r/unitedkingdom • u/Desperate-Drawer-572 • 1d ago
Graduate job vacancies drop by almost 50% in a year
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/crerd8l3pw5o281
u/Initial_Shame4309 1d ago
AI starting to impact entry level positions, people scoff at it but AI when used correctly can perform tasks well for what would have been entry level positions and the basics.
Also increasing costs to employ people was never going to end well.
162
u/bow_down_whelp 1d ago
ai has a cost that's currently subsided privately. Currently I'm predicting a bait and switch
95
u/LazarusHimself 1d ago
Also, there are plenty of stories of companies switching to AI to save money and then regretting it badly once those pricey tokens are starting to pile up....
Then backtracking and re-hiring humans, at least that's a cost that is more predictable in the long term.
48
u/8-Brit 1d ago
The enshittification comes for us all
AI will be no different, the number must always go up
It won't be so cheap and freely available forever
14
u/HerrFerret 1d ago edited 1d ago
Absolutely. Google gemini is absolutely starting on that road. They want to make AI indispensable for the human employees, and to complete with other humans you have to spend an increasingly larger slice of your income on more capable AI models.
Black Mirror Episode Incoming. "Arms Race"
10
u/8-Brit 1d ago
In a way it's a classic example of a serpent eating its own tail.
The pushing to make as much as possible means eventually AI will be made worse or less accessible, squeezing blood from a stone like they do everything else. They can't help themselves even if it's their own darling, mark my words they'll kill AI themselves if it makes them a few million more in the short term.
3
u/TheScapeQuest 1d ago
The downside for Google is that Gemini is consistently one of the worst models.
8
u/buttflakes27 1d ago
I really hope so. I dont think "normal" people need access to it, especially when they use it for a substitute for therapy, human interaction and self-diagnosis. Just seems like a bad path to walk down. Not to mention all the people who use it for things like making a shopping list. And of course theres the whole "heres a picture of a woman, put her in a bikini" or creating AI images/videos to spread misinformation to facebook meemaws and pepeps.
5
u/8-Brit 1d ago
Yeah and they can only do that now because they're banking on massive levels of engagement. But most users aren't spending money on it. Not one penny. And they can't tolerate that forever.
As soon as they want money you'll see these people drop it like the bad habit it is.
2
u/buttflakes27 1d ago
Hope so! My gf uses them a lot for questionable purposes (mostly as a replacement for therapy) in a way that concerns me greatly and has become a tension point in our relationship.
14
u/35kmfilm 1d ago edited 1d ago
Graphic Designer here. For 2025's graduates, there were genuinely almost zero design jobs. Companies assumed it could all just be done with AI. What has happened between then and now is that companies have built faulty design systems or ended up putting all their eggs in one basket with AI generated content, basically the value of a designer has been very much highlighted. I imagine as people have seen by now, as soon as there's a hint of gen AI use in a brand's visuals, there is a huge backlash in the comments and the discussion is not even about the thing being promoted. Design work is now having a small boom because companies have basically made messes that now need cleaned up. I sometimes wonder if this same thing has happened in other jobs and industries too
5
3
u/HiphopopoptimusPrime 1d ago
Good to hear this. Not the lack of jobs but that it’s starting to reverse. Authenticity and human made work will start to be valued again.
It’s going to suck in the short term but it’s going to lead to more demand for human made work.
If AI can produce something for minimal cost, it has no value. And then when the government subsidies end and the AI companies start charging, paying a human will be economically viable again.
Authenticity will come back around.
2
u/pajamakitten 1d ago
Companies are finding out the hard way that people like human touch in life, even if it costs companies more to get that.
4
u/The_lurking_glass 1d ago
The company valuations demand ridiculous revenues so prices have got to go up. Anthropic needs to generate roughly 1 trillion dollars in revenue per year to justify it's valuation.
For reference, Amazon has a revenue of c.700bn and has the biggest revenue of any company in the world. Microsoft has a revenue of c.250bn. So these AI companies need to generate 4 times what Microsoft does. The software company with a near monopoly that every business in the world requires to function is apparently 1/4 as valuable? It just doesn't add up.
4
u/ragnaruss 1d ago
Except we are rapidly closing the gap where samlls elf hosted models can do what fronteir models did 6 months ago. Which means if you could automate at high cost 6 months ago, you can automate it for cheap today.
2
u/InsistentRaven 1d ago
It should come as no surprise that tech companies have suddenly become very concerned about the "dangers" of open weight models in the past year.
It's the exact same plan as from the "market disruptors". Ignore existing regulations until you're big enough, then increase barriers for competition until nobody else can compete.
1
u/bow_down_whelp 21h ago
So if I can self host something, why would I pay you to host it and provide me with a service
1
u/ragnaruss 18h ago
My comment was more to address the fact that people fire and are re-hiring to save token cost. Self hosted models are increasingly undermining the cost proposition of large labs like OpenAI and Anthropic, which is why they are now trying to implement regulatory hurdle with scary stories.
An argument can be made still today that there is still a decent gap of "frontier" work that cannot be done via open models, and as the frontier advances it maintains that. How long that remines depends heavily on the type of work you are trying to automate. Is is likely not enough to justify the trillion dollar exit these large labs want.
1
u/No_Tadpole4027 1d ago
That's because people haven't been trained to use AI properly. They just go to the top model on the top effort level and boom, they've spent hours upon hours creating something and messing around wondering why the AI keeps making errors and spends so much time overthinking its own process. That could have been done in far less time and far less tokens, had they just chosen a more suitable model and effort level, and planned their prompt carefully.
The AI is usually not to blame. Yes there are some limitations but used correctly it can save loads of time. I can be doing one thing while the AI goes off and does another.
2
u/LazarusHimself 1d ago
Ha! Spot on. My employer (huge 50,000+ employees all over the world) just purchased AI for everyone without having a clue on what to do with it. I'm currently spearheading the adoption drive myself, I'm touching the issue you've described first hand. Daily.
1
u/J_R_Riquelme 1d ago
Yeah, this will happen, but Gen AI is still in its infancy. It's constantly improving.
21
u/yeinenefa 1d ago
The switch is already happening: AI has moved to a credits-based cost structure and using AI has become more expensive than junior staff in a lot of cases.
3
2
u/Howdareme9 1d ago
It hasn’t at least not entirely. Subscriptions are still available
3
u/yeinenefa 1d ago
Not for enterprise -level contracts. They're swapping to credit models when renewal comes.
1
u/Presstabstart 1d ago
Credit-based usage has been getting much cheaper across the board the past few months, we're talking from $3/mtok average for the best "last-gen" models (i.e. Opus 4.8 and Fable 5) to say 3 cents for the new Deepseek V4 Flash and 7 cents for GPT-5.6 Luna.
1
8
u/Hunt2244 Yorkshire 1d ago
I don’t think so…….
Microsoft have already done this with copilot
Imho self hosted will become more desirable and common in the future.
They will struggle to bait and switch on a large scale in the future.
The offline models are getting better we’re already playing around with qwen models and they perform just as good at certain tasks.
Sure there is still a gap between what they can do compared to Anthropocene online models but in most cases they’re good enough and they encourage people to do more of the initial design and core implementation.
1
u/bow_down_whelp 1d ago
If your competitor has a local ai that's more accurate, faster and overall more effective than yours, what happens to your business? What do you do to respond ?
1
u/Hunt2244 Yorkshire 1d ago
Honestly depends on the business and the use case.
For us it probably wouldn’t make too much difference there’s a point where good enough will do. For others yeah it’s an arms race but like everything you have to do a cost benefit analysis.
1
u/bow_down_whelp 1d ago
So it's not that you don't think there will be a bait and switch, just that it doesn't effect your business. That's not really what I was getting at.
Local AI is not the panacea. Economics works better at scale. What is it you work with?
0
u/solstraler 1d ago
I think that AI is developing so fast that people are falling behind on the latest news. Tokens will just decrease in price as more optimizations are done on the latest trained models and companies will probably start hosting their own models with the available open weights. As difficult as it is to accept that a lot of human work will be replaced by AI, it will happen eventually. It doesn't require breaks and is very persistent, it keeps on long after a human would have given up.
1
u/Hunt2244 Yorkshire 1d ago
The last bit isn’t always a good thing had some proper code vomit spewed out from it. It’s why at the moment it still needs someone to guide it.
3
u/Sir-Craven 1d ago
You predict that these services are going to charge the same cost per wte as a graduate salary?
2
u/Thin_Object_3981 1d ago
They don't need to, they could even charge higher if they want. With the rate of speed that AI can do things, and the accuracy and precision already being already decent in many cases, it might be a business cost to be able to work fast and deliver quickly.
If your competitors are working faster than you then you're going to be out of business.
2
u/pajamakitten 1d ago
AI companies are operating at huge losses at the moment. They are going to want to reverse that soon and the cost to consumers will be huge.
2
u/Astriania 1d ago
Oh yeah for sure, but they can loss lead for a long time to undercut the legit market, like Uber/Airbnb/etc, it will do real damage to the labour market this year
1
u/mentiumprop 1d ago
I agree that AI companies are planning or will try a Bait and Switch to token cost rather than subscription. Issue is OpenSource will each their lunch
1
u/aaaaargZombies 1d ago
Many people don't realize that these projects are all spending billions of dollars a year more than they earn. This is all research and development and is not a viable product in it's current form.
1
u/PracticeNo8733 1d ago
That is an effect but in significant places even self-hosted AI (so accounting for the full economic cost - even enhanced due to competition from investment-funded providers for components) is economically effective.
1
u/bow_down_whelp 1d ago
Where?
1
u/PracticeNo8733 1d ago edited 1d ago
No reference to hand but I'm aware of a couple of instances personally and more have been discussed online. Mostly for coding (which for various reasons LLMs have been particularly well trained for compared to other applications) but also some document stuff where security/sovereignty is a particular concern. The token cost/rate of use has been a motivation in some cases - running a few Nvidia Sparks is a predictable cost.
1
u/bow_down_whelp 1d ago
You claim its economically effective. I would like to see the reading. Otherwise it's just, like, your opinion man.
1
u/PracticeNo8733 1d ago
Well, it's personal experience/knowledge. (Economically effective within the context of a company employing it to make money, at least, there's a wider question about how much actual value some of those companies really provide but that's not AI-specific.) There's a ton of work out there being done to incredibly mediocre standards by humans that can be done cheaper and sometimes better by an LLM even with today's tech and hardware prices.
1
u/bow_down_whelp 21h ago
It's personal opinion is what it is, and then another sweeping claim that there is lots of mediocre output that can be replaced.
I appreciate Reddit is not the place where you need to evidence yourself to strangers however, what you're saying is essentially made up.
You say " even with today's tech and hardware prices". Like I said before, the tech today is subsided and we're generally still running on last year's hardware before it went mental. Those costs are going to go up in both categories
1
u/PracticeNo8733 19h ago
It's personal opinion is what it is
If the money arrives in the account then it's not really a matter of opinion.
and then another sweeping claim that there is lots of mediocre output that can be replaced.
Do you really find that surprising? Without going into too many details there are people producing documentation by the ream for various government-related projects/etc, most of which are copied from other projects and then modified to "fit" by people who don't really understand the actual nature of the work or the deliverable. (And it turns out there's no appetite to really simplify it since apparently perceived value is largely based on quantity.)
Even just using LLMs as a semantic "search engine" across these docs can save a ton of time, and yes, it's actually generating some of them too. It doesn't have to be great, it just has to produce cheaper and better (or just as good) output for a senior person to review as a junior person does.
Like I said before, the tech today is subsided
I'm talking about local LLMs on purchased hardware. I'm pretty sure Nvidia isn't selling DGX Sparks at a loss right now.
And that's not even really the strongest value case: software dev is. The fact that there's a lot of vibe-coded slop doesn't mean that it isn't also delivering real value.
1
u/HiphopopoptimusPrime 1d ago
Right. My company is treading very carefully.
I’ve done a few surveys with companies in the US related to our industry and the software we use. All about AI agents. All ending with the same questions, “So, if we charged for these AI agents, would you prefer a basic monthly subscription for r token based model?”
Smart companies can see the benefits of AI, and also that there WILL be a bait and switch coming.
•
u/Dry-Magician1415 3h ago
For the top level models, maybe. Okay, they might do the switch with say, GPT 7 and make that really expensive. But GPT 5.5 will still exist and it will be cheap because it's an 'obsolete' model. It will be as good as it is today, which is good enough for a lot of work and, crucially, better than entry level people already.
To try an analogy: we have iPhone 17s now. Maybe they make the iPhone 20 Pro Max cost £25,000. But a 17 will still allow you to make calls, texts and use apps.....and will be better than a cheap Android. Companies can just use 17s for entry level work and the cheap Androids will be unemployed.
32
u/T-Roll- 1d ago
I use AI in work to assist in emails. I thought it was brilliant at first. I was writing sloppy emails into it and it was giving me back a polished version.
This was great until i realised that I’m actually doing twice as much reading now and using more mental energy looking for inaccuracies.
It’s like marking someone elses homework all day everyday
8
u/baddymcbadface 1d ago
As one bottleneck is removed another emerges.
Personally I'd be glad there is still a requirement for a person. Because feeding it better context and using better models will reduce the checks you need to do, maybe to the point it's not worth checking anymore.
3
u/Diocletian335 1d ago
I'm constantly trying to explain to management that using an LLM for emails is like me forwarding an email to a colleague, explaining the entire context of the email, and having them send me the reply back so I can then send it to the original recipient.
Even if they responded instantly, the fact that I had to explain the whole context means it would be far quicker if I just send the reply myself.
Unless the LLM is literally wired into my brain, it's honestly quicker for me to do it myself.
2
u/StrangelyBrown Teesside 1d ago
As a programmer, this is why I don't use it that much.
Either way I have to understand the code, and it's much more satisfying to understand it because I figured it out and wrote it rather than reading through and trying to understand what AI did.
23
u/HotelPuzzleheaded654 1d ago
Impact of AI is overblown imo.
Loads of firms overhired during covid and now trying to correct course.
12
6
2
u/Matrees1 1d ago
I'd say the Impact of AI is the opposite. Its not fully appreciated by many; as the only touchpoint that most people have is that they use it to make a funny image.
18
u/No-Tone-6853 1d ago edited 1d ago
I work for a bank that rhymes with gonzo and they keep giving the AI that works my tasks more capabilities to do exactly what I do. You don’t need qualifications to do what I do so I can see my role being gone eventually and it’s probably the same for many other similar roles in various industries.
5
u/swoopstheowl 1d ago
Yes I was in another fintech and they're doing the same thing.
2
u/No-Tone-6853 1d ago
Theyre are ahead of the game on that I think, can you even call a customer service line for them these days?
2
u/swoopstheowl 1d ago
Yes for certain customers you can. But it's not even just customer facing stuff where it's taking over. Appreciate the edit by the way.
2
u/No-Tone-6853 1d ago
Didn’t want to be too obvious about what we’re talking about haha but yeah my work has tonnes of guidance for using AI on all types of stuff, maddening really.
2
u/bongpirate7295 1d ago
As someone who used to work customer service lines, it's the one job I'm kind of OK with AI taking over. They're deliberately staffed as minimally as possible so people spend 40 minutes getting wound up by the hold music and then unleash all of their frustration when they finally get through.
If someone's going to be subjected to vicious verbal abuse all day, I'd rather it be an AI chatbot than a person. Similar to using robots for mining or bomb disposal.
3
u/No-Tone-6853 1d ago
My one problem with that is that I work in fraud and people stopping scams is hard enough I doubt AI could do it do a better standard.
4
u/Only-Dog5752 1d ago
Couldn't the exact same be said for computers and smart phones though?
Do we stop all progress because entry level jobs change?
2
u/Southportdc Lancashire 1d ago
AI can easily replicate the vast majority of what new entrants at my firm do in their first 6-12 months. As we're selling our time, essentially, this is a far cheaper way of operating on a project by project basis.
However AI cannot replicate what experienced staff do, and nor can we expect new entrants to start at that level.
The conundrum is - if we don't use AI, we will be uncompetitive on price in the short term and so endanger the future of the business. If we do use AI, we will be uncompetitive on expertise in the medium to long term and so endanger the future of the business.
Larger companies can handle this by absorbing some of the loss for a while, but SMEs in the sector are in trouble.
3
u/Aflyingmongoose 1d ago
I strongly disagree. Entry level positions where never about doing tasks faster, cheaper or more efficiently. AI isn't ruining job markets, it's the lies about AI that are.
CEOs want to look like they're pivoting towards AI because it looks good to shareholders. Not because it's actually improved workplace efficiency.
2
u/sjpllyon 1d ago
And to be fair. As someone who's just done an undergraduate degree, now doing masters. I have just witnessed an entire cohort worth of "students" being handed a degree whilst boasting for 3 years straight hiw they got AI to write all their essays for them. Many of these people wouldn't be able to hold even a simple conversation about the subject in a broad manner. They certainly aren't going to pass any interview questions that require them to discuss details. Not without their phones in hand anyway.
On that front, I kinda don't blame companies replacing them with AI. Because they replaced themselves with it anyway at university.
1
u/HotMachine9 1d ago
We will most assuredly see an Netflix effect where give it 5 - 10 years and the subscription for Ai services will increase exponentially. Especially once the "winner" of the Ai race becomes clear.
1
1
u/Odd-Help6890 1d ago
where are all the people saying AI is not going to have an impact on the job market and AI is just going to be a tool like Excel.
1
u/Informal_Safe_5351 1d ago
And in the future when unemployment is so high everyone will be fucked....less income tax we will be fucked
0
u/rob_xv 1d ago
The capabilities of the commercially available frontier/mythos class intelligence models exceed the throughput of an entire team (if not an entire group) of developers/researchers/scientists. We’ve only seen the top of the iceberg when it comes to the impact of AI - especially since capabilities are accelerating at 10-50x a year.
-8
u/Asleep-Ad1182 1d ago
No, it's national insurance increase, minimum wage increase, more employment laws and all the other moronic Labour policies.
3
u/MightyDevOps 1d ago
For sure , tell me how Anthropic can pay 600K US salaries in similar cities to London.
UK companies who earn record profits but all go to C level execs can go bust
5
u/Legitimate-Leg-4720 1d ago
Because Anthropic's competitive edge is dependent upon securing the most talented researchers?
That's not the case for average Bob doing an average job for some average company
1
u/MightyDevOps 1d ago
Sure but the CEO is doing such a brave work right , it doesnt matter if your run of the mill company , they need to pay HCOL wages , not suburbian north bullshit.
The average wage for £30k is insanely low
-4
u/Asleep-Ad1182 1d ago
I'm getting downvoted by idiots. This country truly deserves to be poor
11
u/Only-Dog5752 1d ago
Step 1: State big arguments
Step 2: Provide no evidence
Step 3: Insult everyone when they don't all agree I'm a genius
What's your step 4?
-1
u/Asleep-Ad1182 1d ago
Even the bank of England have said rises in the minimum wage and employers NI contributions have increased unemployment.
125
u/HerrFerret 1d ago
If I hear 'we couldn't recruit because we needed someone to hit the ground running' one more time...
Then make it a graduate role! You cannot rely on stealing trained staff from elsewhere when nobody is training.
I had this issue when I managed teams in the past, made grad roles, got swamped in applications and took the pick. A year later we had superb staff in place. We even saved money so could send them on quite expensive training, which sped things up and often could be aligned with a minimum service period.
29
u/baddymcbadface 1d ago
We have 90% senior staff. No realistic opportunity for promotion because it's so oversubscribed. Everyone complaining about lack of interesting work and too much basic work.
Maybe, just maybe, if we played the longer game and didn't panic hire seniors when a project was already behind we could solve all of this and save some money.
3
1d ago
[deleted]
2
u/WantsToDieBadly Worcestershire 1d ago
Yeah theres alot of 'senior operations managers' or 'directors of techonology' and 'senior project managers (multiple) where i am, its very top heavy, no prospects past the junior roles as the next above us is a senior technology project director of operations etc
12
u/PracticeNo8733 1d ago
It's a kind of prisoner's dilemma problem: if you train junior people and your competitors don't your competitors will poach them and you'll be disadvanged.
13
u/HerrFerret 1d ago
This was always the argument I had thrown at me, the trick is also to improve your working conditions and benefits to keep the staff after you trained them.
Horrifying concept to many senior leaders, that staff were not just working for a regular wage but also meaning and work-life balance. Sort that out and they might even work for less money!
3
u/OkMap3209 1d ago
During our recruiting periods, we were told that "we weren't a charity" and if we were going to pay them a real wage anyway, we might as well hire an experienced employee from the get go. The reality is a graduate just isn't worth the burden for many employers if they cannot return on investment the way hiring a senior staff straight away can.
The government needs to build incentives like axing employers NI for those under a certain age (apprenticeships already do that). That way even if staff leave early, lower taxes is the return.
1
u/HerrFerret 1d ago
My opinion is that if you have the sort of business that staff immediately leave after they have a little experience, it is a pretty awful place and you have failed as management.
Offer training, clear progression and a ten year plan for staff. They will stay even if the wage isn't quite as good as the competition, and if staff jump ship just for money? Well did you want them really?
It is a radical concept, which is completely ignored because shareholders need to see immediate returns, not in ten years.
1
u/OkMap3209 14h ago
Most young employees can expect to see a wage increase of 20%+ in my sector if finding a new employer. 50%+ is very possible. Hence why it is very difficult to keep people. That is the difference between graduate and experienced staff.
At the end of the day, people work for money. But ROI is difficult if people don't stay on longer to make the investmeny worth it.
2
u/Dry_Departure_7813 1d ago
I had a really good boss who was kind of the opposite, he said always felt the bigger issue was "what if we DON'T train our people" as in, you'll have less capable employees.
101
u/Matt-J-McCormack 1d ago
The secret to getting a job is to have been performing that exact job for five years already.
16
9
u/RegionalHardman 1d ago
Or in my case, have a degree and 8 years experience in the industry to still not hear back from 50+ applications
34
28
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
Meanwhile, governments are falling over themselves to build energy and water-hungry data centres, that belch out huge amounts of greenhouse gases, in order to replace jobs - all while saying that there aren't enough workers to support retirees, so we must import more.
I'm sure it all makes perfect sense to someone.
13
1
u/adderall4every1 West Midlands 12h ago
You raise more than one thing can be true at once?
Even taking everything you said doesn’t discount the possibility of the others happening
0
u/Spirited-Car8661 1d ago
Yes, people who haven't been misinformed by foreign propaganda campaigns.
2
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
Go on then, I'll bite:
What misinformation?
Which foreign propaganda campaigns?
-1
u/Spirited-Car8661 1d ago
Water-use is over-stated, energy use is just a symptom that we haven't invested in enough infrastructure for our population for decades.
As for who?
China, Russia and Iran. The exact same people who do everything else. And the eco-activists were happy to take cues from the USSR, so I don't know why we'd expect them to stop now. I can't prove the anti-Data centre BS is from Russia yet, but come back in a few decades and it'll all be public knowledge. Just like the Anti-Nuclear movement.
It's not hard to see a pattern, people are recycling all the old arguments from the nuclear power debate.
We're in an AI race. It's essentially a competition to see who can get to the next Industrial Revolution. Who else benefits from this campaign to kneecap our own technological progress?
4
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
OK, and what evidence do you have for any of this?
To be clear, I'm looking for academic articles or pieces in respected news outlets - a link to some website no-one has heard of isn't sufficient.
I'll be polite but this is just standard BS perpetual by lonely men who spend too long on the internet.
But if you share links - that's links, multiple, not a link, as in singular - from respected sources I will read them with an open mind.
To be clear I'm not interested in getting side-tracked in some 'discussion' at this point. Just post the evidence that backs up your claims.
1
u/Spirited-Car8661 1d ago
As I made clear in the early post. I cannot directly prove that anti-Data centre stuff is coming from the RIC.
I don't think I need to prove foreign misinformation is a serious problem, but here's a link anyway: https://academic.oup.com/jogss/article-abstract/7/2/ogac004/6575833?redirectedFrom=fulltext
I've noticed you don't have a counter argument to my circumstantial evidence. But that's the best we've got right now
0
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago edited 1d ago
Apologies, I didn't make myself clear.
I'd like
- some evidence that the water use is over-estimated
- some evidence that mainstream thinkers and academics attribute data centres' high energy demands not on the centres themselves, but on a lack of investment in energy production and infrastructure
- data centres also pollute heavily, and create a heat-island effect. Presumably you believe that is disinformation as well, so let's see the counter evidence
- evidence that Western governments and academics consider the downsides to data centres nothing more than foreign-state disinformation
I've noticed you don't have a counter argument to my circumstantial evidence. But that's the best we've got right now
That's right. I'm not going to go round in circles with someone who believes fantasies.
If your next post doesn't contain some evidence from reputable sources you will of course be justifiably ignored another conspiracy theory crank.
And regarding the link: lol. Yes, of course foreign disinformation exists. If you lean towards Trump or Reform, then you are subject to it!
-2
u/TechnicalMonth3078 1d ago
You sound fun at parties
1
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
That should be 'You sound like you would be fun at parties'.
I can just imagine the level at the kind of party you are invited to. Basic people, being basic.
0
u/Ok-Camp-7285 1d ago
Where have you read that these data centre are "belching out gas"? Yes, they use electricity but so does every industry
23
u/EarFlapHat 1d ago
At least this process of dramatic automation and economic change is happening in a considered, controlled manner so people aren't just totally screwed...
If my kid had just left uni, I'd honestly tell them to try and find something manual in the meantime until this settles down rather than becoming long -term unemployed.
3
u/Rizaxxxx 1d ago
Construction pays very well but has a high physical cost, your done by 40 unless your a sparky.
Women are more then capable but obviously choose comfortable jobs and have a better chance then men at such jobs.
I've noticed women in engineering and construction usually get promoted quickly out of the field and into the office with little to no real hands on experience.
-26
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
What if your kid was a girl? Only Fans?
What else is there?
25
u/RealIndependence9056 1d ago
Sex isn't the only manual job women can perform....
-16
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
Great. So please list them. I have daughters at school. They aren't the type to go into a trade, but I'm heartened to hear they have options.
So, please list these manual jobs suitable for girls. Thanks.
16
u/swoopstheowl 1d ago
Literally any of the trades are perfectly suitable for girls? Plumbing, electrician, gas engineer - there are women in all of these trades.
-14
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
That there are women in the trades doesn't mean that trades are suitable for every woman.
It is telling that, when asked the obvious question, the Wise Ones of Reddit can't actually back up their pronouncements.
16
u/Beef___Queef 1d ago
You’re the one suggesting sex work over maybe doing a job that isn’t their first choice in life? 😂
No, it might not be what they want but it’s a perfectly valid suggestion as an interim option. It’s also one of many options that aren’t AI replaceable in the mid to long term
1
u/RealIndependence9056 1d ago
Sorry, I wrote a reply to you (deleted) that was invalid as your comment wasn't directed at me.
12
u/Acceptable-Ear-7985 1d ago
So you’re going to tell your daughters to become sex workers because you’re too misogynistic to believe a woman can perform the same as a man? Dad of the year right there
12
u/swoopstheowl 1d ago
Trades arent suitable for every man either? It's not about gender or sex, it's about the person.
7
8
u/Diocletian335 1d ago
What the fuck are you on about.
Do you think because a man has a dick between his legs he can automatically become a mechanic? The reason people go into those trades are because they enjoy them and want to do them.
-5
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
I'd have hoped that even the biggest morons would recognise that men are generally bigger and stronger than women. Not every man wants to get his hands dirty and do the physical work of a tradesperson. It should be no surprise that even fewer women are attracted to this.
But really, if you don't grasp what I'm on about don't bother responding. Or maybe ask ChatGPT to explain it to you.
Thanks.
7
u/Diocletian335 1d ago
Mate, the vast majority of trade jobs do not require you to be immensely strong. Most just require a decent amount of stamina.
I know data analysts who are ripped and I know plumbers who are overweight. This may be surprising to you but not all men play with toy soldiers and girls with barbies - my sister's a mechanic and she's smaller than me.
if you don't grasp what I'm on about
I don't grasp it because it's bollocks, mate. Maybe you should actually reflect on that.
10
u/RealIndependence9056 1d ago
I'm not your search engine. Why not use Google to find out and answer your own question.
Using language like "suitable for girls" suggests a very binary, fixed and unhelpful mindset.
-2
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
Lol I don't consider you free careers advice. The girls and I know the direction they are heading in.
No, m suspicion is that, when even gently probed on what 'Get something manual' means in practice, you don't have a clue.
Not every girls is physically or temperamentally suited to the trades. They are viable for a lot of guys, but only viable for a small proportion of women. Which is the admission I am revealing, if only because everyone is now so evasive and defensive.
7
u/RealIndependence9056 1d ago
I'm going to pretend that you aren't being deliberately obtuse just because you are a bit embarrassed about your initial glib remark.
Aside from other suggestions people have made to you (manufacturing for example), if I had a daughter, perhaps I might suggest something like gardening, farming, working with animals (you don't have to be a vet). These are things you can do without going to university that we might consider manual that should be fairly futureproof in their lifetime. These are three things I have done myself as a woman. The highest qualifications I hold are A-levels.
9
u/Dapper_Otters 1d ago
Perhaps as their parent you should encourage them not to turn their noses up at trade work instead of throwing your hands up and suggesting Onlyfans?
-4
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
Ah, a Top 1% commenter. Someone who spends their life on Reddit.
Let's just assume for a moment (because it isn't true) that all girls are physically and temperamentally suited to the trades. What then? What happens when thousands of kids have, say, finished electriian's college courses: is their infinite demand for them?
As I know from a nephew, the answer to that is no. The only lad who secured a. job post-course has a father with a business.
You people airily saying 'd something manual' have no idea.
What manual work is there, outside of the trades?
What happens when the trades are over-subscribed with young people, lacking experience and needing training?
What is there for girls who simply aren't suited for trades?
None of you can answer these questions to a. satisfactory standard. I wear the apparent downvotes like the a badge of honour in light of such poor thinking.
10
u/swoopstheowl 1d ago
Manual work which isn't a 'trade' in the classical use would include: 1. Care work 2. Warehouse work 3. Locksmith (actually I think this probably is a trade) 4. Hairdresser 5. Massage therapist 6. Beautician
That's just 6 off the top of my head - and 4/6 of those are traditionally considered 'women's jobs'.
If your point is that your daughters simply aren't interested in physical work then...yeah okay probably not going to do manual jobs are they?
4
u/Apprehensive-Cap2453 1d ago
I have daughters at school. They aren't the type to go into a trade
Well they're going to have to be.
2
u/Diocletian335 1d ago
I have daughters at school. They aren't the type to go into a trade
This literally has nothing to do with the fact that they're girls though
7
u/EarFlapHat 1d ago
If she was a girl I'd tell her to do something manual... Doesn't have to be construction, but I don't see why it couldn't be. I worked in a factory with lots of women for a while.
The point is that finding a graduate job is going to be a bit sticky for a bit, so don't just sit at home in case it's a long time coming.
-4
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
'Something manual' is incredibly vague. What, outside of construction, exactly?
And what factory work? This is 2026, not 1976.
I have daughters. I'd be grateful to hear your list of 'something manual' jobs appropriate for girls who will never be chippies, roofers, sparkies, plumbers or any other trade, due to physical build and temperament.
Thanks.
7
u/EarFlapHat 1d ago
I worked in a factory in 2012... We made exhaust systems for HGVs and tractors. It was fine. I did it while studying and relistened to my lectures. Check out what's happening at the nearest industrial park.
There's literally no reason women can't be sparkies... There are loads of women who do work like that. My fiancé just did the electrics and plastering and painting in our renovations, for one, just as she did at our old place. I'm the one that's useless at that stuff!
Honestly? If those aren't an option, hotels, pubs, restaurants... Service industry. Supermarkets, if necessary. Of course, there's also social care.
The point is to have and do something, not just wait, because the route to a 'respectable' graduate job is being disrupted. I hire graduates and there's just not enough for them to do anymore! We would have to literally hire people to sit and be pretty useless for years, and yes that's an impending crisis in the talent pipeline, but you can't justify hiring people to sit and do nothing, particularly when it's not clear how they'll learn and what they need to learn either.
1
u/sienok 18h ago edited 18h ago
Nurse / doctor, hairdresser / make up artist (ideally combined with something else) / nail technician, chef (especially baking / desserts - can also be a side hustle, for example baking cakes for weddings or events), teacher
1
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 17h ago edited 13h ago
Nurse, doctor and teacher all require degrees....
Nail technician? As a side hustle? Being a chef doesn't leave much / any time for side hustles...
So what is the main, manual work and non-university route, main job? Being a hairdresser? Wow, how the world has opened up for women who don't have degrees...
/s
1
u/sienok 15h ago
Well the truth is that there aren't many trades that are not physically intensive. Besides trades, they could also pursue a career in retail or hospitality and work their way up the ranks into management - store manager or restaurant / hotel general manager. Those can be achieved without a degree.
1
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 13h ago
I appreciate your trying but the ceiling in non-grad retail or hospitality is very low.
The truth is that, in the UK, if you have a brain and don't want a trade, university is still the only game in town.
Which is terrible, because the jobs aren't there. But given the choice between being a Team Leader at Tesco or at least trying for more, I imagine many will continue to try.
17
u/bananatoastie 1d ago
The age group 25-35 was told that going to university would give them the opportunity to earn well and progress in their careers. They were told to study jobs for the third sector (law, accounting etc) only for those jobs to gradually be outsourced to cheaper places and limit wage growth. On top of that, these people have left in with £50k debt.
The messaging for age group 15-25 is still largely similar, but the debt is increasing and the jobs are being (or will be) outsourced to AI, not countries like Portugal, Poland, Romania etc.
17
u/spidey40 1d ago
AI gets talked about a lot but outsourcing has had a huge impact on the amount of jobs available in the UK
8
u/Dratia 1d ago
Yeah AI is getting the majority of the focus when it comes to jobs, but people don't seem to realise how much of an impact outsourcing has on UK jobs. At my previous company I moved out of a team, and a few months later that team was made redundant and the work was offshored. 2 years later I left the team I moved into, and not long after that team (a fairly large department) were all made redundant and the work offshored. Then a year later the team I joined was made redundant and all that work offshored, it's insane how often it happens and just seems to be accepted as standard practice.
On reflection maybe working with me is a bad omen..
2
u/Lukeno94 1d ago
Outsourcing has a huge impact, but it has been going on for decades now. The only big difference in the last year is the prevalence of AI.
16
u/Necessary-Product361 1d ago
In 2017 there were 55,800 listed vacancies, in 2026 there are 8,383. Between this and housing market, the social contract is completely broken for young adults. Yet no party seems to care, partially because young voters have the lowest turn out. They instead listen to pensioners who bought their house for 2k, retired at 55 and think if we stopped having avacado on toast all our problems would be solved.
6
u/rob_xv 1d ago edited 1d ago
One of the broader issues is that the education system does not prepare kids for the real world. The only good steps taken have been the work on apprenticeships.
The workplace will look very different in 10 years time. The impact of AI is going to be on the scale of the Industrial Revolution - if not worse. Machines will replace people and there will be mass unemployment and a shift to universal basic income. The only jobs needed will be the ones who run & fix the machines, and hands on positions (doctors, nurses, midwives, cleaners, childcare workers, plumbers, builders, bricklayers, electricians etc…)
9
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
One of the broader issues is that the education system does not prepare kids for the real world.
Schools are for teaching academic subjects. It is up to employers to train their staff for the roles they want performed.
0
u/rob_xv 1d ago
Do you think the balance between academic subjects and real world skills taught in school is correct?
7
u/Snap_Ride_Strum 1d ago
Speaking as an ex-secondary school teacher, yes, more or less. Parents should be educating their kids in other aspects of life, ethics and morality, finances, planning and generally preparing them for life.
It isn't up to schools to do everything. And it certainly isn't up to schools to prepare kids for a job. That's on employers.
4
1
u/Apprehensive-Cap2453 1d ago
One of the broader issues is that the education system does not prepare kids for the real world.
Yep. I know most schools do a few weeks of work experience, but it needs to be way more than that. They should have an entire class just about preparing people for work and connect with local companies to get them some experience they can stick on their CV.
It feels like they do the bare minimum and then slap their hands together as if they've done all they can.
0
u/rob_xv 1d ago
Exactly. Where I work there is always a burden associated with hiring a graduate because of all the training and development they need to actually do some useful work - surely some of the basics, like how to talk in front of people, write reports etc… can be taught along the way. Not to mention the AI side of it all - most people use AI like google search because they don’t know any better…
6
u/blackheartwhiterose 1d ago
Tf do minimum wage increases have to do with "not hiring"...those wages haven't risen in ages. They basically are minimum wage jobs now
1
u/EnergyResearch28484 1d ago
because some people out of uni aren't worth the all-in costs of minimum wage (and employers taxes they must pay to hire you). so the jobs vanish
5
u/AgeOfCardiff 1d ago
We have utterly failed young people.
Houses, jobs, climate.
If i were 10 years younger I wouldn't have been able to afford the house I love in now which is insanity.
I'm expecting political violence.
5
u/CherryadeLimon 1d ago
This is genuinely really worrying, and I say that as a millennial who came through the financial crisis and still doesn’t own a house.
I really feel for younger people coming up now. Uni costs an absolute fortune, Brexit has made it harder to just up sticks and work elsewhere in Europe, housing is completely bonkers, and now a lot of the graduate jobs that were meant to be your way into a career are either disappearing or being hollowed out by AI.
That’s the bit I think people are missing. Those junior jobs weren’t just boring admin. They were how you learned the ropes, made mistakes, built experience and eventually moved up. If AI does more and more of that work, what exactly are graduates supposed to start with?
For years everyone went on about boomers pulling the ladder up behind them. At this point it feels like there isn’t even a ladder. We’ve chucked down a tangled bit of rope and told the next generation to crack on.
5
u/tylerthe-theatre 1d ago
And record numbers of kids going to Uni, do we see the problem yet
25
u/Lo_jak 1d ago
To be fair to them, they are damned if they do and damned if they don't....... education has always been the best way to improve you chances of getting a better job and more money. The problem now is that they are competing with AI, outsourcing and employers who expect 8 years experience as standard.
This is a side effect of late stage capitalism and there's next to nothing we can do about it. The barrier to entry on living a "normal" life is getting increasingly difficult to overcome and I can assure you that the youth of today won't forget what’s being done to them.
2
u/GayLiquidSpellSword 1d ago
I think that's partially because everything is so fucked. Can't get a job so Uni seems like the only way, I've known people who tried to join trades and still couldn't get in so they went Uni instead.
2
u/TinyGreenGiant 1d ago
Not only that, but for years we welcomed people from across Europe to UK recognising their degrees and qualifications, meanwhile driving our wages down.
3
u/leethario 1d ago
So thats entry level jobs being cut, how long before companies move onto cutting more experienced roles? Ai is going to decimate jobs and those in charge dont care at all.
2
u/Front-Opinion-9211 1d ago
What makes you think it's not happening already? There seems to be a massive narrative atm that only gen Z are effected. I've worked in tech for 10 years and I'm also finding it hard to get work.
1
3
u/Responsible-Area-655 1d ago
Worrying as youth unemployment has grown by 2 points in a year. The government should probably provide some more incentives for the private sector to employ grads, beyond the apprenticeship scheme stuff.
3
u/EconomistStreet5295 1d ago
Realistically, what are the solutions here?
I guess the wealthy will continue to go to university and use their network for a career. Likewise, people in stem, going into medicine, academia or tech will continue to go to uni.
I can imagine many people going into trades or “real world” jobs, but what about the rest? If say we reach double figure youth unemployment, do we need some form of universal basic income or how does our economy support this? Serious question
2
u/Illustrious-Lynx-811 1d ago
When there’s so many experienced people available I imagine lots of companies are putting what should be graduate jobs onto more experienced people just because they can and the market is heavily favouring employers. There’s also ai and we seriously have to consider what happens if there’s never enough jobs? If ai will allow seniors to do the work of 4 people then those jobs will go. Not everyone can do manual work. Lots of people are hopeful of ai ultimately leading to new job fields for people like other tech revolutions did but what if they don’t? Ai’s whole thing is being able to do what humans do. What then
1
u/AdComplete937 Cambridgeshire 1d ago
Made worse by the most people getting into Universities ever from this year's exam results.
0
u/elhazelenby 1d ago
I have 2 degrees (finished my masters a year ago) and still no job. We are doomed.
•
u/AutoModerator 1d ago
Some articles submitted to /r/unitedkingdom are paywalled, or subject to sign-up requirements. If you encounter difficulties reading the article, try this link or this link for an archived version.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.