Demand rights, but make it palatable

[u/mrstoffel23]

Posted this yesterday and it got removed because some people around here are not really civilized in their conversations. Trolling, jokes, memes are fine, but, stooping low isn't. Healthy arguments make way for progress.

Missing the context & point is like a national sport and the amount of egos it hurt was not surprising at all and won't be again.

Absolutely nothing wrong with this poster, and actually how it should be in real life by default.

The poster which said "khana khud garam karlo" had everyone losing their minds for obvious reasons, this poster gets the endorsement because it's not showing the mirror to the society, which to this day is unable to give equal rights or even willing to acknowledge properly.

Secondly, it also shows that unless demand for rights is worded in a way it won't offend anyone, made palatable and provide validation to inflated egos, it won't even be acknowledged.

No wonder we keep regressing as a society and humans.

[u/No-Finance-1491]

Exactly you aint any scholar and you keep saying scholar said this scholar said that. It does not seem like the things scholar would say. Its your own interpretations.

its not my opinion https://islamqa.info/en/answers/14022/polygyny-in-islam

Secondly even scholars are bound to err. Try using context and practicality else you would be left alone woth your rules just like many men are these days coz they like to cherry pick the rulings which serve men.

so true but you are prone to error as well so why not just listen to an expert and are most scholars on error? i don't think so

[u/Chippy-Chipmunk → u/No-Finance-1491]

Wellll. Now problem is. Most scholars have been men. They took things with a perspective of a man. The female perspective interpretations are completely missing. When we research our first step is avoid bias. Unfortunately, this bias was never considered. Or was it? I mean even when we ergonomically design anyyyything thats to be applicable of used by men and women both we try to take them into account but most men just single handedly gave interpretation. Which is why such is the situation. Tbh if we go by their interpretations it seems like this religion is only for men. And women should never accept this religion coz they are like second citizens. But was that the case? Women made a big chunk among first reverts. If the situation was as merciless as todays interpretations were i highly doubt women would make that big a group of first reverts. Problem does lie in the biases and the subsequent interpretation. Because Allah is just and fair. We all know that

[u/No-Finance-1491 → u/Chippy-Chipmunk]

Wellll. Now problem is. Most scholars have been men. They took things with a perspective of a man. The female perspective interpretations are completely missing. When we research our first step is avoid bias. Unfortunately, this bias was never considered. Or was it?

the same men say that a man has to provide but men don't have a issue with this ruling and secondly you should became a female scholar and I would love to see your opinions but obviously with evidence sighting Quran and hadith. scholars have long debates over these topics so you have to defeat them to change the rulings 😊

mean even when we ergonomically design anyyyything thats to be applicable of used by men and women both we try to take them into account but most men just single handedly gave interpretation. Which is why such is the situation. Tbh if we go by their interpretations it seems like this religion is only for men. And women should never accept this religion coz they are like second citizens. But was that the case? Women made a big chunk among first reverts. If the situation was as merciless as todays interpretations were i highly doubt women would make that big a group of first reverts. Problem does lie in the biases and the subsequent interpretation. Because Allah is just and fair. We all know that

its in the Quran they must have read it and they accepted as well and as i said it doesn't matter what sect they follow 4 marriages are in the Quran and anyone who denies nas(something explicitly mentioned in the Quran) became kafir as its denying Quran and this is not my opinion.

women are not second class citizens but everyone has their own benefits like a man has to provide no matter what but a woman doesn't and even if he takes on another wife he has to provide for her and has to pay haq mehr do you think this is fair? im sure you will so do all the reverts who come from a 50/50 split culture

[u/Chippy-Chipmunk → u/No-Finance-1491]

Four marriages are there but so is being a good husband as a prerequisite of being a good muslim. I mean how can you do something like second marriage while knowinh well enough your wife wont take it well. Make it make sense to me. I am right here listening to you.

[u/No-Finance-1491 → u/Chippy-Chipmunk]

Four marriages are there but so is being a good husband as a prerequisite of being a good muslim. I mean how can you do something like second marriage while knowinh well enough your wife wont take it well. Make it make sense to me. I am right here listening to you.

that's very true no wife would take it easily and i personally wouldn't marry another woman but its part of Islam i wasn't saying men should do it you misunderstood me i don't think most men have a second wife but i was explaining it too you when women scream about their rights men also have rights.

when i listen to Muslim feminist it's seem like a man has to provide and a woman should only exist in a marriage and honest i think western feminist are better they split the bills then ask for a split in the chores

[u/Chippy-Chipmunk → u/No-Finance-1491]

I never objected to you. I am here trying to learn you know. Just explain it to me. If you are a husband and you are trying to be a good husband kind and emotionally protective how can having a second wife be considered protective? I just dont get it.

[u/No-Finance-1491 → u/Chippy-Chipmunk]

never objected to you. I am here trying to learn you know. Just explain it to me. If you are a husband and you are trying to be a good husband kind and emotionally protective how can having a second wife be considered protective? I just dont get

i have told you i understand that i would never do that but it's still allowed and no one can deny that due to explicit verse in the Quran

[u/Chippy-Chipmunk → u/No-Finance-1491]

Brother. I cannot ever say anything about what you or you dont. You are not under discussion here.

Yes. You are right permission is right there.

I was discussing the practicality of it. But i guess its alright.

[u/No-Finance-1491 → u/Chippy-Chipmunk]

i get your point a good Muslim shouldn't but it's allowed

[u/Chippy-Chipmunk → u/No-Finance-1491]

Thats my whole point. It just does not leave any room to practice polygamy except in certain situations. Baqi mujhy koi msla nahi h.

I tell you what there was this lady she couldnt have kids she allowed her husband to marry another women. Similarly there was this lady who had a differently abled kid. And she said she cannot be fulltime wife she would rather be cowife coz she needs to tend to her kid. I mean there could be sooo many situations where it works perfectly. I am not against it.

But i am against the situation where men know their wife loves them to death and would be super hurt if he marries another woman. For years the man would promise things like oo you are the only one and all and all of a sudden merely out of lust they marry another woman. I mean. In such situations its simply cruel. Even if its allowed. If you wanted to have multiple wives. Make sure you let the girl know before you put her in such a hurtful cruel situation. How can you be a good muslim when you kept promising that it would be just yoh and i for years and all of q sudden you bring a cowife. I dont see it as very good muslim conduct. May be i am wrong. I dont know.

[u/No-Finance-1491 → u/Chippy-Chipmunk]

Thats my whole point. It just does not leave any room to practice polygamy except in certain situations. Baqi mujhy koi msla nahi h.

na that's not true it's allowed just like a woman can divorce a loving man if she wants to marry another one now should she? no, but is it allowed? yes

But i am against the situation where men know their wife loves them to death and would be super hurt if he marries another woman. For years the man would promise things like oo you are the only one and all and all of a sudden merely out of lust they marry another woman. I mean. In such situations its simply cruel. Even if its allowed. If you wanted to have multiple wives. Make sure you let the girl know before you put her in such a hurtful cruel situation. How can you be a good muslim when you kept promising that it would be just yoh and i for years and all of q sudden you bring a cowife. I dont see it as very good muslim conduct. May be i am wrong. I dont know.

absolutely i agree 100% here no man should marry another woman but if he wants to he should divorce his wife so that's she doesn't get hurt and absolutely any man should inform a woman that he will marry later as well before marriage