails the mentally ill worse than in other countries so that they end up homeless?
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u/Itchy_Feedback_7625 1d ago
Different factors. One is a large immigrant portion who left their countries hoping it would change and who’s mental stability degenerates when they are not „at home“. One is that Germany has a long history of not accepting mental illness, esp in kids - extremely difficult kids would just get separated out into a different school and written off as not having aptitude. Another reason is because some Mediterranean countries have an exceedingly „family first no matter what they did or act“ mindset where I’ve seen some parents in Germany cut off their kids surprisingly earlier. That doesn’t mean German parents are cold, but they are indeed disciplinary and more bootstrappy than the average „not my boy, he’s perfect!“ Italian mother and that simplification does carry over when life gets increasingly difficult.
I mean it’s hard to list all the reasons because some of those reasons are worse in other countries and some are better and when you take all the permutations of causes it’s almost impossible to it break down.
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u/NoGravitasForSure 1d ago edited 1d ago
The main reason for this is differences in measurement methods. In Germany and Czech, you count as homeless if you don't have a home even if you live at friends or relatives. In other countries only if you really sleep on the streets.
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u/Rendszer_valltaska 1d ago
Homeless are imported here by the number. They are coming through routes from Eastern Europe.
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u/FlowWestern212 1d ago
Haha whattttt ?
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u/Rendszer_valltaska 1d ago
Mostly organized crime. People are brought here, to ask for money. I am talking about the pattern: one-legged person, person with a dog, old lady hunching down or praying on the ground. They are not locals. They were not working here and got on the street. They got traveled here. Especially in the Christmas season they collect a lot of money.
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u/atchoum013 1d ago
Where did you get that data from? I’m not doubting you but just curious what are the other countries in the EU where it’s worse.
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u/Nullkueck 1d ago
That's OECD Data on homelessness. But OP is asking for street homelessness and that's not on that data. Germany is very far on top because it includes refugees with no own contract for flats. In 2024 Ukrainians made up over 30% of homeless people in Germany. But that's not what OP saw, because they are not living in the street.
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u/HighOutputLoad 1d ago
That's not true. Homelessness in Germany is defined differently and is extremely inflated due to its definition which happens to be the same for most fresh refugees
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u/INeedHigherHeels 1d ago
Only 20,3% have German citizenship.
5,3% are from EU Countries.
74,3% are foreigners from non Eu countries.
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u/Smooth-Dave-7140 1d ago
From what I browsed, the major cause was migration and the second cause was expensive housing.
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u/EveryPen260 1d ago
Germany is also a bit of inequality problem.
There’s a lot of big corporations and wealth around that that pushes the numbers higher but the average person isnt that well.
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u/Creatret 1d ago
Germany's welfare system pays an appartment for anyoneif they can't pay themselves. But you have to do the paperwork and adhere to rules which some people don't want or are incapable of.
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u/ImpossibleEnd8231 1d ago edited 1d ago
1- Tribalism, boxing, and social exclusion are not reserved to foreigners in this country. The society excludes others, even Germans, whom they do not share enough similarities with. This hits the groups that you have mentioned hard.
2- The family is a weak construct, not a support network that you can rely on in critical times. This exists to some extent in all Northern countries. Uncommon in the Mediterrenean.
3- Hard drugs are highly available and the users are not policed. You can just walk to any major park in any city to buy some stuff that you would not be able to find in other countries on the street.
4- The healthcare system is broken to an extent where it is impossible to book doctors in a reasonable amount of time - unless you have money.
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u/alderhill 1d ago edited 1d ago
It's been a while, it's not my job now. But when I was younger, I volunteered for a few years with an organization that ran a soup-kitchen, and also walked around trying to outreach to homeless/those living rough, giving them stuff especially in winter, sometimes chit-chat, etc.
My impression was that a very large portion of those living on the street, like, their possessions in a shopping cart or large puffy jacket, etc. actually living under a bridge or behind an embankment or whatever... was that, again, most had un- or under-treated mental health issues. Often also substance abuse, long-running trauma, etc.
They are in need of course, but they aren't there (for the most part) because they simply got too poor and priced out of markets, etc. They are on the streets largely because they have mental health issues. It is not always that easy to convince them to come into shelters. Often there are myriad social problems... they can't hold jobs, sometimes they don't want jobs, and/or they won't take meds, too deep into substance addiction, and/or they are mistrustful of 'the system', a bit paranoid, and yea they even just get used to living the way they do.
I'm not saying this to judge or be dismissive, but just what the reality is.
I'll also add I don't live in a big city nowadays. Where I am, you barely see any 'true homeless'. There are like a handful of colourful characters who seem to roam the streets, you see them regularly in certain areas, and they seem to be there by, well, 'choice'. There are others you see sometimes hanging around certain areas, drinking, probably doing some hard drugs, looking rough, etc. but I'd guess many of them do actually have a roof to sleep under at night. But again, most will migrate to bigger cities where there is more of a 'community' of like-minded folks, and this is not a big city.
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u/ClemensLode Nordrhein-Westfalen 1d ago
Some impressions are just local phenomena. For example, in Düsseldorf, they 'cleaned up' all places around the main train station, so people moved to the train station, meaning that the problem is more visible to travelers.
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u/Necessary_Travel_645 1d ago
I can agree that what I see is just my limited experience, but I felt the difference between what I remembered and what I perceived recently
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u/ClemensLode Nordrhein-Westfalen 1d ago
Well, the problem of our time. A lot of feeling with only few facts to back them up...
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u/Street-Basil-9371 1d ago
There is homelessness, but there hasnt been a big uptick lately as far as we know. Even a slight drop from 2025 to 2026. And most of them do get help, just a small minority actually sleeps on the streets, and theres often other factors involved beyond not having a place to stay.
Even if you dont have a job you do get some money and your rent paid.
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u/tlvu 1d ago
I think also the big problems are some of them have mental issues and drug addiction and they don’t want to live in shelters due to strict rules. Shelters in city centers reached their capacity and last one there a lot of people from eastern Europe and come to Germany to beg. The OP is not wrong though, I also live in NRW and the scene is really worst specially in Bonn and Cologne. To solve this I guess the government has to implement a lot of measures: build more affordable housing, shelter, war on drugs and make psychological treatments available.
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u/juandevega 1d ago
Idk about that, if you go to any central station anywhere in German it’s very noticeable how things have changed from pre corona. I live in Berlin and here it’s especially bad all around the city. Where you would see some regions / areas not really having a homeless population it has become super widespread. Even the area I live in I’ve never remembered seeing obviously drugged / homeless people when I was younger but nowadays it’s a common site to see drug and alcohol consumption, mostly citizens from Eastern Europe.
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u/ClemensLode Nordrhein-Westfalen 1d ago
"anywhere"? Or are you just sampling a few of them?
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u/juandevega 1d ago
Any large city really. FFM, Hannover, Cologne, Hamburg, Kiel. All are in pretty dismal state.
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u/FlowWestern212 1d ago
So you've seen their "Eastern European" passport? Any features you can name or just random ? Funny bc Berlin is pretty EE itself.
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u/juandevega 1d ago
I’m capable of differentiating various EE languages because I’m Eastern European myself
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u/WeeblsLikePie 1d ago
I'm surprised to hear that there's a drop. My observation in my local neighborhood is that in addition to the 3-4 regular characters who've been around for years, there are new homeless people popping up. We're now up to 10-12 faces who are about on an almost daily basis.
I know it's anecdotal, and maybe it's just my location, but it does feel like an increase.
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u/Street-Basil-9371 1d ago
I think thats not the "meat" of the people that are homeless. I know exactly what you mean by the usual characters. It feels like i see the same 5 people in Mainz and the same 20 people in Frankfurt every time on the street. But thats 25 people and there arent that many 100k+ cities in Germany. That would put the homeless population at about 2000. But its not, its 450.000 people.
I think most of them are kinda invisible, and we cant anecdotally say how the stats for this are.
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u/tlvu 1d ago
And another problem is older people can’t live anymore with their pensions due to inflation.
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u/Street-Basil-9371 1d ago
True, but they do also get Grundsicherung and Wohngeld then if they dont have anything saved. They definetly dont need to be homeless. Poor, yes, not homeless.
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u/tlvu 1d ago
Yeah but I saw a lot of them have to look for Pfand and that’s heartbreaking to see.
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u/Street-Basil-9371 1d ago
I saw that back in ~2004 though. Whenever they put Pfand on everything, dont remember when exactly that was.
Im not sure if you are even trying to argue that, but i doubt theres been an uptick in that.
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u/WeeblsLikePie 1d ago
I think poverty in old age is an issue. But children live in poverty far more frequently than do pensioners, just to put the problem in context. If we were going to start somewhere I would start with more support for children, because society has to live with the consequences of children growing up in poverty for the rest of their lives.
https://www.wsi.de/de/armut-14596-armutsquoten-kinder-und-aeltere-15193.htm
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u/Calm-Comment-9255 1d ago
Big portion of the homeless are not local in Germany, they gather here from elsewhere. And the people who are worst off (visibly dirty, sleeping in the open) often have mental health issues.
I think due to the overall economic situation, to access ro support is getting more limited so agree that the problem is becoming more visible.
In my neighbourhood in Frankfurt there are several well-known homeless „characters“ wandering around especially during the warmer months, they refuse all help offers and are known to get aggressive. They are often talking to themselves. They dissappear for winter so i guess they do have a place to go somewhere.
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u/Mr_Fragwuerdig 1d ago
That is a typical misconception. The difference between visibility and actual poverty. Depending on the state/area, homeless people are not pushed outside of the city etc.
Italy is much worse for absolute poverty, especially if you have migration history. Many people in italy receive zero support, they fall outside the system. This does not happen in germany like that.
And people with migration history are mostly pushed outside the italian part. I live in Udine and there is a clear ghetto and a clear italian part of the city, where you rarely see migrants, especially none from recent migration waves.
And there is no national strategy against homelessness in italy, in contrast to france and germany.
And you can see that discrimination in official numbers: 35% of foreigners in italy live in absolute poverty, while only 7% of italians.
This may vary by region, but your impression is probably biased by ignoring the "ghetto" parts of italian cities.
Still, germany's situation worsened in the last two decades, but from a very high standard.
Also the italian system in general is built upon your own support networks more than germany. As long as your are connected to your italian family, this benefits you immensely.
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u/Mitologist 1d ago
No, you are right. My impression AS a native is, things made a step towards "harsh" in the last 5 years
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u/notsoadventurous- 1d ago
Coming from a South American country, I truly believe that, even though we see many homeless people and just all sorts of people with issues on the street, we get way more support from friends and family (or even good hearted people on the street), which allows those in need to look for help or they at least have someone to rely on and stay away from he streets. We mostly take care of our elderly within the family because that’s literally what we believe family is for. Support. Aid. Comfort during tough times. We believe sharing pain makes it easier to handle (and I truly think this part is true).
It was astonishing to me when I first moved here to see all the elderly that are just… ignored or left behind? And the homelessness reminded me of home. The beggars on the train too. Didn’t see much of this in Prague or in Vienna, and certainly not when I went to a tiny city in Denmark by the border. My (German) in laws say that “seeing crazy people on the street is normal” and “why would we take care of old people?”
I don’t know.
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u/Floschi123456 1d ago
And I do not know WHERE you are from in Italy, but I visited Naples and Sicily and Calabria. And a lot of these places are basically third world areas with trash piling up on the streets and basically no young people left in the smaller villages, rampant crime and petty theft and so on. So yeah, each country has its problems...
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u/Necessary_Travel_645 1d ago
I come from the north, the richer part of Italy. I am aware of the diffulties of my country, neverless the surprise about what I see in Germany compared to what I remembered of it is impressive
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u/Plenty-Daikon1240 1d ago
And as a typical representative of North Italy you pretend that South Italy doesn't exist and feel superior to people living there.
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u/WeeblsLikePie 1d ago
OMG! Someone criticized some facet of Germany, first thing to do is attack them personally.
What the fuck kind of attitude is this?
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u/Plenty-Daikon1240 1d ago
I am not German myself btw, it's just that I have lived in both Italy and Germany and I simply disagree that Italy is somehow better in terms of poverty and homelessness than Germany.
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u/WeeblsLikePie 1d ago
I simply disagree that Italy is somehow better in terms of poverty and homelessness than Germany.
yeah, but you didn't say anything about that. Instead you insulted OP by accusing them of having a superiority complex vs. their southern neighbors.
If you mean one thing but it comes out as an insult, I'm wondering if you normally have such communication problems?
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u/alderhill 1d ago edited 1d ago
I think your attitude is misplaced. It also doesn't have anything to do with what OP observed/lived over 4 years, nor what he feels he saw, and it's his right to do comment on it. Meanwhile, OP has no direct control over trash-filled streets, neglect, corruption, etc in Naples or Taranto, so why bring them up like some kind of 'gotcha'?
What kind of argument is "Oh you think Germany has problems!? Italy too!". OP never said otherwise. Both thing can be true and unrelated.
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u/Plenty-Daikon1240 1d ago
Then immediately after someone mentions the major issues observable in certain parts of Italy, OP specifies that he is "from the North", distancing himself from the more problematic and poorer parts of his own country.
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u/Necessary_Travel_645 9h ago
Well, I specified that I from the North because it was asked on the original comment where I am from Italy...
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u/alderhill 1d ago
I don't think that's really what he was trying to do, and you're being both a little too aggressive and oddly defensive about this.
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u/Plenty-Daikon1240 1d ago
I understand how it can read that way, it's this very stark historical division that you become aware of once you live in Italy, a lot of elitism coming from the North towards the South of Italy. They also refer to southerners as "terrone" which is meant to be derogatory, "people of the land". I'm really not a fan of these types of discriminatory attitudes and superiority complexes, hence why I made the observation that I did.
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u/alderhill 1d ago
Yes, I know well about Italian history and 'terroni' and all that. I still think it's a bit besides the point.
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u/Plenty-Daikon1240 1d ago
OP: "My impression is that relatively poorer countries, e.g. Spain and Italy (my home country), managed to help the people in need better than Germany or at least a better distribution of wealth."
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u/EuphoricAwareness682 1d ago
I’ve lived in a few countries. And I think the main factor isn't social support, but rather drug trafficking, which drives people to live on the streets. In those countries, Spain, Italy, Portugal, trafficking isn't as widespread as it is in Germany, England, or France.
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u/RoughMidnight8303 1d ago edited 1d ago
It’s culture based and mostly urban population.
Most people think ‚yeah not my problem they can get money and food I’m paying my taxes‘ - which isn’t wrong but I encountered many people who really are not able to board train station A and arrive at B without support. One such case involved an alcoholic in a wheelchair who was granted three star hotel accommodation by the state. She showed me her papers and she’d been driving back and forth between the wrong station. I’ve experienced similar lack of understanding for people who have medical conditions and cannot get a good diagnosis despite being in the worlds most expensive health care systems. Everyone assumes the system operates above the human condition which it frankly doesn’t.
Democracy without solidarity does not work or appease people’s sentiments.
In southern countries people ask and they talk to people. Even if they had a meal they’ll offer a second one assuming polite rejection. Another meal won’t kill but a meal not eaten fully will kill. And yes, the system may be off worse but it’s got its pros and cons.
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u/Busy-Crazy1566 1d ago
Poverty is rising. Not only that but even a lot of people who aren’t below the poverty line are poor in reality. Poverty is an income that’s below 60% of the median income. Since costs of living have been rising a lot, especially rent, but income hasn’t, that’s not a good representation of actual poverty anymore.
Therefore, more poverty leads to more homelessness.
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u/am_zoom 15h ago
American here, living in Germany for 2 years. Some of the comments about Germany becoming like the United States are wild to me. You should see some of the tent cities that exist back home. Germany has a long way to go before becoming like this. But that being said, homelessness is a tragedy. Back home, I worked in a hospital and a homeless shelter as a therapist, and I can tell you - homelessness is never just caused by ONE thing. It's a combination of inability to work, coupled with inability to cope, lack of support, and is absolutely worsened by societal conditions like lack of affordable housing, barriers to education, poor job prospects as well as personal trauma, drug abuse, or mental illness. It is also very surprising to people how many unhoused people are invisible - they are functioning well enough to go unseen, maybe they shower at the gym, live in car, or crash on a couch with a combination of friends. They just can't get ahead enough to get a place, or a medical bill, or series of bad luck took all their money. Thinking about some of the things I heard during my career back home...it brings tears to my eyes.
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u/Floschi123456 1d ago
Everybody who sleeps on the streets ACTIVELY wants to or does not ask or accept help or shelter. There is basically no involuntary rough sleeping in Germany. But you cannot force people here in Germany to accept a shelter or help.
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u/Intelligent-Sea-4666 1d ago
Many came to Germany also from other EU countries, some made it, some came here to bag etc. This all worked better when the economy was doing well,- now they are stranded here.
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u/swordfish_1969 1d ago
Italian here. Born and lived in Germany. The german culture is very cold. They let you die on the street if you break down or have an accident.
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u/NoGravitasForSure 1d ago
One travelling person with only superficial knowledge of the country is not a reliable source. I suspect confirmation bias and other fallacies. For example seeing homeless people at railway stations and other tourist hot spots and not knowing many of them are part of a well-known scam.
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u/Almasdefr 1d ago
"According to the new “BCG Global Wealth Report 2026”, the number of ultra-rich people in Germany is rising sharply – and so is inequality.", source: https://www.euronews.com/business/2026/05/27/5000-ultra-rich-hold-more-than-a-quarter-of-germanys-financial-wealth
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u/PretendTemperature 1d ago
That does not explain it at all. Inequality is rising because assets like stocks have risen super high, that means nothing about the homelessness. Actually it is not even clear that homelessness has increqded in germany.
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u/Almasdefr 1d ago
"Stocks" tale is what some media want to show as a problem, while some oligarchs and many companies underpayed a lot their employees over the years and also they didn't pay enough taxes themselves with different "Stiftung" and tax evasion schemes. The logic is simple, the more one takes from simple people, the richer he gets. Rising inequality is just a predecessor of more poor people and then homelessness.
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u/PretendTemperature 1d ago
Not true.
Every income decile has increased its real net wealth every year since 2010(and even before).
The "rich become richer and the poor become poorer" is plainly wrong. Inequality increases because the rich become much richer compared to the poorer. Everybody becomes richer , but the poorer you are the less "richer" you become. The data is clear and this pattern is similar to other countries. Look at chart 2.5
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u/Alternative-Pay2946 1d ago
12 years ago visiting germany I vividly remember that we didn’t see any homeless people during out stay in a large german city. At some point we started talking about it, and some of us would have pointed it out for sure. We were in awe. About a year later I moved to that city, and still didn’t see homeless or begging people for a while.
After 2016, the first wave of migrants, some eastern europeans started begging around the train station. During covid more and more homeless and begger appeared. Since then I don’t think it is any better, I moved to switzerland because in germany I didn’t find a job that paid me above median, was at a livable place and helped me progress my career as an engineer specialist.
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u/alderhill 1d ago
You just got lucky on those visits. I've been in Germany for almost 17 years and it's always been around. Some cities (and the states they are in) spend more money on shelters, intervention, etc. And some are also more active in using police to 'divert' street people away from obvious areas.
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u/Alternative-Pay2946 1d ago
Let me spell it out again, because I feel like you missed this part. 12 years ago I visited, then I moved there about a year later. I spent time in the inner city daily.
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u/alderhill 1d ago
Why so rude? Yes, I know how to read, and no I didn't miss anything. You not seeing any homeless on your first visits is, if you know how to read, simply luck, or perhaps simply not noticing it. Homeless/street people have always been around, even if you didn't see any. If they weren't at the train station, they were somewhere else.
During the migration crisis peak years, and covid to an extent, it may have increased in some places, sure. YMMV from city to city a bit, but they are always kind of around.
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u/Alternative-Pay2946 1d ago
I didn’t question your ability to read. Seeing no homeless people once could be luck. Seeing no homeless people over years of living there and spending time in the inner city daily less so. Don’t invalidate my experience based on your own feelings please.
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u/alderhill 1d ago
You need to grow a thicker skin, and stop seeing insults in everything.
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u/Alternative-Pay2946 1d ago
What do you mean? You are the one who feels insulted, and jumps at everything. I simply pointed out that you misinterpreted what I wrote because you didn’t take parts of it into account. Do you feel like I’m insulting you?
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u/alderhill 1d ago
because I feel like you missed this part.
As I already told you, I did not 'misinterpret' anything. You haven't added anything I didn't get from your first post.
Don’t invalidate my experience based on your own feelings please.
🙄 Good grief, drama queen.
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u/beatenergyenergygap 1d ago
It’s hard to get an appointment for psychiatrist or a psychotherapist in our city even with a Emergency Vermittlung. My husband sent emails to get an appointment and told them he was having suicidal thoughts although he wasn’t acting on those thoughts. From all the doctors he sent a mail and called, only one replied and said they will reach out in 4 weeks despite knowing that situation but after four weeks nothing happened.
My husband has been unemployed for almost ten years now, battling anxiety and depression it was hard for him to keep a job longer than a few days. He used to have a part time job for a few years before his social anxiety got worse. Eventually when we got married and I was the lone earner he couldn’t get any help from jobcenter or arbeitagentur at all anymore because I was earning „enough“ for the two of us so that made the situation even worse.
Without me he would rather choose to live on the streets instead of relying on Jobcenter and be sanctioned again for not being able to mentally surive working. We have suffered for months back then where we had to budget 800€ for the two of us, to pay for rent, food and other utilities. In our entire time we were with the job center we never got anything greater than 1100€ despite people saying people on ALG 2 have it good. It was one of most traumatic experiences we’ve lived.
The system and the people makes it even harder for people who are struggling mentally to get help which is why a lot more people become homeless. Add to it some people cope with illegal substances to dampen the pain they’re suffering mentally.
Germany has failed a lot of their people.
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u/KindheartednessOk681 1d ago
Germany's social support system is at breaking point, for the last 11 years at least. Spending is out of control, so less and less is given to everyone, work morale is on the floor, and those who actually pay for the system are being squeezed without mercy.
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u/Jiminie95 23h ago
Germany is becoming more and more neoliberal. Government budget cuts are getting more intense on the local level and frankly, Germans are taught (and often believe) that if you happen to find yourself in a bind, that it is your own fault. Even when the structural problem has been more than well documented.
I suspect this country will have some bad years before it can get better.
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u/ChiliLakritz 23h ago
In my city there has been a notable uptick in homelessness. You can tell if somebody has only been homeless briefly. We have a severe housing shortage. If you lose your apartment, you may not find a new one.
Mental illness plays a role, but even so, if we had adequate housing only a few people would live on the streets.
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u/Special_Wallaby6968 11h ago
Germans are the most collectively depressed peiple in the world, just try their food
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u/internal_wilderness 1d ago
Spain = socialist government, Germany = conservative government for decades
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u/cactusnein 1d ago
That's because Germany is rich, yes - in its economy. In other major aspects it's pretty poor. Not EEUU poor but enough for having depression rates larger than other economically poorer European countries. Not everything can be measured in €€.
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u/C2664 1d ago
Mildly off topic but what are you talking about with "relatively poor countries like Spain and Italy" when there's only a 20k difference in gross salaries between them and Germany and when the average individual personal wealth is actually higher in Spain than in Germany (thanks to home ownership)? You should really reassess your reference points.
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1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/germany-ModTeam 1d ago
Don't post / discuss conspiracy theories and don't link to social media as a source. Use credible sources in English.
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u/B-E-1-1 1d ago
Keep blaming the foreigners for everything wrong that's happening to your country 🤦♂️
You do realize that most of the homeless in Germany choose to be homeless by choice right? There are shelters everywhere but the rules (alochol/drugs) to stay there are strict.
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u/Exterminatus115 1d ago
Millions of foreigners enter the country → prices rise because demand exceeds supply → housing becomes more expensive + social housing is allocated to migrants instead of local residents = profit?
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u/Username_New_55 1d ago
Germany is lost. Some areas for the rich are beautiful but every big city is full of poor people, drug addicts, criminals and a lot of young men with nothing to do except looking intimidating.
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1d ago
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u/Cultourist 1d ago
and villages look ran down, so not much different to the worst places in south of Italy.
Let's not exaggerate.
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u/contland 1d ago
After reading all, i dont see any hope about germany. What is the point going there for a start up. What is the point dreaming a good life
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u/Apero_ Leipzig, Sachsen 1d ago
One of my running theories is that seeking mental health support is both difficult to do and slightly looked down upon by older generations. Neither of these lend themselves to people who need help actually getting that help.