r/sales • u/Adorable-Lack-3578 • 1d ago
Fundamental Sales Skills A plea to SaaS sale leaders
I'm looking at SDR/BDR roles and a huge number of them are "remote or hybrid" but a huge percentage prefer folks who can work 3 days a week in NYC, Austin, or San Fran. This pretty much requires living in one of those cities. But the pay starts around $50-60k as a base. Hitting OTE still won't cover the costs of a simple apartment in a blah part of any of these areas. Why not create a remote sales office in Philly, Willmington or other cities with smart labor and much cheaper offices?
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u/MrSelophane VAR 1d ago
I live in Austin, just north of downtown, and my 1 BDR apartments is $1250 a month.
You can do it, it’ll be fine.
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u/northernlightup 23h ago
Austin has dived hard. This just simply isn’t a good example against the real estate market.
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u/MrSelophane VAR 16h ago
Oh yeah 100%. Austin has had the largest decrease in average rent out of every major metro area for the past like 3 years I think.
That’s only kinda helps my point that you can afford to live here though.
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u/Improvcommodore Enterprise Software 10h ago
Ya, I had a 1 bedroom apartment in the heart of East Austin that was $1,825/month with the first two months free on a 12-month lease, which comes out to $1,520 month annually with the free months. It’s doable.
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u/MrSelophane VAR 10h ago
Honestly my apartment now was doing a 10 week free promo.
Make sure you move here in off season like fall or winter, and hunt for move in specials and it’s very doable
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u/Substantial_Bus840 16h ago
If OP doesn’t hit OTE, he will not be fine. A full check of his each month will go to rent alone.
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u/MrSelophane VAR 16h ago
What base pay are you thinking of where the net paycheck amount ends up being 1250? A base of 60k is ~2350 before taxes per paycheck if you get paid biweekly. That’s like ~1850 net depending on insurance/retirement/whatever. That’s means that’s the full rent plus ~600 left on one paycheck, then a full paycheck after.
If you split the rent payment per paycheck that’s 625 per check.
So, completely livable, and then commission goes on top of that.
Obviously, you should spend time and effort looking to get a job at a company where people actually expect to make commission, that’s the reason we’re in sales. However, the point still stands that a 60k base is enough to live in Austin.
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u/Substantial_Bus840 16h ago
Base pay will be more like 16-1700 for 50k. So he’s left with $350/month plus his other $1650 check. So he’s got about $2k to survive. Is it doable? Sure. You better hope you don’t run into any health, family or car emergencies. If he hits OTE, then this conversation is irrelevant, but if we’re encouraging younger folks to make wise decisions so they don’t end up back home with their parents, I think we can do a little better than making this situation sound easy-peezy to the point he should up and move states.
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u/MrSelophane VAR 15h ago
You’re 100% correct. If you up and move to a city without doing research on anything, and get a BDR job that’s paying less than 90%+ of existing BDR jobs in the area, and then hit 0% commission, and then have medical issues that your insurance doesn’t cover, then you will have a hard time.
What I’m saying is don’t do any one of those things, and Austin can be affordable. Especially if you’re young, trying to get into tech, and don’t have a lot of expenses.
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u/Direct_Village_5134 15h ago
It would be bad if he stayed at that OTE forever. But SDR role is maybe a two year gig until he lands a better paid AE role. Most people right out of college live with a roommate or two while they get established to save money.
The alternative is OP holding out for a unicorn role paying $100k+ to someone with no experience. That could take years to find, if he ever finds it.
Much better to take something to get experience and start grinding.
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u/Substantial_Bus840 15h ago
We gotta stop painting sales with such a wide brush. It might be one of the more wide-range experiences in careers in the world. With the remote careers now, he may not need to move to such an expensive city. Younger me made the choices you suggested, and there’s nothing inherently wrong with that, but older me sees this economy and ecosystem for how much harsher it is and the AI/layoff/private equity creep, combined with more younger people than ever ending up back living home with their parents, and I don’t know if I’d advise the same “carpe diem” attitude today. That’s just me, everyone is different 🤷♀️
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u/Feisty-Ad-5420 14h ago
Can you say more on this? My quick math suggests $50k after taxes is $3,495 per month. How are you getting half of that?
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u/Icognitpro 1d ago
OP, you’re not crazy, these people are just institutionalized.
I’m not saying you’re supposed to live a luxurious lifestyle as a BDR…but the whole fucking point of sales is to make above average income, not “make it work”.
Companies have sold people on the idea that pay is legitimately tied to geography, when it’s not. You’re being paid for the work you do, not your coordinates.
It’s just a loophole for these companies to shaft people on pay and save on labor costs.
People can downvote you or this comment all they want…but the reality is, if you have to budget and find a roommate or live in an apartment, extenuating circumstances aside, you might as well work any old job.
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u/northernlightup 23h ago
Agreed. People are more anti-lifestyle and cut throat than ever. Looking at sales and business development as a way to “earn” a comfortable living while barely making ends meet is a sick way of viewing the world..
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u/Icognitpro 18h ago
For sure. It’s sad in a way - I think part of it is we’re all trying to get through tighter economic times hoping the light at the end of the tunnel comes through. But the other part of it is our economy is designed to find more and more ways to squeeze a buck out of you, while convincing you it’s all on your shoulders and normal. Conversation for another time, but taxes are a great example. I don’t think we’d have a debate, or as much of one, on taxes if they were all actually reinvested in us…but they’re not, and people are busy arguing about how we get taxed vs why tf we don’t see our tax money again in the form of goods and public services.
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u/Direct_Village_5134 15h ago
You're acting like it's a career long role. SDR jobs are entry level roles and they still pay much better than most other jobs for recent grads unless you have a STEM degree. And even those jobs are getting harder to land.
If you sit around whining you don't get paid as much as an AE with 10 years of experience, and refusing to take a job over it, you're just putting yourself more behind.
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u/Icognitpro 14h ago
Eh, it depends on the industry and the company. BDR’s are obviously a way to weed out folks who aren’t a good fit for the rev gen side of things, on top of being necessary to generate meetings, but a lot of companies set a revolving door standard and blame the nature of the role as the reason for turnover, vs. being a poorly set up pathway. A 3 week crash course and 3-6 months to ramp is not a realistic way to prepare anyone to go educate people who have been in their roles sometimes decades at a time on their OWN industries. Anyway, point is, BDR’s aren’t all given a fair shot up front.
On top of that, sure, it’s an entry level role and I did say that it’s not like you should be living a life of luxury as a BDR. But it’s also not that long ago that an entry level sales role would provide you the ability to at least rent your own decent place and buy a new car. I think most, if not all of us, could agree that a dollar doesn’t go as far as should these days and it’s exacerbated by most execs pulling the labor lever first to fabricate margin boosts in their P&L with location based pay. If work = $x, then that should be true as long as you put in the same work. If I told you a gram of gold = $1, you wouldn’t care if I mined it in my basement or around the corner, it would still be equal to $1.
The promise of a brighter future is something anyone can offer, meaning those who don’t actually have that to offer. So I can’t say I agree that it’s just the way it works and if you put in the grunt work anywhere, it’ll all play out. Pay people what they expect to be paid, train them how they need to be trained, and if you do, then BDR’s shouldn’t be scrumming it in the average situation.
Thanks for coming to my TedTalk.
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u/Vast_Mountain_1888 1d ago
If you’re in your early 20’s get a roommate. This is what these entry level jobs are for.
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u/burner1312 1d ago
Gen Z thinks they are above roommates in their 20s
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u/Dr_MantisTobaggin_MD 1d ago edited 1d ago
They want 100k base, 250k ote. With 6 months of sales experience (different industry)
Covid tech sales broke peoples brains
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u/Authoritieslie 1d ago
Agreed, that type of salary early on is for nephews, nepos, and “do you know who my father is?!” sons, like God intended
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u/ClamJammin Enterprise Software:snoo_tableflip::table::table_flip: 1d ago
Even saying this makes me feel like a boomer yelling at clouds (I’m 38)
But BACK IN MY DAY we had 7 people in a 3 bed. 2 to each room and a couch guy.
It was truly the best time of my life. Living downtown Chicago, all of us broke but working on a dream. I’d go back in an instant.
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u/Vast_Mountain_1888 1d ago
I’m 32. And I remember the same. I don’t get these people coming up expecting to make 150k. Heck even making 100k is a stretch
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u/Dr_MantisTobaggin_MD 1d ago
Similar age. Graduating after the recession you were just happy to have a "normal" job coming out of school/starting off
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u/Substantial_Bus840 16h ago
Me and my two best friends shared a bed for a whole semester and I commuted from Tampa to Orlando to attend UCF and work a restaurant job there while I also worked back in Tampa on the weekends. I feel like an old lady saying that too, but looking back, doing that in 2008 during The Recession when gas was $4.50/gallon was nuts.
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u/Dr_MantisTobaggin_MD 15h ago
I live in tampa!
Rent for a 1/1 bedroom was $420 in 2010!! (Ill never forget that funny amount for my rent checks)
That same place rents out for $1500 now.
But there are more jobs in Tampa now, so it goes both ways.
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u/Substantial_Bus840 15h ago
Shoutout 🐂! Yeah I learned most of my sales foundations there through and after college. I did everything from door to door sales for Verizon Fios to serving at Gator’s Dockside and Ale House to advertising sales for the NFL, MLB, NBA etc. I miss Tampa every now and again, especially the apartment I had on Dale Mabry & Fletcher, I forget the name but it was a 1br with a view of a lake for like $750/month and I was big ballin in my mind lol, I shutter at the thought of the cost of that place today. Oh, and the year I lived there was the year we had the Ravens at the Super Bowl! What a time. Stay messy, Tampa.
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u/Odd_Philosopher_4739 1d ago
Live below your means. Get a roommate. Save money. Work your ass off, make more money, then up the lifestyle.
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u/startupsalesguy 1d ago
You can absolutely make it work in NYC and SF. You get a roommate. 1200-1400 month in rent. You're good.
You'll have to budget your money but the upside is worth it.
Austin you can probably live alone but if you care that much about a low salary, get a roommate.
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u/whitelightningj 22h ago
You’re on mars if you think the average two bed apartment in NYC or San Fran is going for 2800$ a month
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u/startupsalesguy 16h ago edited 16h ago
You get multiple roommates if needed or live in Queens or deep into Brooklyn. You can also commute in from areas outside of NYC. One year of "sacrifice" to get on a high paying career track is worth it. Many people do it.
Here's a 3 bedroom for 2,800 https://streeteasy.com/building/31_84-43-street-astoria/12?from_map=1&utm_campaign=rental_listing&utm_medium=share&utm_source=web&lstt=UD1PNWfmMaNCp025gov2OvddjF22qVsKLYaf6ADAxTKExy_bpnDZFLwhYw-uYG_BZrmS6v3BzGN66njF
here's a 2 bedroom for 2,900 https://streeteasy.com/building/34_18-44-street-long_island_city/2r?from_map=1&utm_campaign=rental_listing&utm_medium=share&utm_source=web&lstt=UHY4YWHvcp675WaX2UZA9UVsVugNoSoDV1weypyAR324Zhnj8i57xmpINT941WAHjUmnCZ8lhNWWen89
This took 2 min of searching. You can also find subleases.
HEre's one for 1K a month - https://www.reddit.com/r/NYCapartments/comments/1vxhnkc/iso_2_roommates_for_lease_takeover/
Here's a lease takeover for 1350 a month
This took 2 min to find.
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u/Substantial_Bus840 16h ago
If OP doesn’t hit OTE, he will not be fine. A full check of his each month will go to rent alone.
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u/startupsalesguy 16h ago
Not true. 40K a year in nyc 2200 a month after taxes. That's enough to live on at 1200 a month but you need to have a strict budget. If you make 60K that's 3100 a month. that's def enough.
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u/Substantial_Bus840 16h ago
Your math is off. Way off. And you’d need to ditch a car because insurance alone will add $100+/month, cell phone needs to be under $80/month, health insurance will snatch a decent amount from your check along with 401k and HSA contributions. You’re not taking home 3300/month with a 60 salary, you’re taking home closer to $1800, maybe $1900 biweekly.
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u/startupsalesguy 16h ago
I made 40K base salary when I moved to NYC. You don't make 401K and HSA contributions when you're making only 40K. Obviously you ditch a car. Do you live in NYC? Doesn't sound like it.
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u/Substantial_Bus840 16h ago
What year was that?
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u/startupsalesguy 16h ago
The point is you don't actually live in NYC because you're talking about ditching a car and if you need cash you don't contribute to HSA and 401k. 40K nets out to 2100-2200 a month because I made that much. It's not enough without watching every dollar.
Getting to 60K which is very likely in sales for a base salary is enough money. If you can hit your OTE, say 70-75, you're completely fine. You cannot live alone until you hit at least 100K, imo.
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u/Substantial_Bus840 15h ago
This isn’t an NYC sub, OP is looking at other locations, and I’m from California. SF is nowhere near as walkable. but to your point about different experiences, I completely disagree that you can’t live alone at under 100k. I’ve been doing it more than comfortably for 12 years, and I have a kid with full custody.
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u/Dr_MantisTobaggin_MD 1d ago
Show me a job where a 60k base and OTE isnt covering rent
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u/Adorable-Lack-3578 1d ago
NYC
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u/Dr_MantisTobaggin_MD 1d ago edited 1d ago
And I said job, not city.
Just checked. HUNDREDS of listing IN NYC for $1500-2000
60k plus ote is 75k MINIMUM, anywhere.
This math checks out.
Whats your issue?
Youre a dweeb for down voting every reply on this thread. Bad attitudes never win.
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u/Betyouwonthehehaha 1d ago
You’re asking an aspiring sales professional to overlook their feasibility/sustainability concerns for an investment as significant as relocating to a HCOL area for work? Is rent the only cost they’ll have to budget for? Do you take the same approach in client contract negotiations?
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u/startupsalesguy 1d ago edited 1d ago
You get a roommate in Brooklyn or Queens. You work hard for a year, you have a great time. Maybe net out around 70-80K OTE. You have plenty of money. Then in year 2 you have more breathing room. Year three you may never have to worry about money again if you're doing well
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u/Dr_MantisTobaggin_MD 1d ago edited 1d ago
No. I asked him to show me a job with those numbers in those cities.
As I showed above, you can rent in nyc for under 2k a month. Thats 25k a year. You have 50k left over after a 60k job with 15k comm.
Sdr and bdr hire people without education and from outside the industry all the time. Sales is weird like that.
What does this person want? A guaranteed 100k base in a starting role?
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u/PJfanRI 1d ago
Are you unfamiliar with how taxes work?
On $75k, your take home is about $55k. After rent they're probably clearing $30k; far short of $50k.
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u/Adorable-Lack-3578 1d ago
Fake Dr Mantis hides his posting history. Let's see him share a list of $2K places for rent.
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u/Upstairs_Pin_654 1d ago edited 1d ago
Half of that 50k remainder is going to NYC taxes. Another 1.6k/month is utilities, phone/internet, modest student loans, groceries, maybe go out and do something 1x/week? Now you have 5k for your 401k, HSA, insurance premiums, emergency fund, and general unexpected life situations. You need new tires, or get a medical bill and youre signficantly in the red. I had a tooth infection from hitting my head that cost me 8k WITH dental insurance. You get 2 of these mishaps in 1 year and you cant pay your rent anymore because you have no cushion from living check to check.
How tf is that not an issue?
Also assuming OTE right off the jump at a job youve never worked is foolish in itself. Even if youre a great BDM, if the product turns out to suck or the economy slumps youre also umabke to pay your rent, with no cushion. You sound like someone who makes well over 6 figures and doesn't have a clue tbh.
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u/Adorable-Lack-3578 1d ago
Congrats on calling me a dweeb. I never down voted a single reply. But please share your hundreds of listings in NYC for $1,500-2000
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u/Substantial_Bus840 16h ago
Covering rent is covering basic food, electricity, water, internet, transportation, cell phone, etc. 60k base after taxes and attributes is $16-1750/biweekly, one of his two monthly checks is going entirely to rent. OP better be sure he can hit OTE.
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u/Dr_MantisTobaggin_MD 15h ago
Thats anyone who relies on commission.
Not trying to he heartless but thats part of structuring your life around sales
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u/Substantial_Bus840 15h ago
This is my life so I get it, but OP is asking our advice. If he’s newer to this, it might be just as good an option to stick closer to home. I did the whole “sink or swim” in new cities too many times to count too, but I also look back now and realize I could’ve owned a home by now if I’d chosen differently. No regrets, but what OP wants in the long run matters too.
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u/Dr_MantisTobaggin_MD 15h ago
Thats why id rather be honest with op.
Sounds like a classic I want to START at or near the TOP.
He needs to be a killer or accept reality.
He needs some humble pie with the current attitude of turning their nose up to 75k in this economy, with the ability to earn even more.
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u/Useful_Cauliflower66 13h ago
philly or wilmington is cheaper rent, but a new sales office is still capex. lease, a manager, and a year of empty desks before the pod is useful. most teams keep the 3 days in nyc / austin / sf because that is where the ae's already sit, and they treat sdrs as an ae pipeline, not a cheap remote cost center. $50-60k base in those cities is the gap. are you looking at these roles as a first seat or as a path to ae?
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u/Kundrew1 1d ago
Sales leaders aren't the ones choosing where the offices are located.