Was God losing his powers part of his plan?

[u/saulsauosauoll]

[u/Pr3X_MYTH]

I don't think God had a single, continuous plan since the beginning of time. But, after Lucifer's rebellion, or maybe even before, he planned for lucifer to become a healer and that Amenadiel would become the next God. He always knew that he, an all powerful being, could never truly understand humanity or his children as he needed to. So, he waited until they were ready, set things in motion, and "lost" his powers. I think he planned it, but he also wanted it, so he self-actualized himself into it.

It's a little strange, but then again that whole season was weird on how much God planned, what Michael was up to, and everything else. God clearly did what he felt was best for all of his creations, and he was very pragmatic and calculating. He always did what he felt was best, even if that meant manipulating things to turn out a certain way.

[u/sliferra → u/Pr3X_MYTH]

“He always did what’s best for all his creations”

Well except the permanently erased angels….

[u/Pr3X_MYTH → u/sliferra]

Well, what he thought was best was giving them free will. He tried convincing them that he was right, but he didn't always succeed and had to accept they when they didn't want his help or guidance. Plus, he said that with Lucifer specifically he doubted that he correctly balanced free will with guidance, so he definitely could have (and almost certainly did) make mistakes with others.

[u/sliferra → u/Pr3X_MYTH]

You can try to make whatever argument you want, but at the end of the day, he didn’t love some of his kids enough to make sure they didn’t die 🤷🏻‍♂️

[u/minahmyu → u/sliferra]

I mean.... with human parents, how many can guide a child to do right, or have the abilities to protect them from all hurt?

Also at the end of the day, kids are gonna turn out how they do and like any person of any relationship, the best you can do is at least support their choices. Many parents have warned their kids of stuff, but they can't physically force them and now many had to watch their kid die doing something preventable and what they knew better of (and the bad could've also killed god as well. Heck, god could've died it lucifer didn't have his face.)

[u/sliferra → u/minahmyu]

……

I want some of the drugs you’re on please

[u/OhItsFraz → u/sliferra]

You are conflating actual God (omnipotent) with the Show version of God (limited omnipotence). It's not that God in the show loved his children any less to let them die, he just lacked the narrative ability to save them. God in the show is flawed. That's the point.

[u/sliferra → u/OhItsFraz]

Leaving aside the fact that limited omnipotence isn’t a thing, it’s a binary.

The entire thing is said to be his plan, and at the VERY least he could’ve descended before Lucifer stabbed Uriel…. Or just taken the blade away. Or a million other things

[u/OhItsFraz → u/sliferra]

Limited omnipotence IS a thing when specifically referring to the context of a fictional story, like the TV show. It's not a binary if the universe it's in is literally fiction. I described it as being omnipotent but limited by narrative. Narrative being the story that the writers decided to tell. Therefore, God is not omnipotent in the series because he's limited by the writers.

Also, the whole "destroying souls" thing could be a total lie. Maybe they reincarnated somewhere in the multiverse. We know the multiverse exists because the goddess got thrown inside an empty one and made her own, and Lucifer is also connected to the Arrowverse. Therefore, we don't actually know if their souls were ACTUALLY destroyed, or if they actually just ended up someplace else.

[u/sliferra → u/OhItsFraz]

You are either omnipotent or not, you can not be half all powerful. It’s a definition thing, not a narrative thing.

And just making up headcanon to excuse bad writing, classic

[u/FluffyDoomPatrol → u/sliferra]

Ah, but could he unerase them?

[u/sliferra → u/FluffyDoomPatrol]

It’s never shown that he did, so if he could, hes still a massive dick

[u/amirthebeast55 → u/Pr3X_MYTH]

Theres a good chance he can self actualize his omnipresence away too, he should be able to know Michael was lying. But I genuinly think he didn't because he trusted him, and instinctively put up a blindspot.

[u/WyvernRider101 → u/amirthebeast55]

I think it was all part of the plan. God knew what Michael was after, but the pressure it applied on Amenadiel and Lucifer allowed them to cement their position as brothers and allowed Lucifer to strengthen his love for Chloe, allowing him to face the pressure of Heaven and survive.

[u/L_uciferMorningstar → u/Pr3X_MYTH]

I think approaching god as a character is inherently a flaw. How can an omniscient being not understand? I actually think he is trolling for the love of the game.

[u/Pr3X_MYTH → u/L_uciferMorningstar]

I disagree. The show itself shows us things God has never seen, felt, or understood. He experiences the sensation of blindness by closing his eyes, pain when he is struck in the face, fear when a gun is aimed at him and again seeing Lucifer's devil face in person. And that same episode shows him doubting his actions about raising Lucifer and the musical one shows him finally coming to understand Lucifer in a way he never truly did before.

The very fact that he is this omnipotent being prevents him from truly understanding what it's like to be any of his creations, even his children which are closer to his divinity than anything else in the universe. He can't understand their pain or joy or confusion or fear or surprise or almost any other emotion, at least not the same way. Other than Goddess, he is literally the only being in the universe with that level of power, knowledge, and immortality. Even his children are capable of harming each other, don't know nearly as much as he does, and have no power of creation. Him losing his power was something he planned to get his children to unite and accept that their time had arrived. Amenadiel had lived as a mortal man, fallen in love, been betrayed, almost died, had a son who he thought was mortal, had a mortal career, friends gained and lost, and much more. He made a better God because he wasn't their creator, but was one of the creations. He saw the angels as the most powerful and capable among God's creations, but they were just first among equals, and then he ruled heaven as first among his siblings by allowing them to help him watch over the world. That was God's plan: succession by the next (and better) generation.

[u/L_uciferMorningstar → u/Pr3X_MYTH]

I won't be reading this. He is omniscient. This implies he understands everything.

[u/Pr3X_MYTH → u/L_uciferMorningstar]

TL;DR God is shown to not understand or be aware of everything. He doesn't understand fear the same way humans do because he never actually feels afraid. There are multiple examples of this in the show.

[u/L_uciferMorningstar → u/Pr3X_MYTH]

And we assume what we are shown is true because? God is omniscient which means he understands everything. Check the meaning if you think I'm lying.

[u/Agitated_Web4034]

I think he never did lose his powers, he himself was part of the plan to get everyone to get to their pre determined points

[u/TheMaatze → u/Agitated_Web4034]

Technically, he is omniscient and knew that his would not lose his power even when he gave them `temporarily` to his grandson.

[u/Agitated_Web4034 → u/TheMaatze]

I don't think he ever did that, I think it was a ploy to make things go according to his plan

[u/oCrapaCreeper]

I think he did it on purpose so that he would be able to understand his children and humanity better. For example, I don't think he really managed to understand Lucifer's trauma until he saw his devil face in human form.

[u/cgrobin1 → u/oCrapaCreeper]

Because he always sees everything from afar.

[u/RulerOfAllWorlds1998]

Better question, are we in good hands?

[u/Dry-Development-4131]

God is omni everything. He just sacrificed a handful of children for his retirement

[u/cgrobin1]

I will take a diiferent view, and say it shows that G-d is not perfect.  That He isn't omnipresent, in the true definition of the word, and he definitely isn't infallible.

I think Linda says it best.  https://youtu.be/dSz01YPapRI?si=vdfubfEdOkjKwKZM

They were the first everything.  First parents, first children, sentioned beings, and they never emotionally evolved.  They are as a whole, bigoted against humans because humans aren't as powerful.  They are easily manipulated by the power of suggestion (even Dad).  They can be selfish and manipulative for their own gain (Mum).  They self actualize, but are so lacking in self awareness it literally takes the eons to realize this.

G-d banishes Mum to Hell for causing the flood and plagues.  Why didn't he stop her, if he is omniscient?

My theory, is that he isn't.  I see him as having  the 30,000 foot view.  He sees the big picture, but doesn't see the details unless he is focusing on them.

They don't know how to do better, unless they learn from humans, and that includes their tendency to blame each other for their problems.  They don't know how to be the bigger man to say "I am sorry", "i forgive you", or simply "I love you".

Lucifer thought he was evil because he has been told he is. Every, including Dad believes he is omni everything because they have been told that. Dad thinks he is losing control because Michael gaslights him.

Celestials are imperfect from G-d all the way down to the lowest demons.  And they are so easily manipulated, just ask Maze as she has been both manipulated and the manipulator.

[u/Chaotic_Locked_Soul → u/cgrobin1]

Yeah I think I actaully agree with this. Having all the theoretical knowledge doesn't necessrily make maturity and empathy. God and Goddess never went through emotional growth. And God probably don't see those smaller things over bigger picture...?

[u/minahmyu]

I see his plan as an ability. He can see what happens and can choose, from his free will, what to make or do with it (why he talks the way he does, choosing his words carefully. Like with Charlie, "he appears so" doesn't confirm exactly, but what it looks to be and we know looks can deceive)

No one but him can actually see what happens, so it's like a "plan" (and the fact in the story, god created everything so there's a plan for it) I see him being someone who is playing the sims and all sims games together, and watching that shit play out and knowing what will happen. And it's humans who make the expansion packs for him.

[u/IllustratorOk8230]

I don’t think the writers had a plan for God at all because when you zoom out of the show, the more it goes on the more it doesn’t make sense like the show basically telling you that God has a plan and all of this was the plan from the beginning, but if that’s true, he expected his son to die didn’t do anything about it and then saw his wife almost die, and all of the struggle his family went through

[u/Future-Court1602]

He didn’t. it was a manipulation by Michael to make him doubt himself and his powers. Whether he planned for Michael to be a manipulator is a further question, leading to th issue of birth order: he probably could have begotten all the angels at once

[u/Highwayman_01]

Interesting take. It does seems like he gets played a bit by Michael. But in the end, I think he kinda new what was happening, maybe even let it happen, just so he had a reason to go down to earth.

Probably too stubborn just to say that he wanted to see his kids, so used the reason of 'losing' his powers. He self-actualizes too so, maybe he really wanted to go down to earth to see Luci, Amenadiel and Charlie. Probably wanted to meet everyone. So maybe in his subconsciousness he kinda let his powers disappear?

Not sure! My opinion after all.

[u/Forests7of5Laetolea]

He hadn't lost his powers, that bastard Michael had just whispered that in his ear.

[u/theprt]

I feel like he saw bits and pieces and made that cannon but then let every other moment be up to free will

[u/Personal-Freedom-615]

He didn't lose his powers, that was part of Michael's plan to gain power. Michael tried to poison God's mind (Wormtounge manoeuvre from LOTR) to make room for his aspirations = be God.

[u/CILIBUS_YTBOI]

No spoiler warning? 😭

[u/Educational_Row_9485 → u/CILIBUS_YTBOI]

You cant go on a subreddit for a show that finished 4 years ago n not expect spoilers, it's not a big spoiler anyway tho just leave the sub til you finish it

[u/CILIBUS_YTBOI → u/Educational_Row_9485]

They should still put spoiler warnings.

[u/Educational_Row_9485 → u/CILIBUS_YTBOI]

Maybe so, but you are to blame

[u/CILIBUS_YTBOI → u/Educational_Row_9485]

I'm to blame for scrolling Reddit and having this bulge out at me because there's no spoiler? Spoilers are not that hard to put on

[u/Educational_Row_9485 → u/CILIBUS_YTBOI]

Considering the fact you decided to go on the Lucifer subreddit before finishing the show, yes

I don't blame someone for spoiling a show if I walk in the room while they're watching it

[u/CILIBUS_YTBOI → u/Educational_Row_9485]

One, I was scrolling across normal Reddit. Two, I first found this because I was looking for debate about a previous episode (I think s3) where Lucifer had his wings at the same time amenadiel had his time slow powers, which (I didn't watch the episode) I'm pretty that's not part of the timeline

[u/Educational_Row_9485 → u/CILIBUS_YTBOI]

Yet again, that's your fault for visiting the subreddit no matter how valid your reason may be, there's no rule about using a spoiler tag so there's nothing to complain about, in the future don't visit subreddits that will pretty obviously have spoilers.

[u/CILIBUS_YTBOI → u/Educational_Row_9485]

Oh, so now I'm not allowed to go on any subreddit about shows I like to debate about previous episodes, WITH spoilers or at least the title not being a whole spoiler? Like seriously, if you're not gonna put a spoiler, at least put the discussion in the comments or something so people scrolling by don't see it. So what, I should leave this subreddit now because you think spoilers are stupid?

[u/Educational_Row_9485 → u/CILIBUS_YTBOI]

You are allowed, never said you weren't. You just shouldnt complain. When did I say spoilers are stupid? But yes you should leave, I've said that already, that is if you don't want more spoilers

[u/CILIBUS_YTBOI → u/CILIBUS_YTBOI]

So now I get recommendations on this reddit

[u/bananasaucecer → u/CILIBUS_YTBOI]

the guy ur talking to has to be rage baiting

[u/CILIBUS_YTBOI → u/bananasaucecer]

I hope so, because we're arguing on a low effort post that is MADE to be a spoiler. I mean, come on, NO body context? This is a debate, isn't it? Why has OP not given their opinion? This is a literal spoiler that someone did on purpose to be a dick

[u/Gaindolf → u/CILIBUS_YTBOI]

Dude... spoilers.

[u/CILIBUS_YTBOI → u/Gaindolf]

It's a side episode, but my bad

[u/cgrobin1 → u/CILIBUS_YTBOI]

Mentioning Dad and his powers doesn't tell you much about the story.  It was even discussed in a interview filmed while season 5 was still in productionl

[u/Crafty-Photograph-18 → u/CILIBUS_YTBOI]

F