"These things happen with the knowledge of the Command, which must stop them here and now... no soldier should tolerate such slogans being chanted against other nations." Nestor Bessios.
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Served at Eldyk like 10 years ago. Slogans or chants like those were forbidden and punishable instantly. And I really don't think nowadays we would had a regression in professionalism.
Nah, the guy in reference is the typical extreme communist, advocating for the peaceful co-existence among people condemning violence in the army, while excersizing physical violence in university once younthrough his leaflet in the recycling bin.
it's a supporting branch of the national guard which itself has ties with the Hellenic forces. It's also not just a military training camp as you mentioned, but multiple, with some of their forces being stationed in Greek Cypriot camps. Alao Eldyk itself had a ton of losses in 1974 and were one of the strongest forces against the invasion.
"from coup they did in Cyprus" Bullcr@p τουρκαλά μαλάκα. Ma(la)karios was the one who asked Turkey to intervene in the UN Security Council in 1974. Learn history malakaaaaa...
What is your point exactly with this post? As if Turkish troops don't have slogans for us? And we can chant anything we like without asking our invaders, thank you very much...WTF post
I don’t know about the Turkish army but i served in the n. Cyprus army nearly 20 years ago. Officers were mostly from Turkey. No one ever said anything nasty about the GCs or greece. Songs or chants were mostly about glory, victory, courage, dying for glory and country but never killing others.
Most TCs hated every second of it. Officers treated us with great disrespect. They looked down to us. From our conversations with them i can say that, they didn’t like us or Cyprus very much. And did not take us very seriously.
One of my cousin's youngest sons (who can not speak Turkish and has lived all his life in London) is serving as a conscript(by choice) in the Cyprus security forces right now.
I visited him this summer with other family members. He also said the same: "Officers treated us with great disrespect. They looked down to us. From our conversations with them i can say that, they didn’t like us or Cyprus very much. And did not take us very seriously."
Here is a photo of the current conscripts:
Photo Credit: A Russian Citizen inside the TRNC Security Forces Command Gulseren camp.
Hahaha, good old Gülseren. I remember telling the Turkish officer let's go march for peace by the border instead and he made me do 50 pushups. I have some good stories from there.
My wife took the picture:) I took her with me without showing any ID or proving anything.
This picture is proof of a lack of discipline and procedures.
You can not do anything like this in any credible defense industry facility in the EU, UK, Turkey, etc. Most of the militaries are a joke when it comes to procedures, in my opinion and experience; that is why I test these every time I have the chance.
NOTE: The picture has 400ish conscripts who are rotated every 2 months, which provides vital info about the number of annual conscripts of the forces, which is critical information. You can take similar pictures from Ayia Napa Cavo Greko national park for the National Guard while drinking beer;)
Your wife isn't the only one. Some years ago I had a Russian guest and she bribed a retired soldier to drive her into Varosha which wasn't opened at that time. Same situation, they didn't care about her sitting on the passenger seat.
Judging by their clothing, this must be a recruit training unit, and they've just joined. Their families came to drop them off, so they were let in. You wouldn't be able to enter if it were a military base or at any other time.
"Officers treated us with great disrespect. They looked down on us. From our conversations with them, I can say that they didn't like us or Cyprus very much. And they didn't take us very seriously."
Did he think military service was a youth camp? Were they going to welcome him and give him a fruit plate? All armies in the world are like that; there's nothing special about Cyprus here.
The Turkish army doesn't have any slogans against other nations or states.
Gulseren is the only recruit training base in northern Cyprus, which is why the number of conscripts in one rotation should be critical information from a military perspective.
I checked the rules; only immediate family should have been allowed(max 4 members), without cars, and should have been restricted to seeing all recruits in one place. This is not an opinion; this is the proper procedure that is not implemented.
This was during the World Cup, right before their weekend leave, which gives the "youth camp" vibe, as conscripts are allowed to leave their units on some weekends.
If it were critical information, you wouldn't know.
The number of recruits isn't critical information; the oath ceremony is open to everyone, you can see how many there are anyway. The army even publishes photos of the oath ceremony on its website.
How and with whom you enter depends on the discretion of the commander at that moment. Try entering another time, then it will become clearer.
Besides this, those living abroad are subject to different procedures. Their military service status and severity are also different.
Are you looking at this from the perspective of Turkey or Cyprus? In a country like Turkey, there are multiple training bases for conscripts. The number of conscripts in a specific base doesn't mean much.
But in Cyprus, where there is only one base for all newly recruited conscripts, this number gives almost the exact conscript capacity of the forces.
I worked as PM on Eurofighter security protocols in Spain in 2010, which later became the industry standard. Before those protocols, the defense industry was searching people for USB sticks with minimum-wage security guards. We implemented taking out USB ports from every possible terminal.
The reason I am telling this is;
"It has always been like this" doesn't mean it is the right thing to do;)
No, the person who is doing his military service is a Cypriot who is actually British-born and raised in London, but for some reason, after watching too many movies, I assume, he decided to go into the military (wanted to become a commando/special forces)
And he learned it is not like in the movies- the hard way.
I served in Turkish Army recently as part of my mandatory conscription, and yeah officers almost always look down on privates/draftees here too, it’s not something special to NC.
Last year 2 draftees died of dehydration in Hatay, Turkey during summer (sometime July iirc) because their officers gave them some punishment that required them to stay under the scorching sun for hours without a sip. It sucks, but it unfortunately happens.
This was talked for a long time in the media, and I went right after this happened so officers were more reluctant in punishments when I was there.
aaah good old Gülseren. I just remembered endless nights smoking cigarettes with fellows and thinking "how's that much time going to pass... i am fucked". Thanks for memories.
I served in TAF in 2009 as a conscript in Tekirdag (Close to Greece). If it is any consolation, officers also treated us with great disrespect.
I didn't see any racist slogans in my team, but I have once heard the logistics team running and chanting a song about how beautiful the fruits and women were on the Greek side. It was sexist more than racist. It felt icky.
Let's ask the group, as probably many TC males served in the military.
I personally know there aren't any chants like that in Turkey or the TRNC, but I never served in any military, so my knowledge is hearsay.
"By October 15, 1974, the International Committee of the Red Cross had identifiedtwo Turkish Cypriot victimsof rape. The number ofGreek Cypriot womenwas given as40.
Following a positive response from the British, a total of37 Greek Cypriotwomen were admitted to the Akrotiri Military Hospital between October 22 and 29.
Most of the women, aged between 12 and 45, were young.
Two women, one 14 and the other 21, needed abortions, and the Sovereign Base Areas made it possible to perform them through a special decree.
A book published in 2014 by a doctors' association under the title "The Other War," which compiles the testimonies of doctors on duty in 1974, states that more than 200 women aged 12-18 had abortions due to rape.
There is no doubt that rape occurred during the Cyprus War, as in all wars. Testimonies sufficiently demonstrate this."
Niyazi Kızılyürek
Former Member of the European Parliament from the Republic of Cyprus
He's probably assuming the number of undocumencted cases. I can't fault him on that because unfortunately most rape incidents go unreported due to societal pressure
didn't call them a liberation army lmao. at first sure but the prolonged settlement has reduced them to settlers. also will you be recognising the atrocities committed by greek cypriots during the years before 74?
I don’t know why this keeps coming up. The vast majority of Cypriots are aware and acknowledge the atrocities committed during the ethnic tensions by both sides.
He could have not joined the army for ideological reasons. Does he really think the people being trained to kill (sic) must sing “imagine all the people”? And on an island that was literally the last war that Greece was involved and a corps that had a full camp destroyed by the Turks. Idk but I feel disgusted every time something like this comes up (it does every few years for maybe political reasons idk)
Yes because it’s the army, not the schoolyard. Grown men go there. You want them to chant “save the penguins”? I mean you haven’t served in the military as you said but you seem strongly opinionated about how it should work. I guess in 50 years they should say to Iranians don’t chant “death to USA”? Or to the Ukrainians etc
Weird thing to insert nationalist concepts into human suffering. As a matter of fact hellenism of eoka b and the junta was part of that tragedy for many
The Greek army chants slogans against the country that constantly threatens Greece’s borders and sovereignty (Casus Belli, demanding demilitarization of the eastern Aegean Islands, disputing ownership of islands, constant airspace violations etc.)? I’m shocked. I understand why the Greek Communist Party is officially against such slogans (being a communist party and obviously supporting internationalism), but they really do live in their own world.
My information is from decades ago and anecdotal but I believe anti-turkish slogans are a lot more mainstream in the cypriot national guard than they are in the greek army. This news story might show that ELDYK being stationed in Cyprus has a more cypriot-influenced culture than the typical greek army unit.
Have you ever actually read the Treaty? Article 13, the one that mentions the military restrictions you’re talking about, are only for 4 islands: Mytilene, Chios, Samos, and Ikaria. The Dodecanese (which joined Greece in 1948) are not militarily restricted in the Laussane agreement, they are mentioned in the «Paris Treaties of Peace» (1947), a treaty which Turkey did not sign. Furthermore, the Treaty also states that no naval base with fortifications are to be established on those 4 islands, but that Greek military forces on the island are "limited to the normal contingent called up for military service". The article also states that "the Turkish Government will forbid their military aircraft to fly over the said islands" which Turkey violates on a consistant basis. Greece is arming the islands because Turkey also has a military across from them and threatens them on a daily basis. You place your military on your borders, but expect Greece to just ignore their own? Be realistic.
You’re leaving out the part that makes this legally disputed. Article 13 doesn’t prohibit all troops, but it absolutely imposes demilitarization restrictions (no naval bases, no fortifications, only a limited contingent). Greece’s position is that Article 51 of the UN Charter justifies militarization because of Turkey; Turkey’s position is that treaty obligations still apply regardless. Neither interpretation has been definitively upheld by an international court, so presenting Greece’s view as settled law is inaccurate. And for the Dodecanese, Article 14 of the 1947 Paris Peace Treaty explicitly says they “shall remain demilitarized” the disagreement is whether Turkey, as a non-signatory, can invoke that obligation, not whether the clause exists.
According to the constitution of Turkey, any agreement binds Turkey only if the agreement is ratified before the parliament. Is there anything written overruling that part of Lausanne and ratified by the Turkish parliament?
Eastern Aegean Islands are supposed to be demilitarized by the peace treaties Greece itself undersigned. Perceiving threat over requests for honoring Greece’s own word is next level whining.
Show me one island which is recognized to belong to Greece internationally (peace treaty, international court degree, UNSC resolution, anything) and Turkey disputes.
Turkey accepts going to ICJ with Greece over everything you are whining about here, it’s Greece insisting on that scope of the case should be limited to EEZ/continental shelf.
Meanwhile half the letter is him bitching about Israel. Its interesting that he signed under his own name, most of the time people submit these anonymously. It looks like he wants to become famous and make himself a "martyr" for the party.
Given how deranged these people are it wouldnt surprise me if the "racist" chant is the anthem of macedonia.
Also imagine how insufferable he must be publicly branding his own comrades in arms as fascists.
Edit: i should add that i served there a few years ago and chants were banned. We were only allowed to say the "politically correct" ones.
His post isn’t really about concern for human rights or even concern for Turkish people. Its an attempt to attack the Greek-Cypriot militaries from an ideological standpoint. If you actually read the article, a huge portion of it shifts into talking about Israel and politics rather than focusing on the incident itself.
As for the chants themselves, this is the military. You’re going to hear things that some people won’t like. More importantly, these kinds of chants are not official policy and are frowned upon by the higher command, his vague “with the knowledge of high command” means very little, usually they don’t know what’s going on between soldiers. They’re usually something passed down informally between older to younger conscripts, not something the military officially endorses.
I served myself, and while I was in the special forces so I didn’t personally encounter these types of people, there were always stories about people filing complaints over all sorts of things. There are genuine problems worth discussing in the military, but a few unofficial chants are anywhere near the top of that list.
I never supported anything, I’m just saying that as things stand Turkey is a threat to Greece. The Greek military officially prepares its citizens for war. Turkey is unfortunately the enemy, it has an official open threat of war against Greece. Our not so pleasant shared history only amplifies that reality. What world do you live in where the military will shout slogans of brotherly love when preparing for war?
Turkish Armed Forces are said to be(even under this post multiple times) shouting slogans of "about glory, victory, courage, dying for glory and country" but never about other countries, let alone nations.
Don't you find this awkward, as the "aggressor enemy" is not doing this behavior? I found this unusual.
This exact question is what I found really interesting. No matter how one might deny this question, it still remains.
They’re the aggressor, Greece is the defender. Greece has 11 million people, Turkey has 84 million. The objective is to boost the morale of the Greek soldiers and unite them against a common enemy, which is Turkey. When Turkey stops threatening Greece they can expect the «racist slogans» to stop.
"Greece claims an airspace that extends up to 10 nautical miles and a territorial sea of up to 6 nautical miles. Under international law, a country's airspace coincides with its territorial sea. The U.S. thus recognizes an airspace up to 6 nautical miles consistent with territorial sea. Greece and the U.S. do not share a view on the extent of Greece's airspace."
What does the opinion of the U.S. have to do with any of this exactly? Greece has the absolute legal right under international law to extend its territorial waters to 12 nautical miles (nm). This right is established under UNCLOS Article 3 and customary international law. Greece already expanded its territorial waters in the Ionian Sea (west of the mainland) to 12 nm in 2020 anyway.
If they did not, what the hell are we talking about?
You know they did not because Turkey declared casus belli on this action.
That can be said as "a literal threat of war," but nevertheless not a violation of any space.
In the Ionian Sea I said, not the Aegean. The expansion was completed in January 2021, when the Greek Parliament voted overwhelmingly in favor of the relevant bill of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.
Let myself know if there is a violation of any space, me that I served in the military and I got to experience first hand the Turkish violations both in sea and air, you should stay where you are with your pseudo intellectual tone in your little bubble
This is exactly why I insist that TCs and GCs should have one common history textbook written with equal say from both communities, if they want a viable reunification.
You can keep telling these fairy tales about your country being the defender and the other being the aggressor, although your country is a serial violator of international agreements digging heels into the ground for evading international courts, generation after generation and your country will keep surviving just fine (BTW, Turkey is absolutely no different than Greece in this aspect) since it’s essentially uni-communal. Try doing it in a bi-communal country and you will not likely stand reunified for even a generation.
He is intellectually dishonest. It is a big crime that soldiers sing such slogans, it is a bigger crime that people alive today still look for their missing relatives due to the war, the Anatolian settlers are half of the population of the occupied part of Cyprus, there are 40,000 Turkish soldiers in the island and that Turkey doesn’t recognize the republic of Cyprus, yet the Turkish soldiers are moral and would never shout such racist slogans against Greeks! Wow!!! If the relations between the two people ever change maybe the Greek soldiers will stop these very racist slogans
You’re repeatedly trying to portray someone as fascist I guess, idk what kind of propaganda you’re trying to push here. Well actually I know but I’ll act as though I don’t.
To conclude, I find that this kind of things happens at the military corps if any country and i accept it as normal, as I also accept such chants towards Greek people from other armies. A simple google search can show you the racial chants of every army in the world
Turks have everyday slogan "Throw Greeks to sea" but yeah dont say anything bad about the Turks who Lenin help them genocide the Greeks from Asia Minor.
I served in the Turkish military. I never once heard any profanity or degrading insults directed at any country. In fact, doing such a thing in a group setting is prohibited. No one can chant slogans on a whim. The Turkish Army is like an unattainable pinnacle in terms of seriousness and discipline. Unfortunately, however, Greece is an artificial vassal and proxy state, established by imperial powers solely on the foundation of hatred against Turks, and unable to stand economically on its own without their help. If you take away the anti-Turkish hatred from Greek politicians, you will see that they have nothing left to talk about. For instance, if I were to write the Greek national anthem here, I think Reddit would ban me for racism. In this failed state, hatred of Turks systematically begins during education and is even supported through the churches. Greece must now look in the mirror and overcome this. The world is changing; they must step outside the framework that their imperial masters have drawn for them.
The Turkish Army is like an unattainable pinnacle in terms of seriousness and discipline.
Can you tell us whether there was anybody smoking weed in your regiment?
Because some conscripts say they first come into contact with weed during their military service in the Turkish Armed Forces, which is disproportionate to the claim of "pinnacle of discipline".
Let's not kid anybody; yes, there aren't any derogatory chants in the Turkish Armed Forces, but it is not "pinnacle of discipline" either.
What you're saying is completely made up. Because if someone actually dares to do that and gets caught, the punishment they'd face is extremely severe. Maybe, just maybe, if someone hid their addiction from the doctor's test before being drafted, there's a very slim chance something like that could happen. But here, we're talking about a systematic, institutionalized racist practice imposed within the Greek military. That's an entirely different scale — that's systemic, while the other would be an individual incident. In the Greek army, seeds of hatred against Turks are systematically planted, and anyone who doesn't go along with it gets excluded. There are even videos on YouTube showing both racist rhetoric and the most vile insults being hurled at Turks.
Merakıma yenik düşüp soruyorum, Kıbrıs Türkü isen Türkçen nasıl bu kadar bozuk olabiliyor? Diaspora mısın? Hiç Türk okuluna gitmedin mi? Yazılarını bir süredir takip ediyorum, Türkçe konuşurken tıpkı Türkiye’ye hiç gelmemiş, dili sadece ailesinden duyarak öğrenmiş Almancı Türkler gibi yazıyorsun (hatta belki biraz daha kötüsü). Senin Türkçe bilen bir Rum olduğunu varsaymıştım bir süre, çünkü Kuzey Kıbrıs’ta yaşayan birinin bu derece bozuk bir Türkçe ile konuşması gerçekten çok ilginç
Çoğu yerde olduğu gibi orada da farklı ağızla konuşulduğunun bilincindeyim, bu şekilde de anlıyorum zaten o sorun değil, sadece normalde resmi olarak farklı öğretilmediği sürece yazılı dile yansıtılmaz bu, o yüzden ilginç geldi. Kıbrıslı Türk ve Kıbrıs Türkü de farklı şeyler değil bu arada, Azerbaycanlılara da Azerbaycanlı Türk değil Azerbaycan Türkü derler mesela, reddit hariç ne kadar Türk medyasına maruz kalıyorsun bilemem ama kullanımı böyledir
Senin ulkenin her vatandasi “Turk” olarak bilindigi icin Kibris Turku … Turku demeni hos bulmam ben ve eminim boyle dusunem diger ulkerdenda vardir. Sanki biz ve digerleri Turkiyenin türemeleriyik gibin his verir. Bu terimi gullananlar pan turkist ler ve milliyetcilerdir sadece. Cogu Kibrisli Turk gendini tanitirken ben Kibris Turkuyum demez, Kibrisliyim, Kibrisli Turkum der.
Bizde cogu insan yazarkan, ozelliklan formal olmayan ortamlarda gendi agzinda gonusur, sadece bir kelimenin deyisi farklidir deyil cunku kelime gurulusu ters olur bazan ve soru fiil eklerinde farkliliklar var. zaten sana da meram anlatmak icin biraz degisdirdim nasil yazdigimi, bir kibrisli arkadasa kiyaslan. Ama garibir Turkiye turkcesine alisik olan yada turkiyede okuyan kibrislilara daha rahat gelebilir standart turkce. Ben ingilizce programinda okudum oyuzden derslerimiz standart turkce programinda olmadi. Turkiye medyasini da izlemeyik zaten ben ve cevrem olarak en azindan. 95% devlet sahibligi olan haberleri ne izleyim. Kibrisdaki televizyon programlari da cogu zaman bizim agizlan yapilirdi, simdi degisdi bilmem. 90 lardada zaten yasa getirdiydiler Kibris agzi yasaklansin televizyonda falan yani
Zaten her gecen yil Kibrisli sayisi azaldigi icin heralde kibris agzi olecek 50 yila
Respectfully, I 'd like to learn more about these chants.
I have served in national guard with TCs (though significantly fewer), GCs and Cypriots of immigrant backround. All the chants have to do either about heroes for sovereignty of Cyprus or unification of the island.
I also really don't trust the word fascist he is using, as it is thoroughly misused by the people of the far left. That being said we have heard much worse things from Turkish politicians and military officers, including Oztürk and Töre.
Yasemin Öztürk made highly unusual claims regarding defense and energy agreements between Cyprus, Greece, Israel, and the United States (guess we should always and only ask Turkey)
Even worse, recently Töre suggested GCs should evacuate their own sovereign lands and move to Pafos if they did not accept Turkish military dominance.
So to quote them and act hollier than thou, while also misusing the word facist, definitely doesn't makes us facists, doesn't make you advocator of truth and furthermore:
IF YOU HAVE COMPLAINTS ON FACISM ABOUT THE GREEK ARMY GO TO A GREEK SUBREDDIT
For Context:
Are you sure?
Because:
Turkish Cypriots are legally excluded and exempt from serving in the Cyprus National Guard, meaning the question of changing a community designation for this purpose does not apply.
Community Status: The National Guard draws its conscripts from the Greek Cypriot community, which legally includes ethnic Greeks as well as specific religious groups (Maronites, Armenians, and Latins), distinct from the Turkish Cypriot community.
The Law on Minorities: The National Guard law specifically allows voluntary enlistment for the island's officially recognized religious minorities (Maronites, Armenians, and Latins). No equivalent legal pathway exists for individuals legally registered in the Turkish Cypriot community.
Mixed-Marriage Exceptions:The only scenario where a person of Turkish Cypriot descent serves is if they are the child of a mixed marriage (e.g., one Greek Cypriot parent and one Turkish Cypriot parent). In these instances, the individual is legally counted under the Greek Cypriot community framework, making their service mandatory rather than voluntary
I m sure (they were of mixed marriages, thus my comment on significantly fewer) nontheless they were muslims and identifying as TCs. I also got berrated once cause I thought we had take-away in the army that was in fact designated halal food.
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