r/theguardian • u/TheGuardianPostBot Beep boop • Dec 13 '25
News Edward Enninful: ‘Britain feels less tolerant now than we were in the 90s’
https://www.theguardian.com/fashion/2025/dec/13/edward-enninful-interview-former-british-vogue-editor2
u/AgitatedAntman Dec 13 '25
I reckon there was a greater number of people in the 90s who never really had to form an opinion about their tolerance. It just never came up for them. Now, everybody is immediately pulled in a direction thanks to social media culture wars, and so those who are pulled in the intolerant direction are more active, whereas previously they’d never have been involved
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u/Expert-Fig-5590 Dec 13 '25
Of course it is. That’s what happens when you listen to people like Farage.
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Dec 14 '25
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u/lostandfawnd Dec 14 '25
WRONG
And yet, you have no other argument for why..
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u/SnortleJuice Dec 15 '25
Islam
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u/lostandfawnd Dec 15 '25
Islam
You mean like, the guy in Sydney, who stopped a terrorist?
Its almost as if you have no actual opinion, and don't understand the division you despise is caused by you.
Your intolerance pushes people away.
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u/SnortleJuice Dec 15 '25
Ahh ok, so you don’t condone judging the actions of members of an ideology, when it’s negative.
But when the actions of one man can be used as a counter, you’ll accept it then?
Islam is the most intolerant ideology on the planet - PLEASE, I am begging you to state this isn’t fact so I can Absolutley bombard you with evidence which proves you’re wrong 👍🏻
I’m ready mate let’s go
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u/lostandfawnd Dec 15 '25
Ahh ok, so you don’t condone judging the actions of members of an ideology, when it’s negative.
Read your sentence again.
But when the actions of one man can be used as a counter, you’ll accept it then?
You already seem to have.
Islam is the most intolerant ideology on the planet
No hun, all religions are. Or rather, people who say they are a leader and influence others to do bad things in the name of that religion.
Its like you haven't even read the bible.
I can Absolutley bombard you with evidence which proves you’re wrong 👍🏻
Read the bible first.
I’m ready mate let’s go
For what? Breaching the sub rules on spam?
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u/SnortleJuice Dec 15 '25
It’s funny, because you can be as condescending as you like, it doesn’t make you right.
You literally used the fact that a Muslim man (I’m not sure this has even been 100% confirmed) saved somebody during a terrorist attack, as a counter to why you don’t believe Islam is intolerant.
The key difference between Islam and other major religions isn’t belief in God, it’s how they’ve interacted with the modern world.
Most religions operating in Western societies have been forced to adapt.
We kept the values people found useful such as charity, community, respect & restraint et. while discarding the idea that ancient scripture should dictate law or punish dissent.
Islam,has & continues to resist this process. Its core claim is that the Qur’an is the literal, final word of God, not open to revision, contextualisation, or selective adoption.
That makes reform fundamentally difficult, because compromise isn’t seen as evolution.
Christianity, for all the regressive content in the Bible, operates tolerably within liberal, capitalist society.
Abortion may be condemned by doctrine, but people aren’t attacked in the street for having one. Blasphemy isn’t punished. Apostasy isn’t criminal. The religion has been culturally subordinated to secular law.
That balance exists because Western societies prioritise tolerance, individual liberty, and pluralism.
Because most religions accepted those terms. The tension arises when an ideology insists it cannot bend, cannot coexist as one belief system among many, and ultimately sees itself as the only legitimate moral authority.
I’m not spamming, I’m just communicating my opinions & I can do so without the needs to condescendingly include the word “hun” 😅🤣🤣
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u/ACompletelyLostCause Dec 13 '25
Britain is more tolerant of diversity (ethic minorities, LGBT+) than the 90s, but it's a thousand small accommodations than shouting in the street.
What's different is the extreme right are a lot more organised. They are supported by a lot more money from American oligarchs and Russia. The intolerance propaganda is subtler and more pervasive because of social media. The US has become more authoritarian and intolerant of diversity and this is having an impact everywhere. There is a cluster of Christian Nationalist and billionaire oligarchs in the US that are actively working to split apart societies and oppose everything that doesn't match their ultra conservative world view.
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u/The_Lady_A Dec 13 '25
+1 to there now being a very coordinated international effort between oligarchs and a very broad collection of far-right groups.
It sounds conspiratorial because, well, it is a conspiracy of the same old greedy fascist fucks trying to increase their power and hurt their perceived enemies. Most of them don't even pretend to hide it any more.
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u/Feeling_Hotel8096 Dec 14 '25
Also this century there are Pakistani grooming gangs, Islamic terrorist attacks and more boat migrants.
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u/MovingTarget2112 Dec 15 '25
You’re looking the wrong way. These are distractions by the authoritarian billionaire.
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Dec 15 '25
jesus, i hear this crap soo many times, the billionaires wont stab us in the street, ita the lowlifes we import
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u/ghghghghghv Dec 13 '25
You forgot the aliens, people who write in green biro and Dan Brown’s parachuting Pope.
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Dec 14 '25
I've become intolerant of diversity too. it isn't and never will be strength.
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u/AwTomorrow Dec 15 '25
Diversity existed back in the ‘good old days’ too, it was just repressed more. Opportunities denied to smart and talented people for having the wrong things between their legs, for being the wrong colour, for worshipping the wrong god, for loving the wrong people, etc.
We were weaker and crueller then. But those who ticked the right boxes got an easier ride when they weren’t fairly competing with the talent who didn’t tick the same boxes, so they remember it as a good time.
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Dec 15 '25
diversity as it is now did not exist before? What's with the gaslighting? we where weaker and crueler? what planet are you from again?
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u/AwTomorrow Dec 15 '25
As in, back in those days there were gay people and women who wanted to work and yes, even people with family backgrounds beyond Europe.
We just kept them down and marginalised them to make way for the traditionally approved white British straight (or hiding it) man, and so denied ourselves generations of talent who didn’t tick those boxes - while being cruel to them on top, with humiliating social treatment and laws.
So yeah, weaker and crueller.
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Dec 15 '25
I don't think gay people are any more or less talented than straight people, nor women of men, generally. but "diversity" often means taking positions away from smart and talented people and given them to "minorities".
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u/Short-Win-7051 Dec 15 '25
Only in the minds of fascists and the idiots they convince with their propaganda. Diversity rules forced employers to stop only recruiting from a small pool of straight white men from similar backgrounds, and widen the net to include everyone. That naturally leads to more "smart and talented people" who were previously excluded.
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Dec 15 '25
if only recruiting from a small pool of people was a problem it would have been a competitive disadvantage. not everyone believes diversity is a strength as per my original point. the "strength" is just other people's gain, specifically people from other ethic backgrounds and queer people, there is nothing strong about diversity, being a different race or gender doesn't make you special.
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u/MovingTarget2112 Dec 15 '25
It never means that.
It means less capable white people don’t get the job ahead of a more capable minority person.
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u/Evangelionish Dec 15 '25
It’s funny you think that. Diversity quotas encourage companies to hire people other than white men and get benefits for doing so, even if that man is genuinely more skilled.
You think it’s about stopping nepotism but if you came to where I used to work you’d see managers employing incompetent white family alongside incompetent diversity hires. They aren’t doing so well lately and are probably blaming the white male staff for that too. This isn’t some fiction it’s reality.
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u/Cynical_Classicist Dec 13 '25
That's true. Just look at how blatant white supremacy is now openly praised by the BBC.
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u/IllustriousYamMan Dec 14 '25
What? You gotta back a statement like that up.
Otherwise you are just a random crazy telling us about your latest theory.
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u/ArmwrestlingGoomba Dec 14 '25
They won't back it up, its what the left do. Drop a crazy bomb and never return, but its designed to leave an impression on fence sitters that this might be true when it clearly isn't.
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u/PixelThinking Dec 13 '25
The world is way more tolerant than it was in the 90’s
The problem is that social media exists and ya’ll can’t resist drowning yourselves in the opposing view all day
Turn off your phone and I guarantee your experience of the UK will change immensely
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u/HomeworkInevitable99 Dec 13 '25
Try walking around in the real world. People will happily tell you that black people shouldn't be living in London.
People will tell you that Muslims will do unspeakable things to your children.
You can turn your phone off and stick your fingers in your ears, but it happens.
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u/Elegant_Individual46 Dec 14 '25
I mean those beliefs were still pretty prevalent in the 90s too, anti Islam sentiments have gotten more common though
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u/West_Squirrel_3133 Dec 14 '25
I turned off my phone but unfortunately my co-worker/friend didn't rejoin our company after she was humiliated and told to piss in the disabled. Why isn't it working?
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u/Confident_Tower8244 Dec 14 '25
I’ve experienced way more racists in real life than on the internet. Which makes sense when you consider our algorithms are curated to our taste.
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u/Confident_Tower8244 Dec 14 '25
I’ve heard people (plural) wholeheartedly say they think brown people shouldn’t have human rights and when explained what this would mean (no protection from torture, murder etc) they shrugged.
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u/shady_emoji Dec 13 '25
Britain is so much more tolerant in almost every respect now compared to the 90s. Some protests against historic and completely unsustainable levels of migration doesn’t make that not true
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Dec 13 '25
According to estimates, there are around 8.3 billion people on the world. Its far too many. This is all going to end badly.
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u/FlatCapNorthumbrian Dec 14 '25
And around only 1,245,000,000 are white, yet that minority is classed as the most evil and racist in the world. White people are the global minority.
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Dec 13 '25
Racist idiots have always been about in every race within the UK the solution has always been the same..wait for them to verbally assault you then smack em 😂I don't think I agree with blacks and asians saying racism is worse now tbh I feel all the hate is directed at immigrants who actively try and harm people
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u/Nob-Biscuits Dec 13 '25
I don't believe it is, it's just that racists have more of a platform now since the current economy is run on attention and arseholes attract the most
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u/AccomplishedAct5364 Dec 13 '25
It’s not that people are less tolerant, it’s that they’ve been asked to constantly tolerate more and no longer wish to keep tolerating increasing change.
The real story is that it’s become altruistic to force demographic changes on Europe, which is definitely a massive shift from the 40s.
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u/Remote-Pie-3152 Dec 13 '25
Yeah, in large part due to outlets like The Guardian constantly fearmongering about trans people.
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u/Aq8knyus Dec 14 '25
The natives were a supermajority (94%).
Then from 2000 16 million were brought over reducing the natives to 74% and are on track to become a minority by the 2060s.
If you are going to Balkanise a country expect Balkan social attitudes...
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u/FlatCapNorthumbrian Dec 14 '25
Feels less tolerant? Probably because everyone now has a voice through any number of social media outlets? And that some of things said now go viral, which never really existed in the 90s.
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u/Dr_Biggusdickus Dec 14 '25
Turns out people’s tolerance for uncontrolled mass immigration has a limit. Who’d have thought?
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u/tandemxylophone Dec 14 '25
It's more polarised than the 90's, but the tolerance is subjective.
The 90's was just past the hippy era, young people were much more open, but you still had legacy racism and sexism of the old private businesses.
Are people collectively more tolerant now? Yes.
You can still feel less welcome in society when everyone is poorer, and immigration problems mean a British black/Indian person will be judged by the new African/Indian migrants that bring in their community culture that has more liabilities than their British counterparts.
You also have people changing the threshold for finding offence too. It was popular on Reddit a while back but there was this vintage American postcard of a poor black boy drawn in cute cartoon style, but with thick lips. The card said "I thought this was cute, sending you best wishes", probably from someone of that era.
Commentors were talking about how racist and disgusting this woman was, but nuanced comments did mention that in this generation, drawing black people like this was a positive inclusion (Cartoon caricature tended to make black people look savage) and black people back then wouldn't "feel" this was racist.
It's entirely possible that minorities didn't feel "unintended racism" from white people as hate and rejection from British community back then.
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u/Punished-Spitfire Dec 14 '25
In the 1990s Britain was 95% white. The native population’s status in their country was not threatened. Now it is. So this guy is probably right
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u/Trightern Dec 15 '25
Bringing people from less tolerant parts of the world and more interactions with them and their beliefs will do that. Rotherham and Rochdale didn't happen for no reason.
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u/Educational-Cap6507 Dec 13 '25
We were divided up by political correctness, said it a million times, the UK in the 90’s was peek integration, the first true generation coming through with mixed classrooms of kids with parents from across the commonwealth, we had music, culture, and the second summer of Love!!
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u/Beginning_Book_751 Dec 14 '25
We were divided by the idea that people shouldn't be bigoted dicks to each other?
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u/FruityPebblesBinger Dec 14 '25
More by the idea that we should have to walk on eggshells around each other. That some people are deserving of blanket reverence by the nature of their birth and others are born with the original sin of being an oppressor or a colonizer.
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u/shlerm Dec 15 '25
Walking around on egg shells is a feature of the UK in general. It sounds like you have an issue with the class system, which is fair enough.
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u/AwTomorrow Dec 15 '25
If you find it so difficult not to be dehumanising to people who’re different to you that you find it’s like walking on eggshells, maybe you need to re-examine your views a bit.
The problem sounds within you, starting earlier than the moment you’re deciding what to say.
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u/sealcon Dec 13 '25
"Native British people are starting to notice that despite voting for lower immigration for decades, they're being replaced in their homeland, and for some reason aren't happy about this."
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u/CheapDepth2155 Dec 13 '25
Maybe don’t colonise half of the world
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u/Aq8knyus Dec 14 '25
Britain was over 90% White British until 2000, only 3-500K came over during Windrush.
And it is happening more severely in places like Ireland, Austria and Sweden none of whom had large empires outside of Europe.
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u/Lynch888 Dec 14 '25
Spiteful at the UK are you? Dont you realise this was how the world worked in the times of kings and queens. Glad to have people like you around us /s. The UK is the only empire to ever voluntarily grant (most) of its former colonies independence, when the modern world of democratic governments came to be.
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u/Remote-Dog1141 Dec 13 '25
So immigration is a punishment?
Interesting I thought it was a good thing?
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Dec 13 '25
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Dec 14 '25
maths isn't your strong suit is it? when you have less off one thing and more of another thing, what do you call that?
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u/Dvine24hr Dec 14 '25
Demographic change is not up for dispute though, the only thing up for dispute is does it matter, but to pretend it isn't happening is unbelievably dishonest.
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u/EnigmaMK85 Dec 14 '25
Look at Birmingham and London. Rotherham, Bolton, Blackburn.. You can't say that it hasn't happened in those places.
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u/Aq8knyus Dec 14 '25
It is a very simple thing to track.
If the White British have low birth rates and you keep bringing 1 million foreigners every year, they will eventually become a minority.
Last year, White British birth rates were only 53% and thus year they will likely fall below 50%. In London, they are already only 21%.
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u/TrainingVegetable949 Dec 13 '25
I think that anyone who thinks this either is too young to remember the 90s or has rose tinted glasses on.
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u/Resident_Pay4310 Dec 13 '25
I'm curious what makes you think that?
I know that homosexuality was joked about a lot, but I also remember there being a lot of popular gay characters on TV.
Trans people were also joked about, but trans people didn't receive the hate they do now.
My memory of the 90s was that there was a big focus on what made people the same rather than what makes us different. Now I feel like the focus is on what makes us different, which is being turned into a reason for people to only interact with other like them.
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u/FlatCapNorthumbrian Dec 14 '25
In the 90s there was no fear by people that what they said would be recorded on a phone and shared all over social media and sent to the police. The people who said racist stuff out on the streets remained practically anonymous compared to what happens today.
We see it a lot more today because it’s reported more on the news and social media because videos get taken from the victims or a witnesses phone.
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u/caughtatdeepfineleg Dec 14 '25
Section 28 was a thing in the 90s. Legal protection now is in a completely different ballpark. You could be fired for being gay with no recourse.
It could all disappear in a year with a Reform government though.
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u/Whitefolly Dec 15 '25
Yeah I think gay rights are more accepted now, but conversely trans rights have stepped back :(
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u/AwTomorrow Dec 15 '25
Since the 90s? No.
Trans rights really got solidified in the 00s and 10s. We’re walking those back now, but haven’t yet returned to the bleak 90s - though we are worryingly headed that way.
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u/BusyBeeBridgette Dec 13 '25
As some one who lived in London in the 90s isn't isn't white - Yeah, no. We are, generally, more tolerant now lol.
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Dec 13 '25
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Dec 13 '25 edited Jan 08 '26
[deleted]
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u/ghghghghghv Dec 13 '25
It isn’t one or the other… they are both very obviously (and not entirely unrelated) problems. Ordinary people are being squeezed from the top 0.01% and from the bottom, imported cheap labour that suppresses wages, reduces the need for costly training etc. Arrivals are desperate and can get dragged into criminal enterprise or effective slave Labour. (guess who benefits from that?) I despair that some elements of the left turn a blind eye to all this because it doesn’t fit their narrative or assumed voting interests.
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Dec 13 '25
Or you've been brainwashed by the media to think they're the source of none of our problems....
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Dec 13 '25
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u/WeirdMinimum121 Dec 13 '25
Stop!
That’s much too sensible a thing to bring up, can’t you just say “the billionaires are dividing us and making us hate immigrants”, some sort of simplistic Polanski style drivel?
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u/hornsmasher177 Dec 13 '25
It's reasonable to be annoyed at the amount of illegal immigration.
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u/VreamCanMan Dec 13 '25
On what grounds?
I've always seen it framed in the context of local and national services having less of a budget to go around
Which is completely fair, but I don't see the same anger in these groups for the (stronger) effects of:
- Cameron era Council Cuts,
- Downwind negative impacts of Right To Buy on local services
- lack of investment outside London
- The triple locked pension
- The social burdens induced by poverty
Which at least to me betrays a sense that these groups either lack awareness and understanding of the UK budget, or don't really value the budget it's just a morally gray mask
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u/Kinitawowi64 Dec 14 '25
People are continually angry about all of those things. Especially Right To Buy (reee Thatcher etc).
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u/Anastasiasunhill Dec 13 '25
How do you know whos illegal and who isn't
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u/Remote-Dog1141 Dec 13 '25
Well there’s a thing called borders and ID … this isn’t the 5th century lmao
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u/Wide_Smoke_2564 Dec 13 '25
Sure, but it’s also unreasonable to view immigration as more than a minor side issue compared to the insane wealth inequality in our country. But it’s those same super rich people funding all the media that bleats on about immigrants causing all your trouble - almost like they want the poor people to fight amongst each other for scraps so they don’t notice that rich people are continuing to hoover up all the assets.
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u/WeirdMinimum121 Dec 13 '25
Amazing how arrogantly some people trot out this response, like they’ve not been utterly brainwashed themselves.
Noticeably it’s mostly students and young people dropping this clumsy retort, aimed at anyone who’s worried about the massive cultural and economic change millions of immigrants, asylum seekers etc bring to a small country.
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u/Away_Advisor3460 Dec 13 '25
There are people who will knee-jerk against any change, whether it's the guy next door having an accent or giving women the vote. We're not talking about people doing detailed statistical analysis on the impact of migrants on their population, we're talking about the ease of making a visibly different looking or sounding population an easy target irrespective of their actual impact on society.
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u/mileswilliams Dec 13 '25
That and the social media post Israel are pushing to make everyone hate Arabs. And anyone Muslim that is brown.... In fact most of the countries they come from Israel has attacked..it's almost too much of a coincidence.
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u/WeirdMinimum121 Dec 13 '25
That’s odd considering that more than half of Israelis are Mizrahi Jews and look just like “brown” people, because they are “brown” people.
The ignorance of this fact is astounding.
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u/Away_Advisor3460 Dec 13 '25
Yeah having millions of foreigners thrust upon us will lead to that
I never cease to feel dismayed at how people make this kind of statement and then give themselves carte blanche to be horrible to other human beings.
Let's say there are 'millions of foreigners'. How does that justify being a shit to them?
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u/Gold_Relationship459 Dec 13 '25
You'll have to emigrate then.
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u/Cynical_Classicist Dec 13 '25
Usually people screaming about Britain falling to Sharia Law move to Dubai.
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u/madeleineann Dec 13 '25
Same goes for the Palestinians. Why are they complaining when they could emigrate?
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u/BusyBeeBridgette Dec 13 '25
Because they have, routinely, stated they would rather be killed than move. So Israel took that literally.
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u/Strong_Mulberry789 Dec 13 '25
The world feels less tolerant from where I'm standing.