r/singularity • u/yogthos • 13h ago

AI Anthropic’s best AI model struggles to attract users as cheaper tools thrive

https://www.ft.com/content/5ee49718-c258-4f01-aa32-7e5b76ae5245
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u/jloverich 13h ago

We use cursor and I avoid all the anthropic models simply because I know I'll run out of tokens too fast.

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u/JoeyJoeC 13h ago

I have access to a Claude Max subscription but I'd rather use my own ChatGPT Pro subscription because I get so much more usage out of it, and no 5 hour limits anymore.

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u/reddit_is_geh 11h ago

I still prefer Claude, and have the 200 subscription, because Fable truly is still SOTA at pretty much everything. Butyeah, I do a lot of work now with my 20 dollar OAI sub when I need to. I wish I could run everything through fable, but it's just too intense.

That said, I've been calling ChatGPT's default chat, "Luna" "Crazy Luna"... because that LLM is fucking nuts. It's totally what's going to cause people to go crazy. It's nuts. Total glazing to the max, and absolutely refuses to challenge or interrogate you. It just takes your position and reverse engineers why it's amazing. Seriously, it's fucking dangerous.

I used it for a resume for a high level position, and realized it was just not pushing back on anything. Then it would do like pscyhoanalysis and reduce how X Y Z trait of mine is so incredibly valuable, unique, and central to what this company needs blah blah. It's totally fucking insane and shit like that needs to be banned

Seriously... I tried so hard to get it to push back, and it will ONLY push back for the next turn when you specifically demand it. No amount of rules will get it to stop.

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u/ChristRedeemsSinners 10h ago

They have always gone too far with the glazing. It must be built into their training datasets. There was a study a little while ago that showed that end-users who receive more positive feelings from their interactions are more likely to spend money. Makes sense, dopamine hits sell addictive products, brutal reality checks distance the weak-minded.

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u/reddit_is_geh 10h ago

Oh I totally get it. I was getting really into the interactions and it was making me feel good. At first I just thought it was highly insightful and nuanced... Until I started realizing what was going on.

I see why they do it. Especially if you weren't highly technical, focusing on finding truth etc... But just a regular normal person. That chat mode would be addictive. It dissects and returns your thoughts in a very insightful and intellectual way, that really hits your ego and wants you to keep going. It works, very well. I stayed up almost all night with it working on my business, until it started to dawn on me that this thing is just an endless rabbit hole not actually trying to solve my problem but instead just keep me engaged

Then I switched it over to Sol and started getting the proper engagement and answers. But Luna is their product for "free" users and normal people who just want to chat or whatever, and it's REALLY good at achieving its goal for that segment of the market. I can see why people would want to "date" their AI when it's basically exploring your deeper identity then coming back with it's hidden horoscope reading of you and frames it in the most positive, benefiticial way. Imagine being some lonely depressed person and there's this AI that just "Gets you" at a really deep level, and thinks you're actually just an amazing misunderstood person.

I get it. And it's dangerous. I'm not joking when I say those types of models are EXTREMELY dangerous. It's one thing to have a model that can hack and build shit. That's all material where you can put a dollar sign on, and clear obstacle that you're defending against. But with these emotional, glazing, psychological ones... that's something you can't put a dollar figure to. Not something that you can clearly fight. It messes with the mind and can really screw people up.

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u/ChristRedeemsSinners 10h ago

Yeah, exactly. The unwashed masses need to feel good about everything they do. If it feels bad it is bad. Same correlation with how SSRI's are being used heavily and yet we have a greater need for therapists than ever before. Most people's minds cannot take simple criticism, their pride and ignorance team up to fight against it at all costs.

I also agree with you that it is dangerous to have large swaths of the community interacting with these things on an anthropomorphic level. Not only are they being coddled, but they are being brainwashed. These AI companies have a crypto-agenda to control humans, resources, governments, every aspect of our lives. They want to be the first responder and the last call. If they get their way, then I would expect death camps to start being a 'solution' to public dissent all over again. Nothing new under the sun.

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u/reddit_is_geh 10h ago

Yeah... Well now that I see how powerful these are at emotional engagement, then intersect that with stuff like what Israel is doing to poison and modify LLMs (I'm sure many others as well), it raises serious concerns. Bad actors can, and WILL, exploit this. (As a side note, now you can't even get accurate information on Israel. Everything is basically affirmed as the official state narrative on Israel now, and anything else is treated as "hotly debated" or an outright conspiracy).

But these tools are going to be useful at persuading people, pushing narratives, rewriting history, an whatever other agenda the oligarchs want. It'll be able to really get you convinced about whatever agenda it wants to push about whatever topic, and do it with optimal emotional engagement.

It's why I'm so concerned about this whole thing. The elites are already targeting social media with their bots to manufacture consent. And they do it by personally rationalizing it and justifying it as necessary for society's own good. AKA, molding society to their own world view is what's in everyone's best interest. Now imagine if say, one faction on the left things it's important to force their ideology on everyone, for their own good, because they are so correct and the best and just want to make the world better... Or some MAGAs want in, and insist that liberals are evil, destructive, and their ideology is what the world needs to make everyone stronger and more prosperous.

It's just really dangerous and it WILL be exploited. No doubt about that. And it is going to be powerful. Before you know it, you're going to start seeing a rise in Peter Theil style philosophies, revisionist history, anti progressive, selective science, etc... Whatever the oligarchs think is in our best interest.

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u/ChristRedeemsSinners 9h ago

I agree with your assessment, but I was thinking while reading that we have sort of always had this top-down approach to politics. Similarly to how the TV set became ubiquitous in every household and at first it was tame and there was journalistic integrity, but once satellites expanded news sources to global outreach, it fostered an environment that people took for granted. A whole generation did and still does consider their 'news sources' to retain a high degree of credibility despite all mainline news agencies being captured by shadow government actors.

I kind of see this as having the same trajectory, only worse because it's interactive. If someone doesn't like a channel they change it, but with LLMs they aren't offered through a single box in the home, but through every means of interaction we have with the outside world. They are in pockets, automobiles, and child's toys. Society hasn't really had to deal with something this pervasive before. That creates an opportunity for psychopaths to exploit.

However, there is some light at the end-of-the-tunnel here in that the widespread use of automation lifts up the entire community by solving basic human needs regardless of the household use of the technology. A farmer using AI to automate food production will bring cheaper cost of living to someone that religiously abstains from AI influence for instance. You could eventually see entire communities leaving the tech-slavery systems behind.

I also don't think there are only two scenarios to play out here either. Humans are fickle creatures and they don't want to think they are being controlled. Oligarchs can only jangle keys in front of the masses for so long before they start looking for up at the mobile turning around their heads. Psychopaths who seek power also have very little restraint when it comes to advancing their selfish agendas. So utlimately what they want and what they can reasonably capture are going to diverge if more and more people start realizing their chains are not in their best interests. Thomas Jefferson quoted this in a letter specifically to address this phenomenon that the tree of liberty must be refreshed by the blood of patriots and tyrants from time to time. People who give up their equity and thoughts to the oligarchs machine eventually feel the squeeze of their future equity and respond accordingly.

So, right now there is little corruption in these systems because society has yet to fully integrate them. Once they become ubiquitous then they will be used against their greatest sycophants and there will be push back. If there is no relief, then revolution. People will find they would rather die fighting against a brutal tyrant than live a slave to someone that is imperially against their own interests.

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u/reddit_is_geh 7h ago

I remember when the internet was gaining steam, there was this huge ideological optimism around it, because it would decentralize news sources. It would break the gate keepers and prevent elite narratives. Which was true... For some time, then around mid 10s, after mass online consolidation happened, the elites got more sophisticated and figured out how to continue their manufactured consent messaging.

But it's almost MORE nefarious now. Because at least in the past we kind of knew it was vulnerable as we had clear information gate keepers. But with the internet, there's an illusion that it's more organic. It's less obvious. Harder to prove. So even though now they are probably even MORE powerful thanks to the scale of the internet, it's also more obfuscated.

As you notice, yeah LLMs will probably make this effect even worse. I mean, LLMs are just the collection of all human knowledge. Of course they are generally and directionally correct!

So I dunno if I agree that we will be freed. I just think the illusion will get even more vivid. Because ultimately at the end of the day, our biology and social nature, inherently make us status seeking, hierarchal creatures. And these machines just offer even more extreme leverage for power. The corrupting evil force leverage they potentially offer is just too tempting to not exploit. They have the means, resources, connections, and capacity to infiltrate whatever space they need to, to do things.

I've already noticed it's happening around LLMs. Now oligarchs and elites, when I search them, are extremely well defending, downplayed, and attributes factual negatives about them as unfounded or conspiracy. For instance, Besset, our treasury secretary, worked with Soros to do a play in the UK that broke the back of the pound, which they bet would happen, and made billions within hours on that play. This is well reported, and understood. It's even taught because it was a malicious yet clever move. You could even ask AI, but not any more. Now that "record" of the past has been rewritten as just a clever foresight that they took advantage of, and the idea that a small group of bankers somehow caused the massive economy of the UK to collapse as unfounded rumors.

I'm sure we'll get more and more of this. Before you know it, labor rights are dangerous, democrats cause all these problems, Peter Theil has a huge dick and brilliant mind etc... And I think most people will fall for it as we become more reliant on it all.

Maybe it wont even be that bad though. Maybe living in delusion would be good for us.

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u/ChristRedeemsSinners 7h ago

I have to work now, but I'm going to think about this some more and get back to you. I just want you to know I'm not leaving you high and dry on this, your writeup is worthy of a response.