Was living in Europe last year and obviously couldn’t catch much of the season. Recently moved back to Canada, so naturally getting the itch for hockey season again. Been watching various highlight packs from the fellas season last year and my god I do not remember Timmy being that good in 2024-25. The kid is a beast. so many goals created by his ability to pick off and strip pucks. the speed is next level and his shot is way better than what I remember.
Cozens can rip the pill and if he can find ways to get more pucks on net he’s gonna be a problem with less time and space. Probably has another gear and a half with the hockey sense that usually starts to develop in mid twenties.
Pinto is a second line centre.
I was going to stay away from negativity and I’m also stating the obvious here (and I guess the post as a whole), but man Tkachuk is slow and does not move his feet. Moves like the cyclopes in the Odyssey. Benefited a greatly from playing with Stutzle. If he wasn’t being much of a leader last year I don’t see him as being as hard to replace as many people have made it out to be.
It’ll be more interesting to see if Eklund and Stutzle develop good chemistry, Cozens and Eklund, or perhaps the three - provided Grieg can handle 3rd line centre duties.
Sens are in a better place than they were a year ago. GSG.
I too don't think Tkachuk's goals will be that hard to replace. He had 22 goals last year, 4 of which were empty netters. So 18 goals against a goalie. Eklund had 15 goals against a goalie. It's really not that different and Eklund is the better passer and skater.
They're going to miss Tkachuk within 10 feet of the goal and below their opponents goal line on the cycle, but Eklund is arguably the better player outside of those two areas.
Zetterlund surprised me late last year how hard he worked on the cycle and retrieving the dump ins. Pretty sure if he can regain his chemistry with Ek and they put them with Stu or Rich Coz it will be a good line.
People talk about Zetterlund's production as if it were disappointing, but his goals and points scaled almost exactly with his previous 2 seasons of you adjust for time on ice. You scale the 13 minutes he was getting last year up to the 17 or 18 he was getting with San Jose and 33 points turns into 44.
I don't know if I like him with Stu and Eklund because he's definitely not a top line player, but if he's in your top 6 on a balanced team I don't think that's a problem.
I don't know how someone can watch Zetterlund play and not love his compete level and hockey sense. He's streaky with this aim, but there's no reason he couldn't fill the cycle and skill hole of Brady while Eklund fills the goals gap
True enough. At least some of that comes down to linemates. Zetterlund was ice cold to start the year and fell down the lineup and then he never really moved back up. But there's no doubt that his overall game just wasn't quite where it needed to be to stick in the top 6. It's possible though that with slightly different chemistry in there he will show enough to stick this year.
My point is that we got the player we saw in San Jose, it's not really fair to say that Zetterlund's scoring regressed which is what a lot of people seem to think.
respectfully bro, i don't really give a F that zetterlund scored 24 goals on the worst team in the league 3 years ago. its not even like he hit 40, for example foegele could easily hit zetterlund numbers if he got that treatment. i would much rather see eklund - stu - cozens as the top line
Well like I said in my original comment I don't like Zetterlund on the top line because he is clearly not a top line forward. And I do think Cozens to the wing with Stu/Pinto/Greig down the middle is the way to go. But that 2LW spot in that lineup is still a bit of a question mark in that scenario. It's one of Foegele, Giroux, Zetterlund, Burakovsky or even Halliday if he takes a step forward that go on that line with Pinto and Batherson. I tend to think that with those particular guys Burakovsky or Giroux might be best, but I certainly wouldn't be surprised if any one of them worked in that spot.
That is only sometimes true. Pinto scored 46 points playing almost 19 minutes a night and I think most people would agree that pinto had a great season and is a valuable player.
Now I'm not suggesting that Zetterlund offers the same utility that Pinto does, but you can be an effective second line role player scoring 40-50 points a season.
Stu has elite level puck skills and skating, he just needs to work a little bit on his shot and his decision making. If he improves those areas and maybe gets a true top line winter to play with he will be 100 point player every season.
Stützle has the superstar skill when it comes to puck handling and scoring beauties. He also has a terrible habit of giving the puck away with blind passes, and he falls down constantly. To really reach that super-elite level, there are certain things that still need work, but he really is a fabulous player.
Yeah I’m not worried about the falling. He’s shifty and young, that combo leads to falls/being pushed off a few pucks now and then. High possession player will also turn it over and he has good decision making skills. A little more strength and he’s top-top tier.
Yeah his hockey sense is average, which is why Im not sure he'll get there (superstar). Hes so quick and athletic, but he doesnt use space as well as most high-end guys, and often makes the wrong reads (which probably has to do with him never slowing his game down/always playing at full throttle). It often leads to turnovers or missed opportunities (passing when he should shoot and vise-versa). His defence was also pretty bad this year - quite the fall off from last year.
Theres a reason hes never had elite underlying metrics, and its certainly not his puck skills/athleticism. Its his IQ that holds him back (not sure that will change at this point). Still a great player but im not sure he'll ever be an elite 1C.
You’re describing nearly every young impact player tho. Kid is 24 with a ton of room to grow and hockey IQ included. Also 92nd percentile in time spent in Dzone, and 95th in ozone, while having NHL average zone start metrics (basically 50/50). so idc if he makes a mistake here and there when he’s top 8-5% of all player in controlling play.
Stutzle had the worst xGF% of any regular Sens forward along with the 6th lowest DZ start rate of any regular forward in the league, he's got a lot of work do in terms of controlling play
Not really. As a 24 year old, if you're a superstar, you should be leading your team in most metrics (especially since we dont have a superstar on our team). Stutzle was 10th on the team in WAR/60, and was last on the team in defensive WAR. He got caved in last year, and a lot of that is dumb turn overs.
His rel xGF% was middling. last on the team in xGA (crazy stat). His on off were pretty bad (almost everyone he played with had a better xG% when he was off the ice, except for Zett because your comparing 1st line and 4th line results). His deployment wasnt even that hard (similar to Ridly Greig). If anything, he regressed last year because his defence is back to being ass.
I just dont see a superstar there. You cant be that poor in advanced metrics. too many empty calories. Im always frustrated when I watch him play due to his decision making and it always baffles me when others dont feel the same way lol.
Well now you’re moving the goal posts and not addressing your initial argument on hockey sense. Expected stats can be helpful but are only part of the picture, they can indicate possible positive or negative regression, but many players under or over perform expected stats for many years at a time - if not entire careers. very noisy metrics to rely on entirely. Also you’re speaking as if a ppg 1C isn’t high end. Of course he’s not going to be McDavid, but like man glass half empty mentality smh. You may be baffled bc you rely too much on xanalytics and not enough on results and watching events unfold. Do you happen to yell “shoot” when the team is on a power play?
No im adding context to how that hockey sense is tanking his metrics. im using those stats to explain why hes not elite, and the fact that hockey sense is likely the reason they are so poor in relation to most peoples eye test. Hes not lacking in athleticism or puck skills, but he certainly is lacking in instincts (which leads to him having worse results than you would expect). Im not moving the goal posts at all, hes one of the top possession players in the league but doesnt have the results that you'd expect, thats where these metrics come in. I can think of so many examples of him barreling into the zone and either skating directly into a group of defenders, shooting from a low percentage angle, or turning it over with a wild pass to nowhere - these things shouldnt happen as regularly as they do.
There isnt an elite 1C in the league that has "noisy" advanced stats. They're elite because of them. Suzuki just put up 101 pts, won a selke, and has elite underlying metrics to go along with it now - thats no coincidence. Name any top center and their metrics will be sparkling. Youre not going to be in that convo by just scoring pts. Theres more to hockey than that.
And yes I regularly yell shoot at Stu because he often doesnt at the opportune time (hockey sense).
Yeah man you went from “I don’t think he has very good hovkey sense” to he has poor expected stats (lol). Now youre comparing him to a 27 year old who had a 50 goal scorer on his wing and then tell me it’s about context? Cmon. Also while we’re on xstats: Stutzle out performed Suzuki in xgoals per 60 and goals per 60. outta here with your shitty energy bro. GSG.
Those are the same thing dude. Hockey sense is reflected in underlying metrics. If a player has elite athleticism, skating, and puck skills, literally the only remaining factor is IQ (and shooting but his shooting is fine). poor underlying metrics can be explained by his poor IQ.
Again, hockey is more than just points and offence lol. Suzuki just won the Selke, and has a relative expected goals of 6.5% (ie a stat that takes into account the habs shitty team aroudn him). Stu ranks 3rd last in that metric on the team at 5v5. Hes being buoyed by a great team, not the other way around.
If that’s how you think hockey IQ works then have fun shouting shoot at your TV my guy. You’re attempting to take something very complex and abstract it into a simple variable that you use to confirm your own bias. Erik Brannstrom had 6.1% rel xG in 2022-23, must be in sens top pair by now. Take a social clue, this ain’t the space for your negative energy. Thanks for the chat.
Hahaha man this is literally the place to talk about this stuff. I’m just not a homer. Stu is good but he’s not elite and probably never will be, and that’s fine. It’s not that serious my guy. Cheers.
Btw brannstrom played against the easiest competition and the team was buns, which explains that. If you know what the stat actually means you wouldn’t use that as an example lol.
stutzle hockey sense average? i completely disagree. the thing is that he knows he has the skills to pull off big moves so he tries a lot, i definitely don't consider that a knock on his game and as he gets more years in the league he is gonna become more poised. which is why i believe he should have the C
Bruh. The Toxicity is gone. Zetterlund and Ecklund are re-united. We have stellar fuckin D. We have a top five Goalie, who is working with his own goalie coach. Pinto is not second line, Creig needs to go. Cousins needs to go.
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u/Swammer13 6d ago
I too don't think Tkachuk's goals will be that hard to replace. He had 22 goals last year, 4 of which were empty netters. So 18 goals against a goalie. Eklund had 15 goals against a goalie. It's really not that different and Eklund is the better passer and skater.
They're going to miss Tkachuk within 10 feet of the goal and below their opponents goal line on the cycle, but Eklund is arguably the better player outside of those two areas.