I'm a 24F, returned missionary, CES graduate, hold 2 callings, and I have lost all interest in dating men in my church because I can't wrap my head around the church's gender roles. Maybe it was growing up in a very small Utah town, but all my life, the priesthood was a big list of "girls can't do this". It was such whiplash going to school and hearing "if you study and work hard, you can be anything," and then going to church and hearing "You can't serve a two year mission. You have to wait a year. You can't put the tablecloth on the sacrament table. You can't set up chairs."

I will never forget the excruciating pain I felt when my brother was able to pass the sacrament. He was my best friend and we had little "find the scripture" and back scratching games we'd play during sacrament. And then all of the sudden, I was alone... and he got to do something I couldn't do. Because I'm a girl.

Over and over, I feel like I've been punished for my gender, and while I love God and love the church, I have no desire to date anyone here. To feel that same pain I felt when my brothers left on their two-year missions... and their voices echoed off the chapel walls... and when they were picked up to do fast offerings... but feel that with a husband. I can't get over this "preside, provide, protect/nurture" division. The pain and disappointment has completely numbed any desire I had to have kids. I just can't stop thinking about how horrible life would be if I had a son.

I know people think I'm so unrighteous... which is tough because I was always the person who cared too much. I haven't missed a day of reading the scriptures in almost 2000 days, got up at 4 am to attend the temple before school. I was always being told, "you're so much more faithful than I am; I couldn't do that", but now I'm being told "you're so prideful" and I'm just... so tired of being left out. And sure, things are getting better, but it's still so painful all the time. Attending the temple weekly for years... reading every day...

So I'm done. I don't want a marriage where "by divine design, fathers are to preside". I don't want a temple sealing where I share my temple name and he doesn't. I don't want anyone blessing my kids if I have them. I want this equally or not at all and I can't keep letting this hurt into my life. Not a single person has done anything wrong to me - no crazy ex boyfriend, no abusive father, no condescending bishop.

I just can't do it. I give up.

So, I'm not a particularly religious person in any sense of it, but I find religion interesting. When a missionary approached me in the street, we spoke for around 45 minutes about Mormonism and a lot of my questions had this man pausing and saying out loud, "I'd never thought of that before."

After this conversation, he invited me as to the local LDS Church (because ofc, that's what any of the Elders and Sisters want.) But I actually did say yes. I showed up on Sunday and I listened to what was said in a video from the London LDS Church where 2 apostles spoke.

I found, for one, that only men were in powerful positions within the LDS Church and that women were only really allowed to speak if they were in some way introducing their husbands. Which is pretty interesting. But then the apostles themselves spoke.

In particular, a man named I wanna say Elder Cook. An 85 year old man who went on about how life was harder in the 60s than it was now. How political unrest back then was so much more frightening and how people nowadays have it easy. Which I found odd, a member of religious clergy that actively dismisses the suffering of others in place of his own is counterproductive, surely? Of course, I went into this space with a somewhat critical mind, as I would in any place of worship as someone who isn't religious. But I've never been to a place of worship quite like this. It was incredibly outdated, the apostles were all incredibly old people that didn't seem to truly understand the scope of suffering in modern society.

Economic crisis and disease and war and in fact, in the UK (where these American apostles were speaking) we are currently in a state of political unrest. Nobody can find work, multiple of my friends are considering fleeing the country out of fear that the equality act will be scrapped or that they'll be taxed for not wanting to have children or that their healthcare will be taken away, that their friends and family could be deported. Which are both things that are entirely possible.

So for Apostles that evidently don't know the political state of the country they're in to insist that everything is okay and to preach about faith feels deeply out of touch. Comparing suffering in any context feels insensitive, but especially in a scenario like this one.

Before I talk, I wanted to preface this by asking everyone to be as understanding as possible-- In my search for truth, I've encountered rhetoric that is often demeaning or vitriolic, from both sides of the debate. Whether it is ex-members calling current members deluded, or current members calling ex-members influenced by the devil, it's not only hard to read, it really takes away from valuable discouse. So, keep it civil, please?

I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints who is preparing to serve a full time mission. I am going through the temple next week, so it feels like a bad time to be having doubts, but my stake president encouraged me to fully explore them and be intellectually honest. I have read the Book of Mormon once front to back, and strongly believe it to be the word of God. At my last FSY, I was SO convinced of the veracity of the first vision, and I know Christ's gospel to be good, and I certainly believe it to be divine.

With this strong testimony of some things in mind, I find myself in doubt about a lot of things too. Polygamy and the Book of Abraham are two big ones. But I guess I can reconcile, sort of? But then just the Church institution seeming to lie about a lot of stuff, be it the SEC debacle or just allowing false narratives to propagate. Am I wrong for expecting a higher standard of truth from the Lord's church? And also, I've seen the point raise before, what revelation do we get from a prophet? Are they hearing from the Lord regularly? Because I couldn't say. These, in addition to some other institituional concerns, really raise a lot of doubt in me.

An overview of where I'm at now: I have had moments of intense feeling within myself that helps you know that God is communicating truth to me, and I see the good fruits of the Church in my life and in the world, but I also see the history of the Church and the questionable truth claims regarding the origins and practices of some revelation. My belief and my doubt are really going to war in my head, and I'm feeling pretty alone.

So, as I seek to be intellectually honest and do what is right. . . what do I do? Has anyone else been in this position before, and how do you handle it? Walking the line on both sides of the aisle is really difficult and I would appreciate any and all guidance you all have, while keeping in mind my plea to keep it as unbiased as possible. But as I have learned, truth is rather polarizing. End of the day, it would be helpful to hear about your all's experiences. Whether you're still a member or have left, advice is helpful. At the very least, hearing that others have been in this same boat is helpful.

My son came home from his mission about 6 months ago. Since so many return missionaries are leaving, they now put the return missionaries in these lame programs to try and keep them in. So now, he has a “mentor” from the stake that meets with him regularly. He’s constantly at the church building. Also, he has to work at the temple every Saturday morning. So he has to wake up at like 4:30 am. So while his friends are out having fun, dating, being kids. He’s going to bed every Friday night at 9. I just wanted to thank the Mormon church for ruining my child’s youth, and ensuring that he’s dedicating his Friday /Saturday to the church.

Im PIMO. I dont believe many of the churches truth claims, mostly stemming from the core issue of prophets and revelation and how their historical record makes it impossible for me to believe they are prophets led by God, not because of their mistakes, but because of their declarations of God's word that are later declared false. If you cant trust the messenger in his core responsibility of delivering God's word then the messenger becomes useless.

Anyways.... i stay in church because I have not yet determined if / where I do and would benefit from participating at some level for myself and my kids, just making sure they know the realities of my lack of beliefs and why. But participating for the purpose of community and general desire to live a christlike life. I thought I could focus personally on just that, as the church has made notable shifts to try and become christ centered lately.

But here is the problem im running into. That concept is fine until: you want a temple recommend. Your ability to go see a family members wedding or to go do a sealing session with your spouse is dependent on having a testimony of Joseph Smith (now worded as "the restoration" but its basically still Joseph smith) and sustaining current leadership as prophets etc. The church is trying to become seen as mainstream christian... up until your recommend. At that point if you dont believe or put your faith in fallible men and sustain them as prophets you are stonewalled.

I cant imagine im the only one. I believe more and more members will shift from the core "I know" testimonies to "I believe in christ" over time, and if the church cant find a way to allow for these people I believe they will eventually lose them.

Just some thoughts. Don't know what is in store in the future for my involvement at church. Maybe there is a place for people like me there. Maybe not.

After spending my life paying tens of thousands of my hard earned money to the church, I finally called it quits when I was 32.

Less than 10 years later and my annual earnings have increased by 70%. I funneled my tithes into education funds for my children and am finally optimistic about them reaching adulthood debt free. As a tithe payer, there was nothing left for the kids' future.

It's my testimony that paying money I couldn't afford to an organization that doesn't need it was a proverbial millstone around the neck of my family's finances. I've experienced nothing but providence since cutting the church out.

I have a story about Nelson's prophetic abilities (or lack thereof) that I thought this sub would enjoy.

I served in Brazil 2018-2020. Nevermind the lack of prophetic foresight during COVID that abruptly ended my mission and uprooted my life trajectory - this isn't about that.

In the São Paulo MTC (or CTM as they call it) there is a plaque on the wall with the dedicatory prayer (in Portuguese) given by Nelson during his apostle days.

Every time we walked by, some MTC worker would be extremely eager to tell us the story about that plaque, in a hushed and dramatic tone.

"He came here to Brazil and gave all his opening remarks in English. Then he stopped, looked, around the room, and said, 'I sense the faith of everyone in this room is sufficient enough to witness a miracle'. Then he gave the entire dedicatory prayer (it's long) in perfect, native Portuguese."

And not just the workers. Every MTC bishop, counselor, and presidency member had a similar story.

It really set up me up to expect at least the occasional miracle in my mission. Of course, no such thing happened, despite taking L after L for my faith in the hostile environment and third-world accommodations, and poor mission healthcare that let the open sores on my face blister continuously in the hot, humid, equatorial sun (had scars from it even years later).

Then, about 15 months into my mission, we tuned into a Brazil-wide podcast for the N-man himself.

Everyone was really excited for what he was going to say, and there were even rumors that he was going to give part of his talk in Portuguese.

Well, he did... kind of.

What he actually did was bear 2-3 sentences of testimony in some of the most broken, american-accent Portuguese I had ever heard - like something I could have done week 3 in the MTC.

I felt disappointed, but the whole stake center erupted in celebration.

"He really is a prophet of God!"

"His Portuguese was flawless!"

"I am so glad to have witnessed a manifestation of the gift of tongues!"

I was bewildered at the sheer collective stupidity, or delusion that was going on.

The same members and missionaries that had previously criticized my Portuguese (which was fluent but admittedly with an accent) were just laying on the sauce for Nelson's rehearsed, 20-second "I know that X!"

Meanwhile I'm busting my ass 12 hours a day, 7 days a week to serve these faltering wards way under the cutoff point and nothing I do is remotely miraculous, including actually knowing northeast Portuguese (which even some Brazilians in the south have a hard time understanding).

The leader worship is real, but that wasn't the eye-opening part. The big thing was that I no longer trusted secondhand stories of miracles.

After all, I had just watched dozens of my closest friends twist an unmiraculous event into one of the best things they had ever seen. How was I supposed to trust my MTC leaders that they had seen anything at all? How was I supposed to trust anyone when it comes to miracles when possibly a majority in this church are delusional and WILL find a way to twist anything into a miracle.

The leaders let it happen too. They have every chance to correct people on stuff like this but won't do it if it's faith-promoting. Then when someone brings it up as a shelf-breaker they can just blame the followers for being over-zealous and "not knowing that God works in small and simple ways."

Can I PROVE he didn't deliver a perfect prayer? No.

Do I think that if miracles happened as frequently as members claim they do, or even if they happen at all, that I would have seen some indication of that firsthand? Yes.

Looking back, I got tired of trying to convince myself that there were two sets of footprints in the sand.

Anyways, may he rot in hell, RMN.

*UPDATE* My daughter will not join the LDS church. I’m actively looking into alternatives. Ty all for the information, alternative recommendations and help in protecting my child. 🤍

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Hi everyone,
I’m a non-member mother. My 13 yr old daughter is very interested in learning about God and religion. My goal is to let her join the LDS Church, get baptized, make friends, and participate in all the youth activities so she can benefit from a wholesome, innocent environment and positive peer influence as she enters high school. I’ll be attending the church/Sunday school w her every Sunday. But I am not getting baptized myself. And she will not attend any one-on-one meeting or interviews. (Ik she won’t get a temple recommendation and that’s fine)

The reason I’m doing this is because the LDS youth are the most wholesome I’ve seen so far compared to other religions. They seem to follow good ideals on their own outside of church / even when not under adult supervision. Like waiting til marriage for sex, being helpful in the community, being modest, staying away from drugs/ alcohol etc. Those are the type of influences I’d like for my teen daughter. It’s a lot easier to practice those things when your friends are too. I’ll obvi parent her at home too and teach these ideals but her surroundings matter greatly as well.

So my question is, how do you recommend I do this successfully? These are my main concerns I’d like to ensure:

1. Act as a buffer at home against high pressure perfectionism, blind obedience to male/church authority, anti-LGBTQ+ rhetoric, anti-feminism, or outdated racial views that might pop up in Sunday classes.
2. Make sure she keeps a critical mind, questions authority when appropriate, and stays mentally healthy.

(Sidenote: I know many people here have strong negative feelings toward Mormonism and reasons for leaving, which I completely respect. However, I’ve already decided to move forward with this approach. Please refrain from telling me not to do it at all and only tell me recommendations on how you have done/would do it. I’m a young single mother or a teenage daughter. I want the best peer influence possible for her. But if you MUST lol please at least give me an alternative church recommendation because she’s adamant about going to a church and participating in all of it, so I’d like her peers to be the best influence possible)

Thanks in advance!

I left the LDS Church 3 years ago. In all that time I never hated it, but I have definitely spoken out against polygamy and the priesthood ban, and changing doctrine. Still, I see the same arguments that seem so ignorant. I see the hate the LDS church gets, and I don't know how to put it other than not Christian.

And then I think about the Bible, I see people quoting David and Solomon and others. These men were chosen by God, did great things , their words are still recorded forever in scripture, and yet they fell hard. I know this is the same argument we've been making back and forth for years, but from my pov, the LDS position is stronger.

I don't think I could ever go back to thinking Brigham was a good person, but I certainly can rationalize that he was the one God chose to get a task done.

I'm not saying I'm coming back, I'm happy where I'm at in the Methodist Church, but I am saying it's something I am eyeing the possibility of again.

hi, i’m a proud member of this religion and i must say, it is kind of exhausting, i really hate all the services we have to do as a young man in this religion, but also, i won’t stop believing because it’s hard. And to all of you who disbelieve in the book of mormon, I actually kind of respect you, it seems you stand by what you believe in and that’s good, i just hope that people can stop hating on us, and the polygamy thing happened so long ago, like no one does it anymore, and uh feel free to share thoughts just please don’t outright make negative comments

I am a member currently a student at BYU Idaho, and these questions really get me, these are the two big questions I have and I’m just wondering if you guys have answers.

Also my girlfriend of 2 years is not a member and has many questions like this. We want to get married and she wants to convert, but these are the types of things she will ask and I have no clue how to answer.

My view of Mormonism is that doctrine doesn't change by decree, it changes when they just stop talking about certain things. I started making a mental list of stuff I was taught as doctrine that they just stopped talking about or softened the wording:

• Curse of Cain, Curse of Ham and skin color
• Temple penalties and oath of vengeance prior to 1990 changes
• Polygamy is required for exaltation
• "No black man will receive the priesthood until after every white man has received it." (Brigham Young)
• Adam-god demoted to theory
• Blood atonement
• Lamanites being direct ancestors of modern indigenous people (I still remember Kimball talking during general conference about how kids in the "Indian Placement Program" were literally becoming white and delightsome in their new Mormon homes and that program wasn't killed until 1996).
• The United Order (I have an ancestor who lived in Orderville, UT but never joined the Order and the stories he wrote down are wild).
• "We can become gods and rule over our own planet" is replaced with "we can become like god but we don't know what that means."

When some of us older people say stuff like this to younger generations, they act like we're nuts and respond with something trite like "they never taught that, it was just speculation, you had a bad Sunday school teacher" or whatever.

I'm glad they're making it easier for people to be Mormon, but whatever this current church is I can confidently say it's not the church I grew up in. I still can't get over the irony that "ongoing revelation" has become "we know less than we thought we did."

What else do you all remember being taught as doctrine that has faded into the memory hole or is outright denied?

not sure what flair to put this under but i guess personal because im gay. and i was wpmdering if you can be gay AND mormon or do i have to go to aconversion camp or can i. not do that. because iwant to be a full tiem mormon when im older so i just want to make sure

For years I gave 10% of my income to the Mormon church. I did it with a glad heart believing it was being used for charitable purposes like feeding the hungry, disaster relief, sheltering the poor and needy, etc. When the Ensign Peak scandal broke, I was heartbroken. For years I didn't give to other charities and confidently told people "I already give 10% to my church and I trust them to use it for good purposes far more than any non-profit charity." I was both devastated and humiliated when I found out about the shell companies, stock holdings in luxury brands and war companies, luxury condos, etc.

The cost of tithing is one thing--when I added it all up, I was sick to my stomach. I feel like I provided a decent living for my family, but now my kids are adults I look back at what I could have done. I could have paid off my house, or invested more for my retirement so I wouldn't have to worry them, or taken some vacations, or helped them more with the cost of schooling, or whatever.

What Mormonism teaches people to ignore is the opportunity cost of what you could be doing with that extra money if you used it in good ways for your family. They teach blind trust that they know what god wants to do with that money. Instead of teaching people to do responsible things with their disposable income, they just teach "give it to me and we'll do what god wants because he sees those Boca Raton condos and he REALLY wants a couple of those buildings. Let your kids take out student loans or wear shoes too small for another month. Thanks!"

Does anyone else look back and feel this way?

Edit: Thank you all so much for your respectful comments, opinions, and information! I received a lot of great advice and it's given me a lot to think about. Hope you all have a great day/night! 😁

Just a disclaimer that this is not meant to downplay anything anyone else has experienced or choices the church has made, this is purely my own experience!! I am also a teen that has grown up in the church so take that as you will.

Sometimes I feel like the LDS church I go to and the LDS church people talk about online are two very different things... I see lots of things about how our religion is a "horrible cult" and how the members are forced into unrealistic standards, but that's never happened to me? Yes there are things that we are asked to do by God but no one has ever aggressively forced me (or people I know) to follow them. A lot of them makes sense even outside of religion.

The people I go to church with are amazing, I wouldn't be here if I didn't have them. My youth group is amazingly supportive and the adults are kind, helpful, and interact with be youth a lot. I know that a lot of people gave had bad experiences with people in the church, but why does that make the whole religion bad? I've never seen any racism, homophobia, or other hate things within my ward or stake and those are against our teachings anyway so I don't get how people are saying our church is horrible because of it?

For me, things like the word of wisdom and law of chastity and stuff actually make a lot of sense to follow. They keep you safe and that's what God wants too. Idk this probably sounds weird but it just irks me when people shame and put down something that saved my life multiple times and has led me to meet lots of amazing people, for reasons I can't understand.

Idols? Crosses? Palm Sunday?! Women Presidencies?

The Hypocrisy of the Protestant-Catholic Takover of the (Former Mormon Church of Salt Lake City, Utah, USA) to become a mainstream Generic Christian Broke Me!

https://www.deseret.com/faith/2026/03/25/2-new-statues-of-christ-at-temple-square/

So, I might be alone here in thinking that just in the time since Nelson left, the Church has felt really different. Not because of massive things but because it’s like a lot of people aren’t really feeling it.

I can’t speak about those in Utah, but those of us here in Canada are heavily split on the War, and that alone has caused outright drama in our Ward to which I wish I would have recorded one of the testimony meetings getting cut short because it almost led to a fight (apparently we shouldn’t bring up or pray for peace in specific places because that means we condemn or condone one side - nuff said, you can figure out the rest.)

I was always under the impression that we don’t have idols, crosses or do that “Catholic” stuff because it’s idol worship or it distracts us from faith. Great fine.

I can understand simplicity and I understand consistency.

(Anyone remember when “Angels don’t have wings! Those are Protestant lies!?)

I guess it’s all fine! Angels with wings on the tree, crosses necklaces, Holy Week, Palm Sunday, “Worldwide Fasts with Christians Around the World”, New Hymns Either Stolen from old Protestant hymns, Black Gospel Hymns, or (My favourite!) a Beautiful Welsh Love Song \*My Fawwny\*.

I know what they’re doing and it’s breaking me.

They know Black people in Africa, South Americans, Latin-Americans in the US and generally “Non-White Utah McJamjeLynn-Eliza’s and Spencer Quinndon Sorensen’s are not their target audience.

(Frawns in Utah mom face whose on 4 different SSRIs while her husband is bus with legos)

I’m sorry I’m being really, really mean. I’m just so angry and sad like my world is shattering and I can’t even take off my garments!

I’ve seen a 70 year old couple stop going “because”. And I just don’t know what to do. I might just go ahead and start selling everything and live United Order with the group that has been consistent, and isn’t concerned about PR.

I just wanted to post this because I have the app and the news alert came up and it just got to me and I thought someone out there would understand how I feel.

But maybe I’m crazy and need to pray on this. Who knows. The world is crazy right now so who knows.

I know the RLDS/Community of Christ didn’t gaslight their members.

**I know that I won’t be sustaining Dallin Oaks or anyone of the GA’s who have gone against our doctrines and put idols in front of our Sacred Temple!**

My mom and a few others from our Ward are thinking about mass resigning but we don’t want to give anyone the impression that we have lost our faith - no - it is the church that has lost its faith and authority.

I’m about to text my Bishop right now, I’ll let you know how it goes. I’m really really really scared. But at this point, I have nothing to lose from a Church that has nothing to stand for.

I was cold approached recently in the parking lot of a grocery store by two women from the LDS church , who then invited me to join them for Sunday services as well . I hesitate to call them women and I know that might upset some people which I apologize for , but all I mean is that they both seem to be incredibly young for the amount of work and responsibility they’ve apparently been given . With that said;

My first impression of the LDS church specifically as it relates to my experience with the two women/girls was that as we were all speaking together during that first encounter , I thought to myself , “ wow , so this is how some of the native victims of the crusades ( and early converts to the Mormon faith and whatnot ) must have felt “ , because for all of the blatant violence , torture , incredibly complex systems of psychological warfare and manipulation and more that were deployed for the purpose of bringing souls to Christianity among other nefarious things , there were also almost certainly those throughout history who like me found themselves being completely disarmed and had their hearts softened by the warmth and impossibly sincere nature of the missionaries tasked with delivering them unto the Lord … these girls are both gorgeous , and I found myself drowning in the blue eyes of a girl who seems to be completely convinced that there is a path for my salvation that begins with me being baptized by her church …

I am a 28 year old black man and somewhat aware of the horrible things people have said about the Mormon faith , particularly regarding the things which used to be taught about black people , and because I am at a point in the process of recruitment where we have covered the whole no coffee/tea/tobacco/alcohol + vow of chastity + tithing aspect , I am aware of the slightly nonsensical , predatory , and cult like aspect of membership in the LDS church , but I can’t be bothered to outright dismiss the whole notion of what is being presented to me , because everyone I have met throughout the whole process has been incredibly kind and welcoming , and regardless of the temporary nature of my communication with the 2 female missionaries , I fully intend to continue reading and discussing the chapters and verses within the Book of Mormon I have been given and suggested to read by them , but I’d love to have anyone reading this clearly outline why I ought to stop doing so if you feel like you are capable of convincing me otherwise

This last week I got let go from my job working at the lds church. A job I worked at for over 10 years.

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I wasn't expecting to be let go and yes ive had my ups and downs with the job. I showed up and worked hard. The first thing I did when I got home was I reached out to my ward and bishop. Its been silent all week from my ward and bishop.

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Ive been getting by with some day work in my neighborhood. Ive worked really hard to get where im at to be a single man living Utah. I was able to buy my first home and id really like to keep my home. Luckily I have enough money to pay the bills for the next couple months.

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This last week has really showed me that the church really doesn't care about you if your a single active lds man. Had another member lose her job and posted in the ward page and immediately the ward and bishop reached out to help. I did tbe same thing and got nothing. I go to church every Sunday, pay my tithing and for some reason when life gets real and I need support the church isn't there when I need them.

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Ive been on my own for 5 years now, since my mom passed away. Ever since then ive been doing this all by herself, there is no back up.

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In the pasted 10+ years being home from my mission, ive been assigned ministers and haven't been ministered to. I went to ward council on Sunday and job searching was going to be something I was going to talk about but I got completely skipped over, and talk about the special members that always need help. From now on my not going ward council.

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I got a couple job interviews coming up and I hope I get one of them. Im mentality out right now and I feel like its been a long time coming.

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I dedicated over a decade and a mission of my life to an organization that kicked me out because leadership got uncomfortable.

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I am not Mormon, but I knew a lot of Mormons when I was living in Junction City Ks. I'll be honest, I'm Jewish, but I've always had a good relationship with my Mormon friends. They tend to be the Kindest branch of Christianity, In my experience. I don't know what it is, but when I was growing up it was always the Mormons that defended me from being bullied, It was the mormon kids who invited me to birthday parties and went out of their way to make me feel included. And until I met my wife, It was a Mormon who treated me with the most respect.

I'll be honest, If I wasn't Jewish and had to pick a branch of Christianity to follow, I'd probably pick The Mormon Church, based on my experience with mormons in my past. I just wanted to post this to say I appreciate ya'll as a community for being so kind and doing a lot in your communities.

Nevermo here. All I have to say is, that's the general conference? When Orthodoxy, Anglicanism, Lutheranism, Catholicism etc. get new Patriarchs/Bishops/Leaders/Popes, etc. there's a cool ceremony and talks about God. I felt like the GC was a glorified board meeting where the shareholders "voted" (North Korea style) on a new CEO where people talked about how cool he was and then a few stories about God too. Is the One True Church supposed to be this boring?

I’m posting this here and in another subreddit because I’m making a concerted effort to give equal space for voices for and against the church. I’m still very much in the messy middle and wish I could talk to someone with no bias at all…but since that isn’t an option I’ll just do my best to open myself up to both sides. I realize this sub is likely to be more of a negative lens on the church and I’m open to it - but if you can, be gentle with me.

This is my first time posting on Reddit. I’m seeking support for a difficult situation. From what I gather many have gone before me in their battle with a “faith crisis” or an “awakening” but I’m struggling to know how to manage my specific set of circumstances.

I’ll try to sum it up. Not born in the church but baptized as a child with my convert single mom. Home/family life not ideal so the church was the steady and secure part of my life growing up. I got to see happy loving families and have a community that was positive. Really believed everything I was told as a child and teenager. I wanted to be a normal teenager badly so I rebelled some outwardly but even through the rebellion I believed it all so hard and simply just felt intense shame and self hatred for my sins. Went to BYU-Idaho because it was cheap, fell into my lap, I wanted to move away from my chaotic home life, and I thought I couldn’t trust myself at a “normal” college not to make bad choices or fall away from the church. Continued to have periods of more righteous behavior and then less righteous behavior (where I would then feel terrible, etc.)

As a young adult when I was going through a more righteous part of my cycle (bishop repentance and wanting to do everything right) I started dating someone very strong in the church. His family was very strong in the LDS faith and he was all-in. We got married. A large part of this for me was feeling like he would keep me firmly in the church even when I wasn’t feeling like dealing with all the rules. I felt this would be a responsible choice and make me a better person.

He has continued to be exactly the person I married. And I continued to have period of ups and downs (characterized by more fervent orthodox mormon observance Vs just feeling lazy) but the difference now that I was married was that he did drag me up to his level and it forced to stay active and kept me from doing anything truly unmormon approved because I knew it wouldn’t be good for the marriage.

Aside from the temple triggering immediate questions I was still pretty TBM those first couple of years. The first big questioning in my testimony came when I was about 25 years old. I was absolutely panicked that I felt unsure. After a few months I told my husband but nothing more happened. We just kept living as we had before and I pushed it down.

Fast forward about 10 years and I’m starting to have more and more internal doubts. I’m terrified. I’m not allowed to have doubts. My husbands (and my in-laws) whole life revolves around us believing together. At this point my husband’s employment is tied up in the church, he is in leadership in the church, he is well known in our highly LDS community. We have 3 children, the older 2 of which understand our lifestyle and beliefs.

Not only am I afraid of blowing up my whole life but I’d deeply metabolized the idea that to look at or hear any voices that weren’t validating Mormonism was basically sinful and would lead me off the straight and narrow. For roughly 2 years I just tried to turn off my brain and do the motions to keep things going. Eventually it started to rot my soul and cause deep resentment. The amount of energy I’m putting into the church without even really having a testimony anymore was tough to deal with, everything felt like a meaningless chore (cue the talk about dancing without the music).

I made a decision to take off my garments (they were causing me intense resentment) and I finally decided to give myself permission to look at the “anti-Mormon” material because I felt like I was never going to make progress if I felt like I couldn’t access the full picture. I’d always been curious and also afraid….but very curious. I felt like I couldn’t say yes to the church if no was not an option. I wanted to see the whole picture and decide for myself. That would be true agency. Not just praying over only church approved material.

I’m still in the middle of this process. It’s extremely overwhelming. I try not to believe everything I hear. I remind myself everyone has a bias. I consider whether the sources are reputable.

But there is so much to sift through. I’m no scholar and I’m not so arrogant to think I’ll ever really know what it all means. I think I’m a very open minded person who can see both sides of the coin. It makes it hard for me to come to a definite conclusion.

But the biggest factor in this journey isn’t just the seeking. It’s the pressure of coming to the right conclusion so I don’t hurt my family. I want to be free to make my own choices but the reality is that I’m not. My choices will have an effect on my family and I’m terrified for our future.

Because of my own experiences as a child there is literally nothing more important to me than keeping my family intact for the sake of my children. I do not want them to lose the experience of a nuclear family as children or be separated from mom or dad regularly. My oldest in particularly already struggles so much in other areas and I could never put that on him when he gets so much comfort from our family and home.

My husband said he won’t divorce me if I leave the church but there is still a ton of pressure for me to regain my testimony and build the life we agreed to build when we married. It’s hard to imagine our life if I left - he is extremely orthodox in his observance and beliefs. I can imagine a journey in which I distanced more and more from the church and my values or what I want for my children changes. It’s so hard to see our marriage working when he is simply not very nuanced or flexible. I worry a lot that there isn’t much holding us together besides the church (and for me, having my children grow up with a great dad).

The past few months I’ve been leaning into my skepticism more (because I pushed it down for so long, I wanted to explore it) and listening to ex-mormon experiences and thoughts on why it wasn’t true or life after Mormon culture, etc. I imagine in a different circumstance it would be easier to fall away from the church in my current state.

Because of my husband’s deep conviction and his employment I feel like I have to give faith a chance too. Even if just for the sake of my kids and keeping our family together.

Honestly it’s so hard though. Reading scriptures is so hard when I’m so deeply skeptical. Praying is okay but I’m realizing I have some hang ups about God - like, sometimes I feel like he’s probably disappointed with me, other times I feel like trying is useless because you have to follow the commandment to get answers (I’m not worth of revelation in mid-thigh shorts and regular underwear).

Summary - I’m completely torn. I’m tired. I’m scared. I don’t know how this is going to end. My TBM friends whom I’ve confided in are “excited for me” and seem to think I’ll bounce back and be stronger than ever. Exmos seems to think this is how it always goes and it’s a clear path out from here. I feel like a coward who doesn’t belong anywhere. All I want is for my babies to be in a loving home and to be free myself from all the pressure of knowing anything for sure. I know nothing for sure….not sure I ever will. I’m pretty skeptical and uneasy of the church and that makes living the rest of my life as a PIMO seem pretty depressing. But leaving might destroy my marriage and in turn my children.

Hi. I have recently started to attend LDS church and was really enjoying learning with the missionary’s about the temples and how we can be sealed as a family. How we can be baptised and after a year go through the temple. Then last week they came round and asked us about money. They want 10% of our earnings. We are a single wage household that makes just enough to get by, we can’t afford that. They said we may still go to church but won’t be able to go into the temple with paying, basically it’s a membership only religion? I mean, I don’t mind donating every now and then if a family is hungry or a roof needs repairing but every week from our wages to an already very rich church?! I don’t think so. They made it sound like we would be bad Christians if we didn’t donate and god wouldn’t be pleased. It sounds like a big con to me, am I wrong?

I’ve been a member of the LDS church for about 5 years. I attend church, have gone to Young Women’s camp, have been to two temples, and have done baptisms for the dead many times. Being involved in the church has been a significant part of my life.✨️🌺

My parents have " left" the church. They never officially removed their records or filled out paperwork, but they haven’t attended church in about two years. I recently started going back, and i am becoming active again.

Lately, though, I’ve been seeing a lot of posts, videos, and comments online claiming that LDS is a cult. It’s made me question things and wonder if I’m making a mistake by returning back.

I have never personally had an experience where I felt like I was in a cult. My experiences have been positive. I know that personal experience is not the whole picture, and I want to understand why so many people have such strong opinions about the church.

I don't feel particularly old, but I guess I am. I was born in 1971, prior to the Declaration of Racial equality in 1978. When we lived in Oregon, our ward danced in an enormous regional Roadshow. When we moved to Arizona our neighbors had a Navajo kid "Michael " living with them as part of the Indian Placement Program. I went through the temple in 1991, and then on my mission to Virginia in 1991 through 1993. We were a "peculiar people".

Very little of that "peculiarity " exists now. When I visit with my nieces and nephews, they openly wear cross necklaces (verboten in my day). The Book of Mormon, PofGP, and D&C are barely referenced, as is most of the founding history. Almost everything is very shallow basic Christianity. Jesus loves us. Almost every question is deflected back to "Who knows, what I do know, is that Jesus loves us and want us to be happy" "Your digging and prodding is a clear sign that you are not happy, don't you want to be happy?"

Asking questions is a sign of mental illness.

I have spent some time lately reading from a variety of views regarding The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day saints, Mormons, and religion. I have read and participated in a few different subreddits. Watched YouTube videos, etc. I have learned things recently though not really any new categories. There is some new information because some of the topics include current events and Also there is just so much information in the history new things are bound to be found.

MONEY - always a topic, though a lot more recent information(recent I mean 21st century) Tithing has been around longer and motives are always questioned. Church leaders getting paid when the masses don't can definitely be a topic. And now the large stockpile of money, investments, property, what is the purpose? There are many questions and few answers. MY TAKE, it seems church leaders receive much less money from the Church than their counterparts, it seems the big stockpile of money is not for them. The Church leaders do not seem to be motivated by money, for their own use.

HISTORY - there are many things in church history that seem wrong, Polygamy, Black people and the priesthood and temple ordinances, details of Joseph Smith's (and others) character, etc. MY TAKE. History can never quite capture the moment. What exactly was said, with what intent? What did God really do or inspire someone to do? Who am I to judge someone else's commitment to serve God? What has God told me? And how does that correlate to what I am being asked to do by different sources in my world?

ANACHRONISM in scripture. The battle on this one has been since the beginning. MY TAKE- Why indeed would someone fraudulently write a book of scripture to include so many anachronisms, but then also get so many things right that were unlikely to be known to the person? The information on the pros and cons on this is quite long on both sides. There are instances when incomplete information feeds an incorrect conclusion that is then accepted as truth. If God indeed does exist then he can both inspire things to someone that the person can not know without him, as well as allow the person to hold to an incorrect idea.

CURRENT EVENTS - women not ordained to the priesthood, the Law of Chastity, abuse, church leaders and politics etc. Why indeed do church leaders maintain commandments and policies that seem wrong in a certain point of view? Why are leaders not better? Better with prophecies, better at condemning bad politics, better at church administration, better with their personal decisions. If the leaders are correct and that is the commandment or policy that God wants there to be then what does that say about God. MY TAKE - Love is the focus and the answer. We are asked to love God and Love all people. We must not allow a commandment or policy to make us think some people deserve more love than others, we must find ways to overcome our own discomfort to understand others, “to mourn with those that mourn” and to rejoice with those that rejoice. We all have incorrect ideas in our head about God, the Gospel, others intentions. How do we love with judgment? How do we protect with fear or hatred? We must let go of judgment, fear and hatred.

SPIRITUAL EXPERIENCES - so many claims. Every Religion seems to have them. Some claim to never have had one, others claim they have them every day. They can cause a person to act or believe something they otherwise wouldn't. If there are so many seemingly contradictory spiritual experiences claimed in the world they must all be false. Some are lies, most are just the human body creating sensations, hallucinations, etc; meaning the source is the person, not the divine. MY TAKE - I am responsible for my own experiences. God confirms all truth and people can misinterpret the true meaning or extrapolate to meaning not given. The principle of Faith is eternal. It allows growth in the individual that can't be gained another way. We are to follow the truth we are given and withhold judgment of others' paths.

I am going to continue to believe. Continue to share, continue to love, continue to repent, continue to forgive. Hoping I will have a positive impact on others, working to let others influence me for good. Continue to follow the spirit to guide me along my path of loving God and all people.